60 Plymouth,did you paint the picture? Is it your's? Oh yeah,I don't think the driver is anywhere near strapped in as much as hanging on for dear life!
Welll Cruiser man are you enjoying the ride and are YOU into cyclecars now? Have a grand day! BanjeauX Bob
. One of the most intriguing and attractive of the early cycle-cars (to me) is the AV "Mono Car." Its esthetically pleasing with a light airy and purposeful look that I find very compelling. Quite a few photos of the Mono Car can be found on the inter-net, but I've not seen any real specifications to now. Can anyone here point me to dimensional measurements for this car; wheelbase, track, wheel/tire size(s), etc. .
There is apparently some technical continuity between the AV Monocar and the early-type Carden cyclecar - besides the obvious fact that both have rear-mounted air-cooled V-twins. We've had a few Cardens on this thread.
Indeed. Wikipedia: "In 1916 the design and factory was sold to Ward and Avey Ltd who renamed the car the AV and continued manufacture until about 1924." Carden went on to develop a more conventional, Ackermann-steered, though still rear-engined, design. How to get centre-pivot steering to work for any but the most basic function is something that has occupied my thoughts from time to time.
. How indeed to accomplish anything more than minor directional corrections using center-pivot steering would seem to be a task of insurmountable dimensions. Conjecture would suggest coupling the "coaster wagon" steering with the very narrow track of the AV Mono Car could only have exacerbated the inherent problems. Visions of porcine excursions on rime ice come readily to my mind's eye. Tis a shame the "sliding pillar" front suspension/steering of the Carden couldn't have been developed early enough to have been part of the designs and rights purchased by Ward and Avey Ltd. Though a bit crude in it's execution, the Carden front suspension must have been light years ahead of the AV Mono Car as far as offering some reliable degree of directional control. .
The problem with the centre-pivot steering is that it does not accommodate roll in any way. Taking any kind of curve at speed would tend to load the outer front wheel and lift the inner, resulting in a tremendous counter-torque in the steering. Relax one's grip on the steering and one would find oneself turning very sharply in the direction opposite to what one had intended. One could give the axle another degree of freedom, which would take one from absolute roll stiffness (or rather roll stiffness equal to the torsional rigidity of the frame) to zero roll stiffness - which is perhaps just as well considering the extremely narrow track. But here's an idea: If the axle were to become a free-hinged parallelogram with the top and bottom members pivoting at the top and bottom of a sprung headstock, with the wheels running on stub-axles fixed perpendicular to the side members, but incapable of steering independently; and if the headstock were moreover raked like that of a bicycle or motorcycle; the whole would behave a lot like a cycle's single front wheel. In fact it would have the same knack of inducing self-steering through leaning, if the vehicle itself allowed it. And as the vehicle itself is light, overall and especially at the front, and might consequently have steering direct and responsive enough, it seems feasible that it be steered like a cycle, by intuitive counter-steering inducing lean inducing stable steering. That is, it would tilt into curves like a cycle. This would require zero-roll-stiffness rear suspension as well, and I can think of a few ways of doing that. One could have independent trailing arms joined by a linkage that assures zero roll stiffness, with separate drive chains, etc., so the rear wheels tilt with everything else. Or one could incorporate a central articulation that lets the rear axle/engine/gearbox assembly stay upright while the rest tilts, like the rear module of an Ariel 3 or Honda Gyro. The latter would certainly be simpler to build, and would allow chunkier tyres to be used at the rear, but it would require a material departure from the look of the AV Monocar. Something to mull over absent-mindedly ...
Here's a rear view of UB5457: I wonder if one can work an articulation in there, just ahead of the rear wheels - or even just ahead of the engine, if one could increase the rear track slightly to give the necessary clearance. The other thing is, I'd really like for this to become a two-seater, somehow, as I'd like to be able to take my wife along. It wants to be a tandem, if anything. Side-by-side seating would be all wrong. Here's a 1922 AV, which looks like it might have Ackermann steering:
Love this thing. Someone needs to clone it (less the fenders) and hit the flats! The front looks like a modern F1 car to me and the discs are a nice surprise. Gary
Further thoughts on Dawie's analysis of the "coaster-wagon" steering-- Look at the Bedella in post 1903. Although the angle that the shot was taken almost hides the fact, this car had a very definite negative camber--to the point of looking like the car was dropped from some height, thereby bending the front axle. Examination showed that the front members were straight- and the camber was built in. I should have taken the photo from a lower camera position which would have showed this clearly--but since it was slide film, I wasn't aware that the intended reason for the picture (the camber) was not so evident. Now days, with digital, it would be simple solution--delete and retake. From memory--and we all know how well that works--i would say that the camber, wiewed head on and low down was3-4º negative--very noticeable. If you look closely at the car in post 1911, I think that it is the same. When I was taking the shots, there was a fellow who was an engineer, with some knowledge of chassis geometry. I mentioned the camber, and his reply was that it was necessary because of the--what he called--center point steering. I knew this fellow well, and respected his ideas. He acted like it was a well known principle (without being superior about it). Herb
. A tandem Mono Car Ned? That idea pretty much mirrors my own thoughts and plans. My computer skills are very nearly nonexistent, but a quick copy/paste job shows a glimmer of what such a cyclecar might look like - - - (I'm not implying in any manner that you and your wife look alike). Seriously, the "tandem" idea had already occurred to me and is in fact, part of the design criteria I'm currently working on. .
This year is the centenary of the foundation of the cyclecar club here in the uk and to celebrate this a number of us are taking our cyclecars to darkest Wales Hopefully the chater lea will be up and running in a year which will also mark it's centenary This will happen on the 19 th and 20 th of may
My understanding with center-pivot steering is that the preferred method of taking a corner at speed is to pitch the car in, slide the back end around and drive it out at the end of the arc as to minimize the required steering angle. Not a practical technique on modern pavement. But the camber helping mitigate those issues makes a lot of sense, in terms of basic physics.
Yes, and an early kit too. Or at the very least a set of 'wide-5' hubs up front, which were in production from WWII until 1967. I'm currently trying to decide if I want to go with 4 lug or 5 lug hubs on my front beam.
Good chance, ifn you run into a Mack Bulldog around the bend. I doubt it would actually go fast enough to do harm unless you did the lemming deal and went over the side. Gary
Lion Peugeot (sp?) Wopping big one cylinder (119CID) 10" stroke with 3 intake and 3 exhaust valves. 1907 Anyone remember the spoof article that Road and Track did on the one cylinder GP car? One of the spec's was a teak wood con rod IIRC Herb
The Jalopy Journal
