Hot Rods How much is enough???????

Well starting to finalise the build plan for the next A coupe but I keep getting carried away with how much motor I REALLY need. I look at the price of a 300hp 350 SBC and think, "Hmmmmm not much more $ and I can have a 383, then I think for a little more I can have a 450hp 383.... and on wards etc.

I really just want to spend my $ once so am looking for a little advice from all you guys.

The car is a Model A coupe, Chopped 4", channeled 4", Z'd front 4" and z'd back 12", 28" tall rear tyres (not sure on ****** or diff ratio??? ) will be mainly used as a cruiser as I'm sterring away from going after salt and strip glory

Would hope it could run in the high 12s, but still be comfortable at 70 mph and not be a gas pig. Now I'd prefer it had a nice lumpy lope but must be nicely mannered in the traffic. Need it safe enough for friends to drive and not put into a pole. Am I asking too much???? All opinions appreciated, even the "buy a flathead" etc as they are always good for a laugh Thanks guys.

 

I used to drive one of the two seat late models (read, stockcar) at the racetrack I worked at and they were running somewhere around 300 to 350 horses and i have to say they scared the **** out of alomst everyone that we took for a ride. And those ****ers were heavy, well over 3,000 pounds with all the extra saftey stuff and extra cage for a second person as well as the p***enger themselves. I'm guessing your "A" will be much lighter! We had a lot of gear in them to run on the track and the clutchless jerico trans helped a lot but still, 300+ horsepower is alot more push than people think it really is! That being said, it's a hotrod, can you ever really have too much?!

 

get a 350, throw on an edelbrock carb, a 270 grind cam, and a shiny aircleaner.


Lump and go!

 

How much you want is usually directly proportional to how deep your pockets are, not how much you really need.

 

"If some is good, then more is better, and too much is just enough!"

 

will be mainly used as a cruiser

300 hp 350 will do fine. I know guys that built bad *** motors that don't drive their cars. The more HP the more problems!

 

Hell, a healthy 283 would be "enough", but it'd be hard to get in the 12's!

 

I had the same decision to make on my A. I have gotten carried away before with over motoring a car, it is fun for awhile. Gets old pretty quick if you really want to drive the car. For my sedan I bought the 260hp 350 gm crate motor. 700r4 with a 9 inch with 4.11 gears and a locker. From a stoplight its a blast! Gets 19mpg on cruises, doesnt load up, no fouling plugs in traffic etc. I guess that means Im getting old.

 

I wuz gonna say, enough motor to keep up with traffic, but since it's a hot rod . . . and you'd hate to be embarr***ed by one of the Yuppie Zoom Mobiles running the Belch-Fire V8 with 180 CID and a 14,000 rpm redline.


Anyhoo, a 327 or 350 in modest state of tune and slightly lumpy cam ought to do it.

My pal ran a 327 that came out of a donor sedan in his full-fendered 29 A Roadster.
It was cleaned up, painted red, got a cam, Performer intake, 600 cfm Edelbrock, block huggers and one of those whiny gear drives.

Ran pretty hard and as far as I know he never had a prob with the rice burners or sauerkraut gang.

Best of all, a big block with some serious cubic inches, mild cam etc. - kind of a sleeper motor in a not-so-sleeper car.

Half throttle kills em.


And here's the serious part.
Regardless of engine chosen it's probably gonna be more than most have ever driven.

Take note of their mash the throttle and hang in there till the mini-motor gets their econo-box up to speed technique.

Put them behind the wheel of a car with quick responding engine that just requires a little throttle pressure to get rolling vs smashing the pedal and they'll have your car into a brick wall or worse in no time.


A co-worker wanted to drive my 32, but I told him no.
He was a throttle masher par supremo and the car would have been totalled before he got out of the parking lot.
Not to mention he'd had three rice-burner wrecks in the previous two years.


So what I'm saying here, either engineer the throttle linkage/ratio's so that half throttle on the pedal gives you maybe 1/8 throttle at the carb or turn down most people who want to drive the car.


I taught Sweetie how to drive the quick responding 462" BB Buick engined 32 roadster and it was an interesting time.

Specially so in front of the gang at the muffler shop.
She had the car aimed crooked after backing out onto the two-laner, floored it, tires went up in smoke, she drove out of it, but it scared me a touch.

Ok . . . more than a touch.

The gang at the muffler shop loved it....

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And the co-worker?

A couple of years after I retired I spotted him in traffic driving a 60 Corvette roadster with 4-speed.

He was doing ok, but the car had a couple of primer spots on the front fenders.

Go figure....

 

Engine power should be in proportion to ball size

 

Anything worth doing is worth doing to excess...

 

More is not always better. If you are really building a cruiser then you already have your answer. Once you go past the 383 you're just buying worse manners, worse mileage (which matters more and more the longer you own a car) and higher maintenance. Personally I'd go for the 300hp 350 but I'm not the one looking to get into the 12s.

 

A 355 HP ZZ4 engine will scare the POO out of you ... in a light Model A.

I had a 345 HP ZZZ crate engine in my 32 roadster. Then I went crazy and bought a 430 HP crate engine. It is a little quicker but the mileage suffered by about 5 MPG.

And there's no real place to use the 430 HP ...

If I had it to do all over again ... I would just use a ZZ4/355 HP.




Yes, I know ...
I installed a 430 HP engine in the 3W also ...
But I already had it ...

 

Thanks guys, really appreciate the input. ZZ4 sounds like an interesting compromise. Preume its a vortex so would have to hunt up some decent rocker covers etc..

 

I'm with the majority on this one. It has been my experience that anything over 350hp is excess unless you're planning on drag racing it often. That much power in a light weight car like that will be plenty of fun for most of us. I overbuilt a couple of cars before I figured that out and am trying to not do it again so maybe I'm really just writing this post to myself!

 

my 69 truck has 400hp 396 and turbo 400, 3:73 gears and 4200lbs and it will lite the tires at will and 0-60 in 7- seconds,, its quick,, also drove a 29 roadster 300hp 350 and it was scarry fast,, in my 29 roadster l'm putting in a 325hp 327 and 700R4 with 3:25 gears,, so l guess the real answer is,,how brave do ya feel. (at 150 l get not so brave hahaha)

thanks...later

 

You could step on up to the FastBurn 385 Crate Engine 350CI/385HP with Aluminum Vortec Heads part number 12496769

http://www.crateenginedepot.com/sto...ith-Aluminum-Vortec-Heads-12496769-P21C2.aspx



They come with the Fast Burn heads ( which takes both styles of Chevrolet valve covers. The old standby covers ( like these )



or the newer center bolt style

 

gotta love a tri shield big block, and the odd looks they get with the hood open

 

I have a 350 that gave 353 hp on the dyno. With a stick and 2,90 something in the rearend it fealls silly fast. I havn´t timed it so i don´t know anything about that. With the skinny rear tires they light up on 1, 2 and 3. It is a bit of a paine cruising around slowly with but i have got used to it now.


Would i do it again? Next time i would probaly go for less..

 

Don't know 'bout all these crate motor options, do know that a pair of camel humps bolted on a dished piston 350 with a solid cam pulled my '55 around for 2 1/2 years and never was beat, but the old street race scene ain't what it used to be! The general consensus was low 13's in a 3000# car, high 12's with a little bit of model airplane fuel mixed in with 5 gallons of regular.

I've been planning my next build; about 2700#/ 301 cubes / ported camel humps / fairly mild solid cam / ten and a quater compression / three dueces / T-5 / 3.73:1 posi. Only thing missing is the intake, oh; and the fun part, building the old *** truck! Actually expecting fairly decent mileage on this one, maybe even 20 on the road.

 

In the words of Roy and HG "too much is never enough"
Just kidding Pete,it's definately a balancing act for personal preference.

 

Go big and push the pedal less.

 

Thanks again, guys. Think I have saved myself some $$ and trouble .....

 

Here's my advice, quit looking at 350s and 383s.

Plunk down the extra hundy or two to start with a 400. Build/buy it with run of the mill parts and a cam around 230 duration and 480 lift. You'll make 50 hp more than a comparable 350 but more importantly it'll be pushing 430/440 ft-lbs.

Best of both worlds. Simple, low buck engine. Good street manners and instant tire frying power at all RPM while remaining reliable.

Much like other things, once you go 400 you don't go back

Good luck

 

I'm probably not the right person to ask but I have always believed that 375-400 horse is a good number for a healthy streeter. Might be a bit much in a car as light as an A coupe.

400 horse should put you into the 11s easy if you can make it hook and or are able to drive it. This is not a slam BTW. I was running high elevens in the later 90s with 406 hp in a 2800 lb car. But my money was spent on suspension and gearing not on the engine.

Can't tell you if it would be safe for your friends to drive. I don't know your friends.

 

Im with Shifty on this one......man its so easy to make HP/TQ with a SBC it aint funny....cheap as all hell too.

My pick?

Build as many cubic inches in a SBC as you can afford (400 x .030" over) cam it with a nice juice cam or even a juice roller if ya want more effieciency/TQ, 9.5-10.1 CR with hyper or cast slugs, a 5.5-6K redline, a nice 6x2 or (4x2 with larger carbs - forget a single 4 BBL, this IS a hot rod right, you have the CI to run em) intake, a set of decent Dart heads that will feed the cubes and still look stock, 4-5 speed and gear it accordingly. Hell you could even run ported 2.5" rams horns and a good dual 2.5" exhaust and she'll still breathe real nice and look correct.

Bottom line, because of the CI, it will be lo maintenance, last forever and a day, have a ****load of TQ in a LIGHT car like your A,be scary fast, be CHEAP to build and STILL look like a 283 as all the HP/TQ making goodies will be inside the engine....cam, cubes, CR, heads.....

Best of all, you can dress it out with early parts to look like an early 283 if youre creative.

Wimpy or modern looking, alum headed, centre bolt cover crate engine - forget it in an open A hotrod!!

Rat

 

The K-B rocker covers with "BUICK" cast in are highly visible through the louvered hood side panels.


Kinda makes em wonder....


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Got a set of TA's cast aluminum rocker covers for the other Buick engined roadster.
Not sure if I'm gonna paint em black or polish up the BUICK letters.

 

Trick is - in my opinion - to build a big block with very mild cam, good ignition, headers optional if you have good flowing manifolds, a single big four barrel and end up with a mellow running engine in a light car that has good manners and hauls the freight when necessary,.

2400# and 462" does it for me....

 

Sounds like a highboy that may end up @ 2500-2600# with an SBC and T-350.


A couple of real-world gennie 32 highboy roadsters I ran into at Famoso; both ran SBC, one had a 327 and I'm fairly sure the other did too.
T-350's, Ford 9" - unknown gears - big wide slicks, headers and somewhat mild engines - very street-able in other words.

Both of them ran 112 mph and in the mid-high 12's.

After running my pal's aforementioned 327 powered full fendered 29 roadster through the gears pretty hard, even with street tires it would probably have cranked off mid-high 13's @`100-102 mph.

What you may want to do here is to run the car with a good running donor or junkyard engine at first, iron out some bugs then build the serious engine.

You can probably get your $$ back when you peddle the old engine....

 

2800 lb car 4.11 open axle T-5 351W, small cam, alum heads 205 int 1.60 exh. 750 holley single pumper, ram air hood, long tube headers slicks. This set up ran 12.44 spining through first gear. runs 12.14 with 4.57 locker should run 12.00 with 4.30 locker. Nice on the interstate with the 4.11's about 2800 rpm in 5th.