History History- Some Know it, Some Think They Know It!

It make perfect sense to me that, before an engine gets designated for production to and for the masses, that there was prototypes and pre-production engines for R and D and racing. The article posted earlier make that point. As far as what is allowed in a pre 65 car show or on the HAMB is another story.


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Don't forget the Studebaker Hawks, (1956) basically a Champion with a V8 stuffed in it. (and some tailfins riveted on the fenders)
I was 11 years old in 1963, but remember the "Mystery Motor" as a drag engine, goes to show what memories are good for!

 

Stock Car is two words vice one. Ron

 

1917 & 1903

 

I'm not real proficient in studebakers,
Wasn't the champion a full size or their large care line?

 

Let's not forget that half of the people are below average.

 

The Champion was the little car they came out with in 1939, They used a really little engine in it, 164? cubic inches.

 

My point is being missed.
It is not when the big block Chevy came out or what the first muscle car was.
The point of this thread is that some are so focused on just a small part of this hobby weather, it is hot rods, stock cars, drag racing ect, that they miss the over all picture.
The innovations, craftsmanship and history in the other parts of the hobby are being over looked.
I am not a British sports car guy however I had a great talk this summer with a man that owns a vintage Jag. He gave me a good lesson in British sports cars, I listened if he said something that did not sound right I asked questions. I did not argue or dig in me heels. The man with the Jag did not know about the BlueFlame Chevrolet six I explained what I knew about the engine and it's history. We both walk away with more knowledge, which is what I am always looking for.

@seabeecmc I have much respect for you and your skill, please don't think I don't.
I was simply using our meeting as an example of painting a part of the hobby based on a handful of poorly built cars.
Please note I spelled stock car as two words, my high school English teacher told me it was one word.

 

A most interesting thread.Thank you all for posting.
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo

 

The sharing of knowledge and automotive history was the first thing I noticed way back when I joined the HAMB. What good is all the stuff in file cabinets and imbedded in your brain if you can't share it.

Bob

 

I corrected the spelling of Smokey's name the auto correct computer kicked in on that one, I should have checked my work.

 

A lot more than that.

 

I won a T shirt at a cruise night for knowing the Chevy V8 one, I had to prove I didn't look it up on my phone. Which was very easy with a flip phone.

 

I won a T shirt from a local radio station "Car Talk" program. Question was what are Dagmar's?....... A car manufactured in Hagerstown, Maryland 1922-23, correct answer but not the common one they were thinking of. Bob

 

The further we get away from the events, the more likely the biases of authors of early versions will finally be tossed into the trash can. A good example, is WWII. The whole history of WWII was changed by the disclosure of the work done to break the German Enigma code and Hitler's special machine called Lorenz code. The knowledge of these broken cyphers changes every major battle in Europe and the Pacific.
I read a lot of history, and the best way to look at any event is to look at from the point of view that nothing is cast in concrete.
Bob

 

There's history and then there's history! The history of the big block Chevy is important to some people and not so much for others. There are at least four or five excellent hard cover books on the high performance industry and then there are books on individuals and companies in the industry that are written with a "spin" to make every body look good.

The best history is the history you make!

 

I like the 2 bozos on the stage at BJ in Scottsdale saying you had your choice of metal or wood bed in a 59 Chev short stepside...Fleetside yes , stepside ? a new one on me. Also the he 63 Chevy ll's with stock V8's never saw one of those either. 64 yes 63 no.....but I'm old with 1/2zimers

 

Are you referring to that unsuccessful one vs the successful one? And what did Ford do when that successful one was on the horizon? "Why" they came out with something new as well.

 

The chassis of the 10 Pins car in 1960- Note Four torsion bar car

 

There is no overall picture. IMO

Caught some British slang also.

Does it really matter? Have fun.

 

Sometimes I have to jump in!
Robert,
You are a breath of fresh air in the strange world
of your generation!
Keep up loving the history... and digging it out
for many!

Here is a 1956 Studebaker Golden Hawk I rescued from
oblivion a few years ago.
It has a 352 Packard engine, (factory)
I read somewhere it was the fastest and quickest American
production car in 1956. Over the Corvette and the Chrysler 300B!
Maybe someone knows for sure!

 

History is only as accurate as those who record it. When it is retold, it's not uncommon for people to change it, maybe subconsciously, maybe on purpose. Sometimes people just forget or get their facts wrong. Even those who record history make mistakes. In today's digital world, mistakes should happen less and less as their are cameras and recording devices everywhere. But how many times do you see a news item reported totally wrong? It happens all the time. There will always be those that play with the facts to suit themselves or their causes, you just have to verify your sources. As one of the Presidents said, "Trust, but verify".

 

I don't under stand your point.
To me the fun is learning the history and passing it on. If you don't know why cars were built in particular way or how a part was made when you try to build a car that matches a era you are very likely to miss the mark.
How did we get from Model T's with O.V.H. conversions to the Ford Flathead? Why move on to the early overhead valve V8's and the small block Chevy?
How come that guy built a tube chassis in 1960 with four torsion bars?

Hot Rod and the little books are great sources, but there were hundreds maybe thousands of cars built and only a few of them made print. Very rarely did an oval track car make print. So basing all history on what was in magazines only gives a very limited view of what was done.

The point of this thread is to make people think about history! Why we built the cars we do, cars that use obsolete engines and running gear! Go over to that old stock car that, look it over study it may not use crude pile of junk like the one that ran in your part of the country! Don't use assume the guy with the small block Chevy in his car did it because he was lazy and didn't want the "hassle" of a flathead! Maybe he was cloning the car he remember as a kid.

 

Look up Chadwick ... they were running blowers on the street before the 'teens.

 

I have a friend that owns the 57 supercharged version of this car with the McCulloch blower, and it was reported to be faster, even though it was the smaller Studebaker engine.
My favourite Stude for styling was the 53

 

J-Jock,
'53 is also my fav, but I would be happy to have the one
in your pic in my garage! Those Stude's were beautiful cars!
BTW, there was also a dealer installed option in '56
on the Packard engine, for a supercharger,
The factory would not support it.

 

No you don't.

Why? It's fun. For the most part that is all that matters.

My 56 Pontiac will have a 69 Pontiac rear end (well it does have a 69 pontiac rear end). If you think it's important to point that out to me, I'll ignore you and then tell you to eff off, if you persist.

 

for the japs it started in 1931 when they invaded china....

 

I'm pretty sure Corvettes aren't the center of many peoples' universe here, or Chevy's in general but here is one that had this Chevy guy scratching his head when he finally let it sink in that he didn't know everything.
I use to sit around the break table at work with 4 or 5 guys that for the most part got along pretty well and agreed on most things (except politics).
There was one guy that seemed no matter the subject he had some bit of information that either the rest didn't agree on or had never heard of.
So one day were sitting there talking Chevys, Corvettes, etc. a rare occasion as it was usually hunting and fishing which was fine because I could take a nap during those discussions.
Anyway Mr. know it all pipes up and says "the first Corvette was made out of steel", well that woke me up for sure, but I had learned that arguing with this guy was fruitless so I just put it ouf of my mind, that is until many years later (thanks to the internet) I discover he was right (this one time).
Just when you think you know it all...................

 

If NASCAR was allowing an engine or any other component, the manufacturer had to have produced 1500 units and those had to be available to the general public. A wealth of knowledge about GM and their involvement with NASCAR can be found in Smokey Yunick's book titled "Best Damn Garage in Town", which is still available from his daughter, Trish.