Fellow members good afternoon. Here's the message i sent to Joe Hunt Magneto regarding problems i encountered lately. I didn't get any answers yet so if someone could give me hint of solution to fix this, that would be most appreciated. Mister Hunt good evening. I’m writing this email because I have an important issue with a mag I purchased a few years ago to get ignition for a 350 Chevrolet stock engine except for a Compcams camshaft very very gentle. it has a 3 x 2 rochester carb kit and that's all. The engine has 4000 miles. I had a standard distributor before i switched for your product. I purchased the mag the 26 th of may 2020, my customer’s order is # 3217. It took me 3 years to complete the rebuilding of my 1932 Ford roadster and was able to restart the engine with success last year. Another few months to finish the project and I started the road test in march 2023. Everything was fine the first 400 miles but during a little trip, the engine shut down, exiting a roundabout. After many attempts, I failed to restart the car. I had sparks at the plugs but the car wouldn’t start again. I had to pull it back to my house. I did a new ignition timing procedure and the car started again but with a timing way different than the first time ?!?! So my first question is what might have caused the first dysfunctioning ? I’m guessing there is a problem with the advance system but i’m not sure…. I drove another 600 miles with no problem after that. The car ran fine until yesterday. I picked up the car at the upholstery factory where they did my tonneau cover and after 10 miles, the engine made a little detonation and shut down again. I had to get back to my house with my buddy’s car to bring back the tools needed for another ignition check and finally found out that this time there was no more spark at the plugs at all. So for the second time, as I was 30 miles from my house, I had to pull the car to a nearby airfield where I knew some people. I dismounted the magneto and found out that teeth on the bronze driving gear were gone !!!!! Mostevall, the condenser looks completely rusted as well as a few washers, the rotor and the 8 contacts in the magneto cap look a bit corroded as well . The car stays in my house heated garage, i don’t drive it when it rains and no water has been able to enter the mag. So what happened to the magneto ? Another thing that seems odd too is that when I firmly hold the gear in hand, i can move the rotor a few degrees. As if something is loose or maybe broken inside the mag. As i don’t have any blueprint of a mag like this, I don't know what it looks like inside and the connection between the various parts. So for now, the mag is dead, i selected the bronze gear to be safe so i guess i’ll have to order a new one but that doesn’t tell me what happens and i don’t want to remount this part and take the risk of breaking loose on the road again. I was to leave tomorrow morning with friend to go to Le Mans Classic, 300 miles from here and my weekend is wasted, my friends will go without me. I lost all the booking and so… Tomorrow a friend will help me with an endoscope so i can check if the camshaft gear is not damaged too. So could you please take a little time to help me solve those issues as i’d like to keep on using this beautiful part but i need something very reliable for my trips. I can’t ship the mag back to you, it will cost too much to do so and we have qualified person here that are able to do what’s needed if i can’t fix it myself, shall i need special tools. You’ll find enclosed pictures of the mag, shall you need anything else, please let me know so i can provide you with it as quickly as possible. Looking forward to reading from you and sorting out this problem. Thanks very much. Best regards. Rod. If anyone know what happened please let me know. That would be so appreciated. Thanks a lot. Rod. A couple of pictures of the rod not fully completed......
I can't comment on your specific problem beyond two points: 1. Depending on your specific cam it may require a bronze mag drive, or may require a melonized steel gear. 2. If the mag has an advance plate you will feel the movement you described. Hope you get it sorted out.
Hope your not using a chrome distributor hold down, those mags take a lot of turning force and can move if not clamped good. Do the points have corrosion?
rod - 1 - What "saltflats" said about the hold down clamp. 2 - Get used to the occasional distributor gear replacement. Are you running a roller cam ? If yes, see above. If no, a standard, cast iron, flat tappet solid or hydraulic cam, swap the gear to a cast iron gear. 3 - Have you checked the point gap ? 4 - Checked all wiring ? Shorts, tight, etc. 4 - The spark plug gap should be no larger than .025", .020" is better. 5 - I seriously doubt that Hunt will get back to you with the option that you gave them. If you can't / won't let them fix it...you're on your own ! The ol liability thing ! Mike
Bronze gears are for steel billet camshafts only. If you have a stock type cam you need a normal gear on the dist....
I’m no help here, just want to say I’m intrigued by the technical advice being shared. I never considered the torque drag of a magneto
Joe Hunt cap's are junk, as you can see. Try to source a good bakelite cap (with brass terminal's) from somewhere (Ebay) and get an iron drive gear. Joe Hunt is a name only, and not the quality of yesteryear. JMO.
I agree with 427sleaper on the Hunt caps being garbage. I had one cross firing on dads hemisphere that only left the garage 2 times. I could actually see arcing on the cap when we were trying to start if to tune the engine. Get yourself a Vertex cap instead. You can see the difference in quality when comparing the two.
Run a hold down & with pinch clamp design. Lot of Problems with modern Brass/Bronze gear since early 2000s, That common wear on bronze/ Brass gear . "Mainly ever wear gear "hold up well , Is it possible yr dampener Outer rig slipping , Are you spinning engine Over a sec or 2 the flip from ground to open on Mag kill switch ?
Hi Eddy. Thanks for the input. here's the holding clamp i used, it does the job pretty well regarding all the crap i had previously. The engine starts fairly well without any special manipulation except a couple kick down to get some fuel from the accelerator pump straight into the manifold.
Yes i think so. dialed in the mag with the buzz box, tightened the nut, checked the advance with the strobelight and thightened the hex nut a bit more then the screw.
I have had that type slip , I cut & folded sand paper set in between clamp & mag housing to give extra Grip, & mark with sharpie,,, Just a thought / extra steps not familiar with Joe hunt,, Make sure shaft not slipping @ advancement plate /rotor button. Some splined , tac weld , pressed .
I'm gonna need a new gear and maybe a new condenser to stay on the safe side, would you recommand any shop ? DonZig, Alkydigger, Magsarus ignition.... or any other i am not thinking of ?
That same gear drives the oil pump too, so running thicker oil than you should puts additional stress on the gear.
Magsarus or Mason Racing Ignition's would be my go to's. Alkydigger sell's Joe Hunt product's and Don Zig is iffy at best. JMO
Yes i've read that oil viscosity might put some more stress on the gear especially if asking to much on the engine when its oil is still cold but i always let it warm well enough just to be respectfull of the mechanic. I'll try to dismount the mag to check the inner components, possible shaft shifting and all but jeeze.... 100 box for a screw driver to unbolt the 4 nuts !!!!!!! I'll try to machine one myself. I'll put pictures of the mag inside.
I highly recommend FIE in Oregon - they've done a few different Vertex mags for me and they give you a complete run-up sheet on the performance of the mag. Fuel Injection Enterprises, LLC 1710 Independence HWY NW Albany, Oregon 97321 Voice & Text: 541-990-2485 As noted, the bronze gear is really considered a "sacrificial" part - it is designed to wear against a steel billet camshaft. If you're not running a steel billet cam core, then it will wear all the faster against a cast-iron core cam. Most likely you need a different material on your drive gear - melonized steel material. From looking at the inside of your mag, sure looks to me like it has had condensation inside of it - you can see it in the cap, the condenser, even in the body itself. Have you washed your engine with the mag in it? Other things to note: You may want to talk to Spud Miller (owner of FIE) about rare-earth magnets. They do not lose their charge over time (like the regular ones do) - so I prefer to run them for longevity. They cost a few bucks, but are a decent investment if your budget allows. I run a Vertex in my 32 Cab - on a flathead . . . love how it starts and runs (over quite a few years). I've been a believer in mags for a long time - they (should) just run and run. We run mags on our Bonneville FlatCAD engine - though we stepped up to a ProMag from a high-output Vertex (Spud built) when we started running alky - it just burns more fuel.
Hello and thanks for your input. it's getting a bit clearer for me as all the infos you guys gave me seem to converge to the same conclusion. I emailed Compcams to get infos on their camshaft material, we'll see ; As for the rust on the condenser, i never washed the car with water nor the inside of the engine compartment so it's a mistery for me. Once i get the answer and succed in disassembling the mag to check the advance mechanism, i'll order the parts. Following are pictures of the oil pump. It has some tiny scratches obviously. I thought about using a very soft jewelery file to get rid of them. Or do you think i should change for a new one ?
I come back to you regarding the infos you gave me. The mag has a 20 degrees advance mechanical plates and is supposed to have rare-earth magnet as well. The mag was bought brand new from Joe Hunt. I'm glad to read that people are still using those mag as they should perform as they are intended too and did so for quite a long time now. I've managed to machine tools to dismount the mag but one nut still doesn't want to come loose, the one just under the rotor when dismounted.....I'll keep on trying tomorrow. Have a good sunday and thanks for your help.
Mags are a special deal,,, like radiator shops specialize in radiators. As mentioned, I would send it to F.I.E. Revise and send your Hunt email to F.I.E. so they have a general idea what's going on....good luck and send it!
Hi mister, thanks for your answer. I emailed Magsarus, Mason, Alky digger and FIE to get their opinion on this issue and the availability of the various parts i will need. I should get answers this coming days. I'd like to send them the mag but i'm afraid it's gonna cost a hell of a lot !!!! Shipping cost exploded and especially international. I'll have to check on that but shipping back and return might be around 200 300 $ plus the overhaul control, somewhere between 200 and 300, plus the worn parts, a gear and a condenser, 80 $ plus the always unexpected.....so that will cost a minimum of 500 to 700 $.... So in that case i'll put back a distributor.....If i can get the parts, i can find a qualified workshop here, i'll evaluate the cost and have it fix...though i'd rather have someone like FIE do the job.
Good evening members. Just a quick word to say that i'm in contact with mr Miller (F.I.E), he gave me explanations regarding the rusty condenser and other infos that are more than valuable to sort this mag issue out. When i have a bit more time i'll share the infos with you, if that helps other members. Have a good day. Regards. Rod
Good afternoon. I have a bit of time so i'll pass on a few informations i got from mr Miller and mr Chaumont, a man specialized in magnetos, maybe the last one in France, who was actually working on a vertex mag for a Type 35 Bugatti. So we all agree that the gear has gone dead because off the cast camshaft, i shall use a melonized steel gear, so problem #1 is solved. For the corrosion inside the mag head, the reason is that the vacuum generated by the rotation of the rotor sucks air inside the head and with it, humidity if the car is driven during cold and wet days. It was the case. I started to drive her in march and it's pretty cold and wet here in the north of France. Once the engine stops and cools down, the moisture trapped inside the head condensates and little by little starts to rust the points, the rotor, the condenser and if nothing's done, the complete inside of the head will end completely rusted too. To avoid this problem, they advised me to drill 3 3 mm holes on the head. It solves the problem. I was thinking of spraying a tiny bit of WD40 but the temp inside the head is pretty damn hot, i don't want that to ignite. I hope those infos will help anyone having to deal with those issues. Good afternoon and thanks very much for everybody's helping. Regards. Rod.
In looking at the inside of your cap, it is missing the spring-loaded graphite conductor in the middle. If it doesn't have that, then the spark is having to "jump" the gap - not good. Here is what it should look like (this is a 6 cylinder cap, but they're the same other than that):
The gear while worn looks ot be still intact enough to spin the mag so why did it just die and not restart suddenly . I read it that a retiming of the engine allowed the engine to run again ? if so Id be looking at the timing chain and if it jumped a tooth . Unless you lost like 30 degrees of timing at once from the worn gear it shuld stull run some what . And a bad gear that doesn't spin the mag no matter what so it would not run again . to suddenly die and need a major timing change to run sound like the cam timing changed and thus the ignition timing in the process . Also as noted above the cneter of the cap is missing the button that needs to be there . Id be looking at the thermostat running to cold and or stuck open causing condensation to build causing he rust also.
And not knowing the situation on your cap, hopefully you have all the little brass screws that hold the wires into the cap. My guess is that you took them out when you pulled the cap off the mag.
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