Well since it has been pointed out to me, several times, that my truck is not, can not, and will not be a traditional ride. I've decided that I'm just going to build a safe, reliable, decent looking hot rod out of it. I'm moving the masters for the clutch and brakes to the firewall. looking for input on selection. I'm drawn to the 1960 Chevy truck cylinder for a few reasons, compact, stylish, affordable, the lines can be routed neatly. Downsides I see. Either need to build a crossover linkage, or swap the innards, it's set up for drum/drum and is it not a dual set-up. Option number 2: late 60's Camaro dual master. Pros: not ugly, dual system, disc/drum same price as the truck master. Cons: still need a clutch set-up. Either way I need to build pedal set up and stiffen the firewall. I think I have the Camaro master in my spare parts pile but the truck master is only $65 bucks so it's not a big deal. Your thoughts or suggestions? Thanks Keith
safety trumps style 99.99% of the time.... the .01% is the suit you wear in your coffin. do what keeps you alive, not what "fits tradition" when it comes to safety. i've been re-reading a bunch of old little pages books recently... you'd be surprised to see what those folks were up to 55 years ago.
I'd go with the 60-62 truck setup "IF" you can get the stock pedal setup out of a boneyard. The stock underdash ass'y is slick; it mounts the pedals, and not only braces the firewall skin with a double layer, but also goes back and ties into the lower lip of the dash. Meaning it's not only rock solid, it also beefs up the dash. I run one in my 32 Ford and it is way better than Ansen style pedal setup. I'll see if I have a pic.
All I have for pics of the 60-62 truck setup. If you look at the lower underside of the dash in pic 1, you might see the two painted bolt heads pointing down, and that's where the Chevy bracket/bracing fits onto the dash. It really is strong this way. Bear in mind that you will take some shit for using a single circuit, but brush it off, unless you are a shitty mechanic. If you know how to take care of a car, and are good at it, there is no reason to be concerned. You also need a proper hand brake. This is the hamb, we are allowed to use old style technology. Street rodders have a different opinion
isn't it funny that cars had to change to a dual master cylinder in 1967 but big trucks did not have to for at least another twenty years.
F&J. I have MANY issues with the old ansen style pedals. All but one of have been addressed by Lucky's Speed Shop in Scotsdale AZ. http://www.luckys-speed-shop.com/CandyPress/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=147 However I am still dealing with swapping the guts clutch to brake. I'll try to see if I can find some good pics of OEM pedal set. They look a LOT like the '41 stockers. Keith Posted from the TJJ App for iPhone & iPad
10 minutes, if you never did it before. All that is different is one has a valve at the end of the spring, at the forward end, and also has a large flat rubber washer in front of that, to make a good seal. Easy as can be.
have been using ansen pedal setup&the truck master since 65 recently found out that autozone 's rebuilt uses stainless steel sleeves included photo showing valve that needs to be changed over works how even on my unusual rear disc brakes........
wanting to draw attention to the autozone master as stated they use stainless steel sleeves only on rebuilts also use the hi tech rubber parts............
The last image that John just put up has the valve for the brake side outlined in red. The black flat washer right above that valve, goes into the empty brake bore first. That's what the valve seats against. The valve will clip onto one end of the spring, and just slide it in. The clutch side does not need a valve, and does not need the flat rubber washer. On some dual masters, they use a different snap ring; it is round wire, with one tail bent up to use a screwdriver. These can go flying somehere in the shop . But most masters now use the one like John shows on his master; they have two holes on the snap ring, to grip with the needle type snap ring pliers.
Are 63 pedals the same? I found a set of those. Can get them pretty fair price I'll post a photo of them later. Also I'm a disc/drum set up. GM single pistons in the front and a 7.5" from an S-10 in the rear. Keith Posted from the TJJ App for iPhone & iPad
Is this the pedal set I'm looking for? Here is another one, I'm pretty sure they are the same. I checked on places like rockauto seems that '63 used the same master cylinder as the '60 models. Keith
The top one is 63-66 for sure. The last one has a different lever for the clutch that seems like it has a clevis for the correct pushrod...but it looks modified, with an incorrect pivot bolt on the clevis. I will try to get a pic of mine today. Masters from a 63 will not be the same as 60, unless the 60 truck was factory A/T. That's because it would be a single, not a dual. And as I recall, those early singles...I have seen some with 2-bolt diagonal bolt patterns, not straight across like 64-66.
So 1963 pickups used a single brake master, with a separate clutch? Was it hydro, or mechanical? Keith Posted from the TJJ App for iPhone & iPad
63 was mech, like the 64-66, same pedal cluster 63-66 Dang, I forgot all about looking at mine, but I will try to get a pic of the 60-62 bracket today
Here are a few links to some pedal sets: http://www.ebay.com/itm/1960-1961-1...-NR-/170898779774?hash=item27ca5c6e7e&vxp=mtr http://www.ebay.com/itm/1963-CHEVRO...Parts_Accessories&hash=item20ca49dc1a&vxp=mtr Think either of them will work? Keith
This pic makes me think that this one is really a 60-62...unless...someone switched that clevis. I will be at the shop in a few minutes to look at mine, and look at a 60 chevy truck parts manual to see if it has a good pic I can copy.
Ok, the first ebay link is correct for 60-62, but it is missing one push rod for the clutch. I did a quick look, and I don't have one...so far, but I can look elsewhere in another barn. Pics are from an early 1960 manual. One thing you see in the pics is an "over center spring for v8". I have never seen one, and I don't need it in my 32 with an early Olds V8 clutch. The pedal is fine. All you need for pedal springs are the two "pedal return" springs, which are on that ebay unit. One more thing, important.... Look at the factory pics where the pedal stops are: Those were on a seperate bracket deal that held up the column and had the E-brake handle mount. You don't need that plate and I did not see it on that auction. What you can do real easy, for pedal stops, is weld on a small piece of angle iron across the bottom of the bracket. You drill 2 holes, then weld two nuts on. Then screw a bolt into each, with another lock nut. See the underdash pic of mine; it works fine.
OK I understand a bunch better now. Thank you for taking the time to post those. I'm not worried about the links, I have a mill and a lathe, I can make them. I'm kinda digging the ebrake, might have to track one of those down later. I'm hoping this set up will move enough fluid for my front disc set up, if not I'll be tracking down Ford backing plates and going back to 4 wheel drum, they work just fine on my 74 CJ-5!! Thanks again Keith
What kinda crack is that, want to call my kids stupid and my dog ugly next? Posted from the TJJ App for iPhone & iPad
Unfortunately many people running a dual master cylinder don't have it set up correct. The pedal travel has to completely bottom out with no fluid in or the second chamber won't work to save your ass. Ago
I can't give a guarantee, but why would your discs take more? Not being a know it all, but the disc pistons barely move during braking?...especially compared to how much fluid the rear wheel cylinders can use, if the brakes are not adjusted good??? The big fluid reservoir on a dual drum/disc master is that big, so that as the pads wear down in 50,000 miles, the car owner does not have to keep adding fluid, as the piston keeps moving farther out with pad wear. I think what's more important, is finding out what master bore size is needed with whatever calipers you have...if you can look that up. Then the better chance the pedal will stop the car with normal foot pressure.
F&J Your correct, I was typing to quick, my fluid comment was more will the master move the fluid with enough psi to move the large piston in the caliper. They don't move far but they have a huge bore. The OEM master uses a 1.417" piston. I think I will grab that pedal set-up, worst case I'll hang on to it for another project down the road. ago I would love to meet up with you at some point, Perry was over the house last night telling me about the craftsmanship in your cars. Keith
I certinly wouldn't call your kids ugly or your dog stupid, my point was that everyone seems to be trying for perfect safety these days... heck I've even got seat belts in my rod... but here's my MC...
Gotcha Fenders, I thought you were giving me shit about building a Deco truck. They are kind of a bastard child. But like I said before, I'm a farm boy and we drive trucks and I'm a Chevy guy who doesn't want a 5 window. I do guess safe is a relative term, I really ment that as in not a botched together, hap hazard build you know the term for "those" cars!! Cheers Keith
Wow, that is huge. Seems a bit odd? The chevy dual might be 1-1/16" or so, and I doubt you could bore it that big on your mill. But I'll take a look at an empty core master I have. I know it won't go that big on a rebore, but I will measure the bore if you don't have it yet.
F&J I got that spec from the AutoZone website, When I checked a few others I keep seeing .950" The 1960 one is 1.125". The clutch master on the '60 is also 1.125" the clutch slave for my trans is .796" Any issues there? Keith
That small slave bore might cause a really stiff pedal. See if you can look up the 60-62 slave bore to compare. Mine is in a bad spot to measure on the car. I think mine was much bigger than that one
Thats not a big issue I can put just about any clutch slave in I want. They way it mount ANY of the generic slaves can be used easy fix. Thanks again. Keith
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