Main Entry: 1pro·por·tion Pronunciation: pr&-'por-sh&n Function: noun Etymology: Middle English proporcion, from Anglo-French, from Latin proportion-, proportio, from pro for + portion-, portio portion -- 1 : harmonious relation of parts to each other or to the whole : [SIZE=-1]BALANCE[/SIZE], [SIZE=-1]SYMMETRY[/SIZE] So I was reading Ryans post on the JJ's 11th anniversary, and I came across how he found out what proportion is. I found myself soon intrigued: how is proportion perceived as pertaining to automobiles? What does it take to get perfect proportions? Is it raking the front an inch and eleven/sixteenths? Is it chopping the top of a Model A Coupe 4 5/8" up front and 4 3/16" out back? Is it deciding that the windshield doesn't flow with the rag top and making another from scratch? Now this question could be directed directly at Ryan and how he "found" proportion , but I would like everyone to chime in with how they measure/assess/plan/contemplate/derive proportion pertaining to automobiles. I know proportion is looking at the whole picture, but I am more concerned with how you came up with your idea to section a 5/8" strip of metal out of the body of your shoebox to get it to sit "right".
I've been thinking about doing a write up on the subject from a design point of view, it's a very subjective ...uh... subject, but there are ways to check/test your design if you're not one of those guys who has it naturally hardwired into his brain. It's really kindof cool once you study it for a while, the human brain has a way of telling us what's right and what's off.
I know its a tough question with no definite answer: like asking asking Jackson Pollock why he scribbled all over his paper..... Guess I am just trying to get my abstract juices flowing for another project....
It IS a very subjective subject. Everyone has a different idea of perfect proportions. Example: "Those two coupes are almost perfect, if they were channeled..."
true! ask Leonardo Da Vinci That's what I'm talking about though, there are shapes, forms and ratios in nature that our mind relates to better than others.
Check this out http://jwilson.coe.uga.edu/EMT669/Student.Folders/Frietag.Mark/Homepage/Goldenratio/goldenratio.html Mike
I had no idea there was a formula for that... For me, a car has the right proportions if no one part or detail jumps out at you, the first time you look at it. If your eye gets drawn at the amount of Chop, or how far the axle is in front of the grille, or anything like that, then thats the part that is not proportioned to the rest of the car. That is why the Chrisman Coupe, the Don Williams Coupe, and the Buttera 3W are my favorite Hot Rods. I " borrowed " from all three of them when I built my Roadster....
Good point on the "Golden Ratio".... I will see if I can find examples in some of our favorite rods.... T'would be interesting to make a car with a much "golden ratio" in it as possible.
I'm not sure if I can see something like this reduced to numbers. For me it's standing back, looking at it, and moving stuff around untill it looks right. And just incase it wasn't already clear, I'm not compairing my Roadster to the other 3 Cars. I'm just saying what was on my mind when I built it...
I'm in the middle of reading GM's history from 1919-1964 as written by Al Sloan; there's a whole chapter on Styling. Turns out Harley Earl was employed by a custom coachbuilder in California B4 Sloan hired him away and started the Art and Color Section of GM in '27; so...he was kind of a gut proportion guy before driving vehicle design. Anyway, according to Harley, he spent over 30 years of his career making the American car longer and lower, because the human eye prefers oblong shapes over square ones. To prove his point once, he had a group of senior execs sit in a auditorium while the body of a Cadillac was removed, the frame Z'd three inches, and the body reinstalled by a large team of fabricators... Think Overhaulin' - live. the visual of a buncha suits inna auditorium watching as a brand new caddy is channeled is amazing... He had the execs vote on the car - before vs. after. The decision was unanimous; the car did indeed look 100% better lower. Proportion.
I don't believe proportion can be broken down in numbers. Personally, I think it's something that lives and breathes through a combination of factors that aren't really tactile so to speak. In my mind, a car with perfect proportions is a car that is so tightly focused on form and function that there is no doubt of its purpose. Harmony. Tune. Tempo. Shit... even when I write it doesn't make much sense. You know it when you see it.
when i look at a car....if any "one" thing stands out...then to me its out of proportion your eye should be able to blur over and you'll still see the same mental image as if you see it crystal clear little doo-dad's and slight imperfections in a flowing line throw it off... your can really can be too low too raked too level its all opinion based but it truely can be "wrong" a 1/4 inch is a mile if its in the wrong direction Zach
my thought; ,,i think measurments as small as 1/2 an inch can make a big difference in porportions when it comes to things such as ride height,top chop .etc.. then again...measurments are helpfull,,but the eye is the best tool.,
I agree with both of you (Alex and Ryan) when it comes to the act of creating. I don't picture really gifted people picking up a ruler for every cut or tweak. Right is right. And to stand back to look at the result - knowing it's "right" - then start comparing proportions and numbers you get some really neat results. Not the rule or formula for sure, but definite parallels and there is plenty of correlation with aesthetics and that number.
its funny how fibonacci works into when things look right sometimes i look at something and think it looks a tad off then if you relay it into that ratio....it seems that if taken closer to the ratio it would look more correct sometimes you have to make it "wrong"(by the book) to be "right"(pleasing to the eye) ***such as the dawg on hood line of a 29 on 32 rails!***
Yeah, there is really no formula for it, but there are certain things that make more sense to the eye than others.... That car looks like Rosie O'Donell (sp?) ok, so .0001% of the population gets off on that, whereas most people would consider the cars that metalshapes shows to be close to right. Why? The brain responds to certain things, and if you really dig down, I think some of those things can be quantified in some way, that's what really interests me. I've seen people who were "taught" to be better designers than they started, some people have the gift, but that doesn't mean that others have no hope. The HAMB is deep today
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