i lived in va. during there time . great ford peeps . also had a '57 chevy , the one with the gold trim , on blocks with like 10 miles on it .............. steve
hey tom - no worries - you're not slowing anything down . if you have ANY questions , just ask . if i can help , i'll be glad to do so - and i'm sure everyone else [including you ] will do the same . that lincoln engine was 430 C.I. , and was a member of the MEL family - which stood foe MERCURY-EDSEL-LINCOLN [ the MEL family was introduced in '58- the first year for the edsel , in which it was offered at 383 and 410 cubes ]. the FE was also introed in '58 at 332 and 352 cubes . it later went to 361 [ in the edsel] , 390 , 406 , 410 [ for 1 or 2 years in mercs ] 427 , and 428 . i believe it was offered in trucks in another displacement , also . FE originally stood for FORD-EDSEL , but after the edsel's demise with the '60 model , ford changed the meaning to simply FORD ENGINE . just a quick note on the MEL : it was somewhat unique - at least in the ford family - as it's combustion chambers were in the block , rather than in the head , as is typical of most modern engines . this is prob. more info than you wanted - or you already knew it . anyway , i hope i've helped a bit .
hey kevin - well , it looks like a carter to me . it also looks like it's made of aluminum . and it's surely a 4-barrel . so i'm guessing that's a carter A-luminum F-our B-arrel . but that's just my guess . this was near the start of the can-am series , which began in 1966 . i think most cars were running small blocks at that time [ tho i'm not sure] . i do know , however , that gurney won either the first or the second ever can-am race with a small block ford . it was also the ONLY can-am race ever won by a ford . IIRC, gurney had ford cast some special blocks for him - i believe with a taller deck , so they could be stroked . i believe the displacement was somewhere between 330 and 352 cubes , but i don't like to depend on my memory much anymore . also , i don't know if the "honker" had one of gurney's enlarged blocks or not . but i'm almost sure that it always ran a small block i don't think gurney ever went to a big block ford , as he later "defected" to the chevy camp . however , lother motchenbacher [ now i MUST have spelled that wrong ! ] drove a 427 ford powered car ; and mario drove the "429er" , which was an aluminum boss block out to 494 C.I. however , a ford never won another can-am race . ford's problem was not a lack of power , but rather they had to struggle with last year's chassis . bruce mc laren had by far the best chassis in the series [ that's why his cars won most of the races ] , and he was getting his engines from those flint guys [ who weren't in racing ] . he would develop a new and much improved chassis every year , , then sell last year's chassis design to other teams . ford tried to buy his most current chassis , but it was said that chevrolet - who "were not in racing" , but were giving mc laren aluminum big block racing engines - would not let him sell them to ford . can-am was one of the very few places where ford did not have much success .
a couple of pix of mario in the "429er" . this was , IIRC , 1969 . a couple of years later , dyno don nicholson got a hold of one of these 494 aluminum block monsters and put it in one of his "mountain motor" exhibition pro stock fords . i guess it'll come as no surprise that he did pretty well with it .
Thank you kindly Jack. That is exactly what I wanted to know, but I'm afraid to ask on these large history threads like this one. I can remember some of this history, but I was very young then, and a lot of gray cells have been deleted in the years since. Thanx to all; Tom S. in Tn.
Tried to post on a holman/moody Jackson injection some time back. Post got deleted...guess I didn't know the rules about posting. Anyway, there was a new in the box jackson injection with all the paper work, lines,nozzels, original shipping box to HM. Was on craigslist here in the nw. I think it went for 3 grand...Speedway motors museum wound up with it after I contacted them...sure wish I would have had the dough for it...it was coooolllll!
hi tom - we're members of the same club . getting older - and OLD - is no fun . but like my father used to say , "it's better than the alternative" . and now he's taken the "alternative" . we grew up in a unique time ; a time that will never happen again . we were the first generation to grow up with television , for instance . and the cars - my favorite subject - were so much better then - in so many ways . at the very least they all had personality and "character" then . and what are they now ? they run better , for sure . but they've got the personality of a kitchen stove . i would not want to be a kid growing up today , if that was an alternative . the one thing we do have are memories , and i love sharing mine [ the good ones , anyway ] with anyone who'll listen . i hope you'll feel more free to share yours , as well . jack
A personal aside here regarding the 494 & plus alum. block,,in '97, I was working in a machine shop in Charlotte owned by Lee Willyard, an alumnus of H-M, and a good friend of Lee Holman, for whom we often did some work. I O- ringed a block for copper wire around the cylinders. , I easily lifted it up on a mill table. This motor was going into a CAN-AM restoration.
Lothar Motschenbacher! I thought I was the only person who remembered him. I remember seeing him crash coming out of "thunder valley" at the Can-Am race at Mid-Ohio one year. This was the time of open faced helmets and he cracked his head on something. His face was covered with blood when he got out of the car and collapsed on the ground. I don't think he was hurt real bad, just shaken up. I think I was only 9 or 10 years old then and this is how I remember it. It may have been later than that because McLaren was already gone and Peter Revson was driving the second car behind Denny Hulme. I miss those days and the cars. Built by men with balls who just thought it up and did it. Cars built to win by craftsmen who were short on college degrees and long on brains, ingenuity and skill. Cars with heart and soul. Unfortunately, you're right Jack, we'll never see another time like that. Kevin.
#436; " I miss those days and the cars. Built by men with balls who just thought it up and did it. Cars built to win by craftsmen who were short on college degrees and long on brains, ingenuity and skill. Cars with heart and soul. Unfortunately, you're right Jack, we'll never see another time like that. Kevin. " I've said this before; There is nothing that even closely resembles auto racing anywhere today. Tom S. in Tn.
Here are the two '63 Galaxie Lightweights Phil Bonner had his name on in the '63 season. One was sponsored by Al Means Ford in Atlanta where Bonner was a salesman. The other was sponsored by Lafayette Ford in Fayetteville North Carolina who also sponsored Lorenzens Stock Car. Fred drove the Galaxie Lightweight in a few drag race match races I have heard.
Shelby had a Can-Am McLaren also, powered by an aluminum 427 Ford, driven by Peter Revson. He won a Group 7 race in Japan with it.
many thanx to claymore for posting these pix for me . we just couldn't work it out where i could convert these "bitmap" pix to "jpeg" so i could post them . it might be my computer , but more likely it's the denseness between my ears . anyway , these color pix are over half a century old, and yet i feel like i could walk right into some of them and talk to these guys . notice the cromwell helmet tim is wearing in the last pic . and that shirt he's wearing is from 2 years previous . it's the team shirt from bill stroppe's mercury team . tim won the 1957 daytona convertible race in one of "the boss' " [ stroppe's ] "big Ms" .
hi fuzzy - now that you mention it , i do remember something about shelby's can-am car . wasn't it called the "lonestar" , or something like that ? but i don't remember reading anything about the car "back in the day" . i think it was only recently that i'd read / heard about it . was it possibly offered for sale at barrett jackson's in recent years ? in any case , i don't think it was successful at all . and didn't shelby have another can-am car ?
thanx again , claymore . the first pic shows lee petty in the oldsmobubble racing johnny beauchamp late in the daytona 500 . both had run relatively conservatively through the early part of the race , and so had rubber left at the end- while others had dropped out . they exchanged the lead several times thru the last several laps , with petty winning in a photo finish . there were no caution flags throughout the race . can you imagine that happening today ? the second pic shows banjo mathews' t-bird at the '59 southern 500 . notice his sponsor . banjo crashed halfway thru the race , finishing 31st.
thanx again , claymore . i also want to thank HEMIMAN for the tim flock t-bird photos . funny story about tom pistone , and i believe it happened at this first daytona 500 . as most of you know , there's a huge , man-made lake inside the backstretch of the daytona speedway . it's called lake lloyd , and it was formed when the builders dug the dirt , sand , and whatever out of it to build up the banked turns . in one of the early races a car flew off the backstretch and into the lake . naturally , "tiger tom" was aware of this , and it scared him half to death , as he could not swim . so for the following race , pistone added some "optional at extra cost" equipment to his car ...something that in all likelihood no other race driver has ever carried in his race car . yes , "TIGER" tom put a scuba tank in his car . i guess cats really don't like water .
and once again , thank you very much for posting these pix for me , claymore . and you beat me to it , as i was going to say "hey , did anyone notice that car is purple ??" yes , that's the "honker II" . the first pic shows it in recent years , after it's restoration . the second pic was taken at riverside in 1967 . like the ford P68 prototype , if looks counted for anything , those cars should've won a bunch of races . unfortunately it doesn't ...and they didn't . jack
---------------------------------. After seeing those pics, I now hanker for a Honker! Mart3406 =======================
Ok boys, explain the "maybe" in the description of the modern picture. Does it mean so "extensively restored" that it's authenticity is questionable? I love a good car story, tell us this one, please. Kevin
hi kevin - i was wondering if this would come up . the answer is simple - and really kind of lame . when i download or upload [ what IS the proper term ? ] a photo into my computer , i caption them so i'll know where to find them when i want them . the computer only allows me a very few words for the caption , and certain punctuation marks cannot be used [ question marks , quotation marks , etc.] - i have no idea why . when i first down / uploaded the first honker pic that mart 3406 is hankering for , i wasn't totally sure that was a period pic or an "as restored" pic , so , not being able to use a question mark in my caption , i used "maybe" . i hadn't been noticing [DUH !] that these captions were showing up under the posted pix , but i did notice this one , and wondered if anyone would ask what that "maybe" meant . anyway , that's my story , and i'm sticking to it ... at least until i can come up with a better one . NOTE : i'm 95 percent sure that first pic is from recent times . that's the way it was originally described , and , if you'll notice the people in the background , you'll probably realize that few people dressed that way in pits or paddocks of the 1960's . jack
Damn, Jack. I was hoping for a story about how it was found under a rock in Cleveland in an old lady's garden or something. I was thinking "extensively restored" along the lines of one of the Thompson TBolts. So the Honker II is authentic, correct? I got ya. Computers are just like every other piece of equipment, you have to resist the urge to beat them flat with a sledge hammer when they refuse to cooperate and do as directed. Kevin
Quote:. NOTE : i'm 95 percent sure that first pic is from recent times . that's the way it was originally described , and , if you'll notice the people in the background , you'll probably realize that few people dressed that way in pits or paddocks of the 1960's . If you'll notice, the tires are Hoosiers . Definitely recent times !!
Quote: now that you mention it , i do remember something about shelby's can-am car . wasn't it called the "lonestar" , or something like that ? but i don't remember reading anything about the car "back in the day" . i think it was only recently that i'd read / heard about it . was it possibly offered for sale at barrett jackson's in recent years ? in any case , i don't think it was successful at all . and didn't shelby have another can-am car ? The Lonestar was an Italian built prototype for Shelby that never saw a racetrack. Poor design and construction relegated it to the back of a warehouse for many years until U.S.Customs came calling, demanding back tariffs and penalties for not paying up front.(Brought into the country under bond for testing,and that it must be shipped back out of the country.) Shelby was forced to destroy the car in lieu of a large payment to Uncle. This is Revson in the Shelby 427 Ford McLaren:
This is a replica of the '67 Daytona 500 winner. The real car wound up as Darrell Waltrip's first quality ride back in the day after H&M had rebodied it as a '68-'69 Cyclone. Waltrip later rebodied the car himself as a '70-'71 Cycoine. DW located the car several years ago and restored it to his '70-'71 Terminal Transport race trim. As far as I know he still owns it today.
The Jalopy Journal
