Separating the engine from the oil pan and lifting it out. The flywheel and transmission are still attached to the engine. ... "How the model T engine is oiled" ... If you look closely at the bottom right of the photo, you will see a steel tube running into the back of the engine. This tube has a narrow funnel that collects oil as it is thrown from the flywheel and runs it to the front of the engine. The oil then flows back along the bottom of the oil pan. If you look close at the ends of the rods, you can see a small "scoop" in the center of each rod cap. This is the under side of a stock oil pan. The four "humps" are pockets to hold oil under each rod journal. The "scoop" on the end of the rod caps swing down into these pockets to force oil up into the rod journals. I've drawn a line at the front where the steering arm runs across under the pan and a "V" line at the back where the radius arm runs under the pan. The sump has to fit in between these lines. The pan itself holds a little over 4 quarts in the bottom of the flywheel housing. Back in the day, they made several oil "sump" pans that bolted to the bottom of the model T oil pan. These were connected to the stock oil pan thru a hose that went from the back of the sump pan to the flywheel housing. On a race engine, they would add a oil pump to the engine. The oil then would flow from the flywheel housing into the sump pan thru the connecting hose. The pump would pull the oil from the sump pan and circulate the oil thru a drilled crank shaft. It would then run back into the flywheel housing. Thus completing the oil cycle. On an engine with out an oil pump, the oil still just circulated to the front of the engine and flowed back across the oil pan dips to the flywheel housing. The sump pan added extra oil capacity but didn't fully circulate the the extra oil in the sump pan. This is the oil sump pan that is available now. It is an un-machined rough casting. With this style, there isn't any way to get oil into the sump pan other than thru the hose that connects the pan to the flywheel housing. I wanted to build a sump pan that would allow the oil to circulate thru it. I have an old Frankland quick change rear axle cover that I'm going to use for the "sump" pan. So .. first I cut a "spacer" out of 5/8 inch thick aluminum plate to the shape of the model T "dipper pan". Then I milled out two clearance pockets for the dipper humps. Fitting the spacer to the oil pan. There are two notches milled in the center rib so oil can flow from the rear pocket to the front pocket. Next I cut a bottom plate out of 1/4 inch thick steel plate to the shape of the model T dipper pan. Fitting the steel bottom plate over the spacer plate. Holes are drilled thru the bottom plate and the spacer plate to bolt this onto the model T oil pan. The triangular shaped hole in the steel plate is to allow oil to flow into the sump pan. Fitting the Franklad housing to the bottom plate. To get the oil to flow into the sump pan, I milled a slot in the model T dipper pan right behind the last oil pocket. I then milled a corresponding notch in the end of the spacer. Oil flow notch with the spacer on the dipper pan. This is how it looks bolted in place on the oil pan. I then welded a hose fitting to the bottom of the flywheel housing. The brass tube fitting at the front of the oil pan is for an outside oil line to feed extra oil to the front of the pan. The sump pan****embly sitting on the oil pan. Side view showing the line up between the hose fitting in the flywheel housing and the hose fitting in the sump pan. The connecting hose will be put on after the engine is set back in the frame and the front axle radius rod is fastened to the oil pan. Now the oil will be picked up from the flywheel and routed to the front of the oil pan. Then it will flow back across the dip pockets to the drain hole at the back of the dipper pan. Then it will flow into the sump pan and from there into the bottom of the flywheel housing. Thus completing the oil cycle.
hmmm...I like the end result, but there must have been an easier way? the false bottom, provides for a constant build up of oil, but why not just mill out some holes in the upper portions of the pan and bolt the deep sump underneath? or am I missing something? Since I will be stuffing one of these under my speedster I am interested. Also wouldn't a dam at the 4th main aid in allowing the oil to build up a bit more? looks like the hole is at the top and oild could just as easily flow over and past as in? as an aside will be getting rid of a '28 (apprx) Caterpillar "10" field model, that was purchased by Great-grandfather new. Was refurbished by Cat in the 80's and painted yellow and black, instead of the correct grey and red, if you know anyone interested.
interesting....how are those bolt on crank weights working out for you? i have a bunch of them brand new and cant decide if i should throw them in the scrap or not....
Some good questions here ... There probably is an easier way, but this gives me something to do while I'm out in the garage all day. The sump has to be towards the front of the oil pan in order to clear the radius rod. The drain has to be at the very back of the oil pan. If you put the drain hole directly over the sump, than the rear oil pockets would not get any oil flow. The oil level for a model T engine only comes about 2/3's of the way up in the sump pan. On the engines that have a oil pump and a drilled crank added, they <style></style>usually would do away with the "dipper pan" and bolt the aluminum sump pan directly in it's place. On a gravity feed system, you need to keep the "dipper pan" If you look at the photo of the inside of the oil pan, you can see two "U" shaped strips of metal at the front and the rear of the pan. These are 1/4 inch thick and have the threaded holes in them for mounting the dipper pan. These two metal strips are separated with gap between them. This gap allows the oil to go out around them and flow back into the flywheel housing. The rear "U" shaped strip will direct a lot of the oil into the drain slot so the oil in the sump pan gets mixed well with the oil in the flywheel housing. .................... For the most part on a stock model T, the gravity oil system worked just fine. In my case .. it is more just for show. On "hot rod" engines, the extra oil capacity and extra oil flow was a good idea. Running at the higher engine speeds it was possible for the rods to splash the oil out of the pockets faster then the stock gravity feed could re-fill them. The extra outside oil line would help to guarantee that enough oil was flowing across the pockets at all times. The extra oil capacity helped to make sure there was always enough oil in the bottom of the flywheel housing for the flywheel to pick up.
I like them! The engine runs smoother and I can get a little bit more speed with them on. For me, the trick is getting them centered as they can move up or down on the crank about 1/8 of an inch. I snug them down and then measure from the top of one weight to the edge of the block. Then I rotate the crank 180 degrees and measure the other weight. I keep doing this until I get both weights to measure the same distance from the edge of the block. Do the same with the other set. I tighten them down with an air wrench so they are supper tight on the crank. I then lock the nuts on with a spot of weld on each one. It's worked well for me.
That is a great job accomplishment guys, nice to do it on my truck... but how is the steel plate? _________________ blanchard grinding
<style></style>There is a gasket between the oil pan and the dipper pan. Another gasket between the dipper pan and the spacer. And the last gasket between the spacer and the bottom plate. That's 3 - gaskets to seal. I used a steel bottom plate because it is more ridged than aluminum and won't warp in-between the mounting bolts. Also there is less chance of stripping the threads for mounting the sump pan to it. There was light surface rust on the steel. I sand blasted it and put a cold galvanized coating on it.
Retired, could you please submitt this project in the Baliegh contest? haha... I am really enjoying following it and feel your stuff really needs to get recognized... nice work... you have written in 1.5 months some of the most informative threads I've ever read on here!
The model T engine was probably the most simple automotive engine to be manufactured. No oil pump - no fuel pump - no water pump. Up until the late teens, no electric starter. The only gauge it had was an amp gauge ( you checked the level of the gas in the tank with a stick ). No <style></style>distributor - no points - no condenser. They had a "commutator" that looked like this and mounted at the front of the cam shaft. and four "wood" coils in a box like this and fit under the cowl. The rotor ( mounted on the end of the cam ) rotated and made contact with the metal tabs inside the commutator housing. This would ground one of the coils and that coil would send a spark to the plug. The steering column had a lever on the left side that would rotate the commutator housing to advance and retard the spark timing. There wasn't a gas pedal. A lever on the right side of the steering column operated the throttle on the carburetor. There wasn't a gear shift lever. There were three pedals on the floor. You pushed the left pedal all the way down for low gear and let it all the way up for high gear. In-between was neutral ( pulling the emergency brake lever would also hold this pedal in neutral ). Pushing down on the middle pedal was revierse. Pushing down on the right pedal was the brake ( it would stop the transmission which then would stop the rear axle ). you could start and run the model T without a battery. It had a magneto built in to the flywheel that produced <style></style>electricity for the coils.
Good to see some T stuff here the model t ignition produced a multiple spark as long as the comutator produced a ground connection the coil points vibrated and buzzed and produces a good strong spark ..a good feature of the Model T. the Right pedal was brake.. you have to push the left pedal half way down or pull the hand brake half way back to have the spring loaded hi clutch released and the low band loose to get reverse or to brake to a complete stop. ... if you don't the trans will fight between foreward and reverse. the first time I drove one I pushed the left pedal all the way down, used to a regular clutch, and pushed down on the brake. dented the rear fender on my willys. .. going down hill you can 'dance' on the foot pedals.. push down on the brake then let up on it to let some oil get in to cool it and push down on the reverse to tighten the band to slow a bit then repeat the dance. . I plan on doing the second rebuild of my T speedster soon. Mine is the old Paradesio one that I bought in N Calif. I have an old welded deep pan in the pile of parts, I was teaching Jr College auto in Calif so took 8 of my engines in ane did the machine work on them. decked the blocks did some SBC exhaust valves on some . machined for adj lifters. Milled the heads and water outlets. honed the cylinders. they didn't have a babbit set up.. some need repoured. the speedster engine has. .060 jahns al pistons.. reground cam and adj's... al timing gear.. dipper rods. I have heard of some counterweithts coming loose and haven't bought any. I have a Bosch front plate distributor that will get the VW kit. I'm running a moore gear box on the Dif,.gives 4 foreward and 2 reverse speeds... wire wheels and rocky mt brakes. My brother in law showed up with a trailer he wanted me to put on a new trailer coupler. It had a dropped T axle ,,,I convinced him to let me put on a later pinto axle so he could find tires easier. It had been welded and hacked on but I've got it looking presentable. I have a set of Hartford frictions shocks for it from a 29 stude. they still make Hartford in england for restoring old stuff over there, but a bit expensive. I had to make a few pieces before i found I could have bought them. ... keep us updated.
Ray, You are the true Doctor Frankenstein of the Model T set ! Keep these awesome threads A COMING !!!!!!!! 41 Dave
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