Technical HOW TO protect the bare metal around the hole caused by installing a pop rivet

Good Afternoon,

I am installed rust patch on the inner fender /wheelhouse, I dont know how to weld so i have to resort to pop rivets.

I plan on rustpainting the metal patches, but I am concerned about the bare metal caused by installing the pop rivet.

Should I

a) paint the hole with two coats of POR15?

b) put a dab of body panel adhesive and then pop rivet it?

It's a 1/8 hole.

Thank you for your time!

 

Small paint brush, dab some paint in the hole, shove the rivet in and pop it. Not ragging on you but what do you mean, you don't weld? No place around to learn or nobody you know has a welder? Too bad you're not close to me 'cause I'd have you putting down a pretty bead in about 30 minutes, assuming you can see, that is.

 

Oh my. I sure hope you don’t have a lot of body patches if you’re riveting.
I really think it time to learn to weld. I was doing certified pressure vessel welding at your age. You have a whole lifetime to build a car. It’s time to learn the skills right now.
Is that really the type of work you want on your car?
It’s obvious this is not just a daily driver if your worried about rust. You need to worry more about pop rivets failing and the incursion of moisture along seams.

 

I’ve done that for years, too. I’ve used old thickened paint from cans or jars in unseen places, but for painted surfaces I use those touch-up paint tubes with the brush in the cap and a closely matched color. I do this around all holes: for bolts, revnuts, rivets and even grommets.

 

Here in Ottawa people are selfish, they dont like helping others.

 

You're 100% right.

But guess what I dont have the luxury of a driveway ( I Live in an apartment ), and I am an office boy, and fluxcore welding is too hot for 22ga metal.

Elaborate on rivets failing and moisture along the seams please

 

Fluxcore is perfect for thin sheet metal.
I use it quite often.
Your workspace doesn’t relate to your needed skills. If you can climb into a wheel well to rivet you can crawl under there and weld.
Movement and vibration will loosen a rivet joint.
Moisture along the edges of your overlapped sheet metal will penetrate into the exposed edges of the metal and begin rusting.

 

I’ve been there before (needing to weld) in an apartment complex. Unsure of Ottawa but not allowed in the complexes I lived in. Plus, even a suitcase welder, which would work, may cause issues with vehicle location to proximity of where it can be plugged into.
If you’re allowed the use of cordless tools, maybe a cordless grinder with a cutting wheel, clean area with a different stone/disc, then use panel adhesive. Then spray around and on it. Won’t have any exposed seams then.

 

If you can identify with Budget36 predicament. Take your tools and car to a car repair shop. Not the chain stores but a mom and pop shop.
Offer them money to use a parking space on concrete to do your repair.
Odds are they may even provide a lift and jackstands.

 

Never welded in my life before.

Why cant I just put a dab of paint in the hole method as detailed above?

 

It's not the location that matters, there is a bloke who let's me use his driveway.

 

Dude, I'm 78 years old and been welding for over 60 of those years. I supported a family by welding and taught 3 of my sons and one daughter how. Right now, all I hear from you are excuses as to why you can't learn to do it the right way. You can do it your way but here's the thing, you've got a box with tools in it, right? Take the time to learn to weld and you've got one more tool in your box that you can always rely on. You've got both a college and a vo-tech school there in Ottawa, call them up and see what they have to offer. You don't have to have the most expensive equipment, you just have to be able to use what you do have efficiently. It takes practice, lots of practice. You can't strike an arc once and call yourself a welder. If you find you enjoy being able to make that little blue spark do what you want it to, you'll progress to other forms of welding.

 

It might seem that nobody is really listening to you but it's the opposite.

If your going to this much trouble to fix a panel they'd, me included, would rather see you weld the panel in and have a repair that would last you along time.

We hate to see people use rivets because they don't usually last very long before they start causing problems then all the hard work you went thru is wasted. And usually what happens the person becomes bummed out and doesn't repair the new damage and all the effort they put into it previously is lost due to rivet failure.

Rivets can cause several problems, rust is just one. The rivets can loosen up and start breaking out any bondo on top of them, they can bulge the bondo also or if rust starts then the rust starts breaking and releasing the bondo.

If, worst case scenario, there is no way to have it welded then I would use metal structural adhesive as stated above. Less chance of failure, rust etc over rivets.

Again the guys above are just trying to save you some possible heartache and disappointment a year or so down the road.

.

 

Pick up a cheap 110 mig welder and some fluxcore wire. Practice on some scrap metal you be welding in no time just dont burn your car up. Stich weld it in start in one corner and move around so you dont warp the panel you will be fine.

 

I started off using acetylene when I learned to weld,,,, I still use it from time to time but getting hard to find good clothes hangers for filler rod....

 

I’d glue it before I’d rivet it.
But if you’re gonna work on cars ya need to expand skills as needed.
I couldn’t weld when I stared messing with cars. I glued patches or used fiberglass.
Then I enrolled in a trade school program

 

At 34 yrs old, your life has a lot of living and learning to do.
Dont be shy trying a new skill.
I too wish I was nearby, I’d have you burning your skin and getting that patch in in no time.

 

Start a new thread looking for a friend/mentor in the area. How far away is stogy? I went to work in my Uncle’s bodyshop after high school and on weekends. Developed some skills/bad habits there, maybe you have something in the area. Do your makeshift repair and start developing a network. Go to a car show and ask around some old guys, most of them growl, but not all of them bite.

 

If you are serious about this hobby, I suggest you move away from Ottawa and go to a part of Canada where housing is affordable you that you can have a house with a garage to work in. Very affordable in small town Alberta.

 

Make your patches, drill two holes to establish position, use 3M sealer between the surfaces, put two pop rivets in, then drill and rivet the remaining locations with stainless or aluminum rivets, 1/4". Paint with truck bed liner spray. I have over a thousand of them in my floorboards. Waterproof welding thin metal is rather difficult. I did it this way due to heavy undercoating, and I didn't need to take the chance of a fire.

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/p/d/b40066967/

And get a drill operated pop riveter.
https://www.amazon.com/DEKOPRO-Cord...9Y2xpY2tSZWRpcmVjdCZkb05vdExvZ0NsaWNrPXRydWU=

You will be dead and gone before you get any leaks or failures .

 

It isn't optimal IMO but 25 years ago I panel flanged and used 3M panel bond to attach the lower rear quarters on my 442. I drilled and used screws to hold it while it cured then removed the hardware. Finished it inside and out, body/paint.

Still own it, same paint job, still on there, no rust. Like you I had no power to run a welder in the little garage I rented, so we do what we must.

 

Hi there,

How snug does the patch panel have to fit?

https://imgur.com/a/qGCswhx

I am planning on panelbonding and then screwing in tiny screw taps.

Thank you.

 

Hi there,

How snug does the patch panel have to fit?

https://imgur.com/a/qGCswhx

I am planning on panelbonding and then screwing in tiny screw taps.

Thank you.

 

Hi there,

How snug does the patch panel have to fit?



https://imgur.com/a/qGCswhx

I am planning on panelbonding and then screwing in tiny screw taps.

Thank you.

 

Not a bad idea

 

Pop rivet some sheet metal in there for your rough shape then use fiberglass resin and fiberglass cloth for strength. Finish with short strand fiberglass filler. All the items mentioned can be purchased/are stocked at Canadian Tire and the work can easily be done in a borrowed driveway or a parking lot. As for worrying about the tiny hole from the rivets ... don't. Cover the mess with fiberglass resin and moisture won't be able to get there.

If you need a hole filler, TimBits are actually the holes from donuts. Great pie hole fillers they are

 

This day and age, the panel bond is an amazing development. Before I could weld, I did a lot of riveting. The stainless rivets hold up better then the aluminum rivets, but sometimes they are harder to pull tight. I did the body putty thing over top of the seams and painted it all. That repair lasts maybe a year, then cracks in the filler will developed between where the two pieces overlap. Fiberglass and fiberglass resin will last a bit longer and will seal the mess better then the body filler would, but the panel bond would be way better.

The rivet job made the truck survive long enough for me to learn welding skills. it wasn't pretty before I learned to weld, and it wasn't pretty after I learned to weld, but the body putty filled seams on the welded patches lasted a lot longer then the rivet job did.

Welding is a great skill to learn, but not everyone can do it, nor should everyone do it. Fact is, many people shouldn't be allowed near a welder.

The process I would probably try these days would be to clean up the over lap area, step flange the old metal, trim the patch panel to fit nicely, the apply the panel bond. I would run a few self tapping screws into the overlapping flanged area to be sure the two panels were tight against each other, wipe off the excess panel bond the squeezed out, and let it all set up for how ever long it takes for the panel bond to cure. The panel bond has a learning curve as well, understanding how it works before you begin is a good plan. Then do the body filler and paint.

Welding is a great skill to learn. There are things on cars that just has to be welded. But there are also safety procedures that have to be followed so things don't catch on fire, and it takes time to learn the needed welding skills, especially with thin gauge sheet metal. Flux core wire is among the worst stuff out there to try to learn how to weld sheet metal with, and trying to learn to do that with a cheap 110 volt welder is bad advice. Most cheap 110 volt welders doesn't have enough power to burn the flux core before the sheet metal melts away. An 75/25 Argon/CO2 mixed welding gas and a gas regulator are almost a requirement with the cheap 110 welders.

 

It appears to fit just fine. Can you flange the body panel so the patch lies flush? At least for the most part? Other wise that is a lot of mils of bondo to properly work that patch for paint

 

Good Afternoon ,


https://imgur.com/a/jiPVXJ6

The top of this metal patch (red circle ), the edge is slightly high; it wont bend (as much as I hammered it ), but when I clamp it down its flat flush, so can I just clamp it down and then put in a screw tap?

The blue circle, shows how I bent the metal patch around the original inner fender, I am wondering whether I should cut it or just put the outer skin over it?

BONUS QUESTION: For the self tapping screws should I use washers?

Thanks and have a great day!

 

Good Afternoon ,


https://imgur.com/a/jiPVXJ6

The top of this metal patch (red circle ), the edge is slightly high; it wont bend (as much as I hammered it ), but when I clamp it down its flat flush, so can I just clamp it down and then put in a screw tap?

The blue circle, shows how I bent the metal patch around the original inner fender, I am wondering whether I should cut it or just put the outer skin over it?

BONUS QUESTION: For the self tapping screws should I use washers?

Thanks and have a great day!