Hot Rods Model A VIN Problems

Hey, I had a question I was hoping you guys could help with. I just started messing around with Model A parts. I've been buying and selling a little bit & I had a chance to buy a complete rolling Ch***is. I bought it and didn't even check the engine or frame for numbers. but latter I realized that both the frame and engines numbers are completely removed... I mean grinded down, am I at all going to be able to register it? or is it a lost cause? Thanks for you input..... Let the insults begin!

 

what State are you in?

 

California

 

Maybe you could do the acid etch trick to reveal the numbers that were ground off?

 

Those numbers are probably still being used.

 

probably used the body on a hot rod , kept the ***le & numbers !

 

So, would registering it be impossible?

 

Special construction

 

Where in California?

 

Murrieta

 

buy the stamps and git yerself a new number

 

How do I go about doing that?

 

I agree with everyone else. The numbers were likely used on an aftermarket frame.

The best solution is to find a frame with unused numbers on it, or to go SB100.

 

If the numbers were "raised" on that original frame and turned out to be in use, if brought to the attention of the DMV, wouldn't that department be interested in talking to whoever is currently using them?

 

Last set of stamps I saw were about $250, cheaper to find a Model A frame.

 

Try a company called Restostamps. They have the Model A sets with the unique #1, and #9 that started in February of '31. They also have the standard set and the star used before and after the serial numbers.

 

Originally there was a cloth webbing between the cowl and where the numbers are stamped. I have seen many frames where the numbers are completely rusted away. I don't know if the acid etching method would work. Also, stamping your own number could get you in hot water.

 

Not necessarily.

A frame is a perfectly valid replacement part.

If there was a good faith effort to obliterate the numbers on the original frame (I weld over them), and there was no intent to deceive, then there isn't an issue here.

 

Stamping your own serial number, that does not belong to the vehicle, is a felony.

 

I want to do it the right way. Is it possible to register just a frame?Could I buy a frame with numbers and register that ? And then just swap parts? What about the engine ? Do numbers have to match?

 

My uncle went to the DMV and had the CHP issue a new stamped #........

 

In Wash state you can't register just a frame. When I bought my 42 Dodge PU, all I had was a frame and body and the ad from craigslist. The state patrol said I was lucky that the body and frame number matched during the inspection and I was issued a temporary ***le and after three years, it became a real ***le. The girl at the licensing dept said they use the old car buyers guide which values cars between 1 and 5 and the 5 is cl***ified as a parts car only and they will not ***le them.

 

I'm glad this came up since I have a similar question. I have a running and registered real '28 Ford roadster on real '32 rails but the ch***is (built in the '70s) is nowhere near what I want to end up with. I have a second set of real '32 rails with no obvious numbers that I would like to use to build a more traditional ch***is for this high boy. I was wondering how to approach the VIN number issue once the new ch***is is done and I'm ready to swap the body. I don't want to do anything to jeopardize the legality of my car's registration.
Sorry, not trying to hijack the thread but since we have Gimpy on here and it's kind of a similar problem.......

 

This is the straight-dope. I am a CA licensed and bonded vehicle verifier, so you know where I am coming from.

California now wants to see the VIN/Serial in TWO locations. This is a problem on a Model A, as very few have a matching engine and frame serial.

The DMV, CHP and all private vehicle verifiers are only supposed to inspect complete cars. For the DMV and CHP, that means as delivered by the factory. For a private verifier, "complete" might mean something different all-together.

Yes, you can buy a frame, so long as it has clearly visible numbers. BEFORE you buy it, call the DMV and ask if there are any current records on it, and/or if it has been reported stolen. If it is clear, and there is no paperwork, you will need to fill out a bunch of paper work, and take out a ***le bond. If there is an old registration, or an old ***le, etc., it is easier. If there is a recent ***le, you are golden.

 

Thank you! Now to Find a frame....

 

The key words here are "intent to decieve".

When you make changes to a vehicle, you must make them in a fashion that is within the law.

In this case, you have a ***le to the vehicle, which is an acknowledgement from the state that you are the lawful owner of the vehicle, presumably with some numbers stamped in the frame, which match the ***le (lets hope that they are Model A numbers).

Now, what you want to do is replace the frame, which I have mentioned, is a perfectly legal thing to do. Even better here that the donor has no numbers, as that is the way a Ford service replacement frame would have come.

In order to replace the frame, you are required to copy the exact numbers from the original, to the replacement, with correct stamps, in all of the original locations, and then destroy, or forever retain the original. As I have mentioned, and since I cannot keep every little thing forever, I weld over the original serial numbers, and if salvageable, sell the frame off, with no ***le.

As long as nothing you are doing involved an intent to deceive, you are simply repairing your car.

Now, if you were putting a fibergl*** '32 body on an aftermarket frame, with a real '32 serial number, and attempting to register it as a real '32, you would be acting to deceive, and that is a criminal act.

Boyd Cottington got caught doing this. He could afford to get his *** out of it. Most of you might not be able to.

 

This is what did as well. Shiny silver sticker

 

They made millions. They are out there.

I even found one that came with an engine block, that had the matching numbers!

 

Thanks Gimpy. Now the second part; would it be ok to buy the stamps and do it myself or are there shops that can do it for me. Years ago I had SAC in SoCal build a new frame for my Model A sedan and they stamped the correct numbers from my old frame on the new one (I still have the old frame). I figured it was part of the service. I'm not sure how a shop would feel about doing it to a frame they didn't build.

 

I am not sure that you are going to find a shop willing to do this. You will likely have to take care of this on your own.

Make sure you know exactly what stamps to buy, and where to mark.