May 2011 Banger Meet Spring has sprung now drive'm

Ya, I do to. they run alot cooler that way don't they.--TV

 

In an article in an early issue of S O S S C Yapp wrote of possibly removing as much .125 There was a comment in another issue where guys welded all kinds on s--t in the chamber, washers and other shapes. Didn't seem to help. The best way to improve the power developed by the stock head is to toss it. Speed and power cost money so spend some on a decent head.
Seems to be a lot of Ford Barn type questions lately. If you have a "tired old engine" just go ahead and rebuild it. Enough with chewing gum repairs and fixes. If you can't afford to do it right then put the head and pan back on and go puckety puckety over to the barn. Just merely bolting on manifolds and higher compression heads is just going to let you puckety puckety a little faster. You need a cam to make your higher compression work along with better breathing, both intake and exhaust.
Define lug my ass, what do they call it now? You can't lug your automatic equipped car so the word is now obsolete This is the result of all these automatic transmissions. When the first GM Hyddramatic automatics came out they were advertised as the trans that does your thinking for you so now people can't figure out what all these old archaic terms are like "choke it" or "the float's stuck" means. Points are now obsolete. Another ford column shift problem was they would hang up in 2 nd gear. So would fluid drives. How many of you guy's ever drove a "Fluid drive" trans? So now this whole new world is opened up to you, old cars that ordinary humans can repair rebuild and or modify. I sure hate to put $4.00 a gallon gas in this old car. Have any of you noticed that there is no place for a crank on these newer cars? No choke or throttle knobs, break your neck getting in and out, no running boards on the damn things.
I guess its time to go out and listen to my 2 port run! I love the smell of exhaust in the morning! Got to get the Winfield "C"'s on the other car before the Antique Nationals! I bet some of you wish I would leave the shop doors closed when it's running like my wife does.

 

Bill

Your being too kind to these guys..... anyone that dosen't understand what ''lug the engine'' needs to just F'n go home!

Next they will want to know why it's called a Banger or what lawn chair to buy

My Spare tire is a AAA card........

 

Thanks for the comments. It sounds like I will leave the stock head alone. I don't want to dump money on this engine as I am in the process of building it's replacement. I guess I didn't realize how thin the stock head was. I have heard alot about reworking cast iron V-8 heads to improve compression. Apparently the banger heads are a completely different animal.

Thanks,
Mitch

 

Quick question for you Banger Specialists.. Hope to be as Knowlageable as ya all someday.. My question is dealing with the frame.. Is the Frame from a 29 the same as the 30-31... I know the bodys are different I picked up a 30 Tudor for parts and the frame is better then the one on my 29 Coupe... THANKS
Randy L Peterson

 

I believe that there are some differences in the radiator mounts at the front crossmember from 28-29 to 30-31. In the very early "A" frames there is a significant difference in the brake cross-shaft area. There may be more that I am unaware of.

-Mitch

 

Is knowlageable (knowledgeable) spelled that way and considered proper noun in SD? We also critique spelling and grammar on this forum!

True, the 29 has a slightly raised area where the radiator mounts. If you bolt a 30 31 body on a 29 frame the hood won't fit evenly as your 30 radiator and shell will sit up higher. Ask me how I know. So what I did was have the radiator shop move the mounting brackets on the radiator up. There are other fixes such as heating and pounding the pad down on the 29 or cutting and welding etc,etc,etc. This is the usual problem I suppose the opposite would be true but easier to fix meaning the 29 body on a 30 frame.

 

Like, how much taller are we talking? My hood fits funky and was thinking I needed to raise the cowl. My car seems to be an early 30 or a thirty on a 29 frame from some other things I have noticed.

 

I'm not sure how much taller as I have never been down that road. Perhaps Just Plain Bill will explain. But, I have noticed on my sedan and my coupe that the hood fitment is kind of funky as you described. I was told that this is a fairly common problem resulting from the frame "sagging" there as a result of years of stress. While I haven't torn down either of these cars to check it out, I have no reason to believe that they aren't on their original frames. The pictures aren't very close, but you can definitely see the gap at the bottom of the hood sides. See Below:

 

I would think if it is caused by frame sag then it would also show up as poor vertical alignment of and uneven wear on the doors.
It's not much probably less than 1/4" maybe only an 1/8" where the radiator mounts to the crossmember but it is enough to create a gap of close to 1/4" at the lower corner of the hood at the firewall. I guess the best way to describe it is the crossmember 30 is smooth and the 29 has a slight but noticeable raised area where the radiator mounts. I have heard of frame sag but I would definitely check for the 29 frame. There was a lot of parts mixing between the late 29's and early 30's but I don't think it applies to the frame. I don't think Ford would have shipped a car with this mix. If you start to raise the cowl then the door will need some attention. If the frame has sagged then you will just have to shim. I have had oldtimers tell me that all of the frames were the same but found this not to be true when I tried to fix the hood gap on my late 31 coupe on 29 rails. If a old car had a frame damaged in an accident the parts were mostly replaced as donor cars were everywhere and cheap. I added this to help curious minds that might wonder why frames were commonly swapped.

 

If your talking to old timers, they must be pretty old. .


.

 

From what I have seen, the sag in the frame occurs right at the rear motor mounts, and isn't that hard to correct with an 8 ft piece of light I beam and a hydrulic jack. chain the I beam to the frame at the ends, and close to the ground. Put hardwood blocks in the open side of the frame chanel to keep it from getting distorted. Jack at the rear engine mounts. Check top of frame rail with string. Checking is a little tricky, but worth the effort compared to taking the body off, or loose. We have done this on 2 cars now, and have learned the lesson-check the frame before you bolt anything on to it.

Herb

 

My plan is to use the 30 frame and put a 29 Coupe body on it..

 

i have a question does my car qualify as a banger
4 cylinder 2.3 t-5 ?
here is a small video
YouTube - round 2

 

It may be a banger, but if it wasn't built before 1950, then you won't learn much from us.

.

 

ANYTHING built after 1950 is just another used car!


Herb

 

Actually it was one old fart at the CW Moss store on Pomona ca that made that statement and at the time he was a lot older than I was. I believe this was 20 years ago. I think that you are going to be an old timer some day if you take better care of your body. As for me my frame is sagging already, too many rough roads. Like the caption under the picture "IF I knew I was going to get this old I would have taken better care of myself!"

A word of advice to newbies, quit asking all of these barn questions. If you are trying to get an old engine running and you need help getting the "galloping bars" adjusted go to the barn they live for helping and displaying all of their knowledge on things simple. In fact, I see more questions regarding sleeper heads with lower compression than 7 to 1, counter balanced cranks and so on answered in detail for the newbie. a lot of discussion over thee on single down draft carbs but it is mostly stuff you can't see. They hate "HOT RODDERS" but some have all of the hot mods on the inside of their engines so they look like purists.
Now, if you want to discuss the problems incurred while converting Winfield carburetors to side draft, ask away. Or maybe you have found an old Wico mag, we'll tell you how to time it. Or we will discuss with you why we think the "Crows Foot" combustion chamber seems to make more power. I will even tell you how my car ran as well as it did with a stock model "B" distributor. But no more questions regarding how much to gap the plugs or how Bacon Rind or old leather shoe tongues to put in the rods to get that old engine running 1 more time!

 

I probably won't get as knowlegable as you Bill but my attitude towards my fellow enthusiast will certainly be a cut above yours.

Ron

 

Wow.... Most guys have to start with getting a engine running.....

 

Ron

You just provered that wrong ASSHOLE! Where do you get the idea you can walk in here and start setting the rules?

Straigten up and show some respect or GO FUCKING HOME!

 

Bluto

It wasn't my intention to set rules. If you guys want respect, show some. I will take your suggestion and head for the door.

Ron

One more thing, as far as the asshole thing goes, I rather thought you would enjoy the company.

 

Thats right but on this forum it used to be we were passed the getting this old tired engine started stage. I some times wait a couple of days on what are considered simple questions and if no one else has answered then I take it upon myself to try pass the wanted information on. Some times I don't know so I don't post. I only post what I have learned by experience, you know, making mistakes. I used to operate an Automatic Screw Machine shop and had to learn how to fix all of the things that could and did happen. I was asked how I learned to fix all these things and I answered " When you have F--ked up as many things as I have you do learn how to fix some a them!"

I'm sorry if my sarcastic, simple, attempts at humor offend some of you youngsters. But just think, now you know what really old timer's called connecting rods and they did use Bacon Rind and old shoe tongues to to fix really loose bearings. We haven't even got to the point of adding sawdust into noisy gear boxes. And some o you guys are already pissed!

 

We don't have to show you anything. You went after a guy that is ill and sits by his computer trying to help others ...... that's way past resonable Ron.

And I doubt you'll ever understand.......

 

I agree with Bluto. This thread is for solving problems for everybody.

 

Damn, I'm glad I got all my dumb questions answered before the banger threads turned sour!

 

may be it would be the time to point out to all newbes that at the start of each months banger meet we post the banger basics please read them!

 

The most irritating thing about public forums like this is that it is too easy for people to ask questions without doing research. My pet peeve is in my signature: "I've tried nothing and I'm all out of ideas". I tell my employees that it is better to come to me with a solution then it is a problem. I judge people by how they deal with solutions. If they ask what to do next without looking for a solution, then they are worthless to me. Being afraid to make mistakes is the worst quality a person can have.

Think about your questions. If your first thought is "I need to ask someone how to do it" then you are doomed to fail. If you approach the same problem and can't decide what option to use to solve the issue, then asking which option is best will get a better response.

Good question:
Should I set my plug gap at .020" or .025"?
Bad question:
Do I need spark plugs?

Good question:
I'm thinking of using a multi clutch set up in my speedster for street and some hill climb use. I have a mildly modified A engine with a high comp head and single down draft stromberg 97. Is this a good choise? If not why?

Bad question:
"I picked up a multi disc clutch today. The guy said he took it out of his '28. I have heard these where used in the dirt cars in the early 30's. Now, is it worth messin' with or should I just turn it."

Why is this bad?
We know it came out of an early '28. You assume we know what you are putting it in. What's it worth? turn it? Are you talking to us? If you know nothing about it, why did you buy it?

If a stranger walked up to you and asked you why his feet hurt, could you answer his question? Why would you want to?

.

 

This is the only thread I go to on the main board often.

I quit answering main board (non banger thread) questions because people want to argue with your annswer and dump on you personally.

That's what pissed me off.

There are guys here with questions we all try to answer. If you don't like the answer ...... that's your right. If you take it out on guys personally that spend hours each week really trying to help that's just bull shit.

There are hundreds of years experiance here. Don't abuse the guys trying to help you here.

Please don't ask a question and then trash our picnic.

 

Crazydaddyo

I think they are doing their research when they ask a question on the forum. This has always been the place to go for answers. I use it for my source of information and there is no easier place to do research and get answers.

There are a lot of people that have no or limited experience that need help. They have no references for doing research on a topic. I think you have to have some compassion because not all people are on the same level.

I remember when I went to college the worst teachers were the arrogant ones. When I got older I realized they did not know the answer to a question so make the person that asked the question look stupid.

When I was young I would ask the local mechanics and hoodlums questions. When I got older I realized some of their answers where not correct or myths that they heard.

If you have to have answers to your questions before you post a question there is no need to come to this forum.

I like the really easy questions because then I can answer them.

I think this forum is great and I believe there are no stupid questions.

 

I may be a new guy here, but I've been in the motorcycle restoration and performance game for decades. I've been a founding member of a few forums since the forum phenomenon started long after my interest.

The irritation about basic questions isn't unique to this site. Questions about re-jetting, using WD40 on chains and stopping simple oil leaks come up constantly with people who are just starting to work on bikes. The old timer's responses can run anywhere from crabbyness to saintlike patience.

I have a few suggestion to make things better here, but since I'm considered one of the great unwashed no-nothings I doubt if they will be heeded.

1) If the question is about something that has been discussed ad nauseum, refer the person asking the question to the search function, but also give the the correct words to search for. A search is only as good as the words you enter. Helping the person search is a much better and nicer response than, "Do a search asshole!"

2) Start a sub forum or at least a sticky with frequently asked questions (FAQ's) While I appreciate the long list of threads at the beginning of each month, I work for a living and don't have a lot of time to read the history of four banger engines. I'm guessing others are in the same boat. All I might need is a spark gap setting to finish a little task on the few hours I have on a Saturday afternoon.

3) Use common sense to try to recognize when someone needs help. The worst situation to be in is to have a machine that doesn't work and you've tried everything. If a car or bike doesn't run it becomes an expensive paperweight. That's when you guys with years of experience can really come through for someone. I know because some of the decent old timers here did that for me last month.