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Technical Most Common Wheel Bolt Pattern during Our Era?

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Ned Ludd, Nov 18, 2022.

  1. Ford stuck with the 5.5-on-5 bolt pattern on the F100/F150 truck all the way up to the '96 models. In '97 it got slightly smaller, a 135mm pattern (5.3125") before finally switching to a six lug pattern. There was one oddball mixed in, the last year of the F100 used the car pattern of 4.5-on-5, the next year that model was gone.
     
    Elcohaulic and Truckdoctor Andy like this.
  2. 80 or 81 f150 without power brakes had the car pattern
     
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  3. BamaMav
    Joined: Jun 19, 2011
    Posts: 6,969

    BamaMav
    Member
    from Berry, AL

    Ford guys had 5 x 5.5 and 5 x 4.5, Chevy guys had 5x5 and 5 x 4.75. The others were drops in a bucket compared to those sizes. That is except for the 6 lugs, some of them fit everything from Chevy to Ford to Toyota and Datsun/ Nissan.

    It always seemed to me the 5 x 4.75 was the most common, at least when I was looking for wheels in a 5x 4.5 size. I’d find 10 Chevy wheels to 1 Ford. Don’t know if Chevy was more popular, or if there were more of them parked without wheels….
     
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  4. Easier to steal I think with the smaller lug nuts... :eek:

    You did used to see more GM cars with broken-off wheel studs than Fords or Mopars. The 7/16" ones GM used seemed to snap off pretty easy.
     
  5. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 14,443

    Budget36
    Member

    Did you hand her the 0-.25 mic? ;)
     
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  6. KenC
    Joined: Sep 14, 2006
    Posts: 1,087

    KenC
    Member

    Or 5 on 4.5?
     
  7. krylon32
    Joined: Jan 29, 2006
    Posts: 9,892

    krylon32
    ALLIANCE MEMBER
    from Nebraska
    1. Central Nebraska H.A.M.B.

    After 40+ years in the chassis business the vast majority of the chassis I built had a 4 1/2 inch BP with 5 1/2 second and 4 3/4 third. Everything was 5 bolt.
     
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  8. AccurateMike
    Joined: Sep 14, 2020
    Posts: 690

    AccurateMike
    Member

    How about the least common...
    4x55.jpg 4 on 5.5. With the big hole you could stick a 4x4 locking hub through. '53-'62 Anglia/Prefect/Popular. The only other thing that ever used this pattern are "Caravans" (campers), from the other side of the pond. I'm going to make 15's out of 13's. I have the blanks. No hope of buying such a wheel anywhere.
    BTW, Suzuki Samurais also were 5 on 5.5.
    Mike
     
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  9. Mr48chev
    Joined: Dec 28, 2007
    Posts: 34,851

    Mr48chev
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Can of worms.jpg

    Ya done it this time Ned and opened a big one.

    For most of us it is going to depend on a few things.

    The front and rear brake and axle setup we run.
    The specific choice of wheel. = Original oem wheels fit best on the hubs they were designed for.

    I've Been eyeballing the Industrial Chassis crossmember for my 48 for quite a while, Spendy but built like a railroad bridge strength wise and it uses all Dodge Dakota pieces, With the Brake swap that works using 12 inch big car or truck rotors I could end up with a 5 on 5-1/2 bolt pattern on the front with the Dodge B200 Rotors that I have in the shed that Match the Ford Nine inch I have for the truck, I'd still have to narrow the rear end and shorten the axles but no redrilling the axles. I've already got a set of ?? year 15 inch Ford pickup wheels that work fine with my hubcaps of choice. If I go that way it sure will mess with the tire store kids head when tire time comees.

    I'm not that much of a hard core Chevy guy even though I have had my 48 for most of the past 49 years. I've owned way more Buicks, Olds and Cadillacs than Chevys. Bolt pattern doesn't mean a lot but I'd like to have the back match the front.

    As far as 5 on 4-1/2 or 5 on 4-3/4 bolt patterns on old Ford hot rods. Wheel choice and ease of hunting down has a lot to do with it. You can't find some of the really cool custom wheels with a Ford Truck bolt pattern. That includes the old wheels that we search out because of their cool factor. A lot of them were only made in 5 on 4-1/2 or 5 on 4-3/4 back in the day. Then think about the guys hunting for cool older wheels for a Six lug bolt pattern. Go to the tire store and all they have in narrow 15 inchers that fit are trailer wheels.
     
    Ned Ludd likes this.
  10. Ned Ludd
    Joined: May 15, 2009
    Posts: 5,218

    Ned Ludd
    Member

    I'm trying to cross-reference historic wheel bolt patterns with later hub hardware, in the interest of ease of availability, to see what kind of overlap there is.

    It's looking like the GM 5x5" is the orphan here. No OEM used it which didn't have some kind of link to GM at some time. The GM 5x4¾" is also pretty much limited to GM, Jaguar, and a few exotics like Lamborghini and new Bugatti. That could be expanded to 5x120mm, which used to be unique to BMW but which a lot of manufacturers use these days, including GM, if "wobble bolts" are used — the radial difference is only .013" — which presupposes a hubcentric wheel-hub interface. (It should be possible to adapt a typical historic wheel to be hubcentric by using an adaptor ring. I'd submit that designing a wheel to have one large bearing surface which is actually weaker than five tiny ones is something you'd have to set out to do deliberately, so old wheels are probably as good as hubcentric by accident.)

    Ironically, the early-Chevy 6x5½" is actually a fairly common bolt pattern these days, far more common than any other GM bolt pattern. A lot of Japanese pickups use it; common as mud in my part of the world.

    As @AccurateMike pointed out, the Ford 5x5½" was used on a lot of other things. It was used on many Jeeps, including, if I'm not mistaken, the WWII military type. It was consequently also used by manufacturers who got their start in licence production of Jeeps, like Mahindra in India.

    The winner seems to be 5x4½". It was common enough from the early '50s, and is the most common bolt pattern in the world today. The range of hub parts available for that pattern is enormous.

    The closer a build is to a clean-sheet design, the more the choice of wheel/tyre sizes should be one of the very first design decisions. That gives a range of available wheel and tyre options and in turn a range of bolt pattern options, and hence a range of options for hubs, axles, etc. Surely it makes sense to know what hardware you're designing around?
     
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  11. corncobcoupe
    Joined: May 26, 2001
    Posts: 7,952

    corncobcoupe
    SUPER MODERATOR
    Staff Member

    Must have been a full moon yesterday.
    Remember, any bolt pattern the most important thing...... is your nuts !
    With out them you're screwed.

    BwhaHAha...I crack myself up.
     
  12. Budget36
    Joined: Nov 29, 2014
    Posts: 14,443

    Budget36
    Member

    So glad you’re in a room by yourself, do they ever clean the padding on the walls there? ;)
     
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  13. X-cpe
    Joined: Mar 9, 2018
    Posts: 2,088

    X-cpe

    Lincolns from at least the 70's had 5x5". I've got a nine inch (9 3/8" housing) with disc brakes from a 77 Mark? and another one from an indeterminate year with drums.
     
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  14. jnaki
    Joined: Jan 1, 2015
    Posts: 10,172

    jnaki

    upload_2022-11-23_3-47-34.png
    Hello,

    For us in 1958 to 1964 was a standard Chevy bolt pattern based on a 56 Chevy Positraction rear axle set up we purchased at the local junkyard. It was very common and inexpensive. The plus factor is that it fit into the 1940 Willys Coupe without much modifications and installation.

    We bought a pair of narrow Bruce Slicks for the Impala, wanting to find out how much it improved the performance at the drags and on the street when necessary. So, the Bruce Slicks fit in the rear opening of the Impala without any modifications and had plenty of clearance. The Impala had 4:56 Positraction factory gearing. So, that was step one in the process.

    Now, after several years of racing (on and off) at the Lion’s Dragstrip and the local streets, the slicks worked extremely well. When we were moving on to the next step of building a car for the Gas Coupe and Sedan class, we selected a complete 1956 Chevy Positraction rear axle set up. Low miles and in great shape, as we inspected the gear teeth and axles.

    We installed the 56 Chevy rear axle and now we fit the 58 Impala narrow Bruce Slicks under the lip of the rear wheel openings. They, also fit well and had no rubbing at any level of the stance, under full power or being towed. The Chevy rims were the same size and it was a common practice to have all Chevy rim bolt patterns on our cars. Towing tires to the narrow Bruce slicks... all Chevy bolt pattern.

    Jnaki

    So, from December of 1959 to August of 1960, the 7 inch Bruce Slicks on the Chevy rims were the most useful set up for us. The Impala, dual purpose. The 40 Willys, strictly dragstrip only after we drove it around on the street for several weekend nights. They even had some time under a friend’s 57 Chevy White Bel Air for some heavy duty street activity on several occasions.
    upload_2022-11-23_3-48-58.png Similar look
    The common thing was to keep the rims the same brand and the bolt pattern was always Chevy. The Willys had the Willys bolt pattern in the front, but those were for our set up and run tires. When our last set up change was in the drawing books, we were going to get Chevy bolt patterns on the hubs and next set of Halibrand mags, all around. Keep it simple when in the last finishing stage.
    upload_2022-11-23_3-49-48.png
    We did have the Chevy bolt pattern Halibrand front rims and the wider Halibrand rear rims ordered and were sitting in a garage warehouse in Los Angeles. But, we had to cancel the order and return them in August 1960. The wider Halibrands for the rear were sitting next to the larger M&H rear slicks that also came in the order.

    That tire and wheel package was one of the last steps in our final 40 Willys build. But, unfortunately, we had to send them all back. Bolt pattern? Why Chevy, of course.

    Note:

    upload_2022-11-23_3-50-32.png customized by @themoose … thanks

    The only standard change over for mild customs was to redrill all of the hubs and axles for a standard 56 Buick pattern. Why, to fit the custom Buick Skylark Wire Wheels for the final look and cool appearance. When they all got stolen one summer night, the replacement wheels were black steel Buick Rims. It was the only 1958 Impala with black Buick rims, when we sold it to the next generation of teenage cruiser/racers in our stomping grounds.

    upload_2022-11-23_4-0-19.png
    From stock Chevy rims to 15 inch Chevy rims Moxley Cheater Slicks and Bruce Slicks on the back, to all black Buick rims when sold in 1964.
     
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  15. Rand Man
    Joined: Aug 23, 2004
    Posts: 5,078

    Rand Man
    Member

    Did that switch in 1949 to 5 on 4.5 happen across the entire product line of Ford Motor Company? Example: I have a 1950 Lincoln. I suspect it might be 5 in 5.5.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2023
  16. Rand Man
    Joined: Aug 23, 2004
    Posts: 5,078

    Rand Man
    Member

    Googldoggle says 5.5

    EC525F92-E0B2-4092-8457-505B560C1210.jpeg
     
  17. drtrcrV-8
    Joined: Jan 6, 2013
    Posts: 1,750

    drtrcrV-8
    Member

    5 on5 was used on Studebaker trucks, larger Buicks,'58 T-Birds & large Mercs &'70s Lincolns(mentioned above). Probably should look at the large Oldsmobiles, Pontiacs, Cadilacs, as well as the senior lines of all the Manufacturers, before writing them off as "insignificant"!
     
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  18. lippy
    Joined: Sep 27, 2006
    Posts: 6,848

    lippy
    Member
    from Ks

    I've been looking for 2 chrome reverse 14x6 or 7 for my 62 impala and all i can find is ford 4-1/2 pattern. I even have a pair of NEW ford pattern chrome reverse so I'm gonna say ford 4-1/2 5 bolt are the most common in those. ?????
     
  19. 1biggun
    Joined: Nov 13, 2019
    Posts: 613

    1biggun

    Were a lot of tri 5 chevys running olds rearends when I was young.
    57 olds in my 57 vette .
    All 5on5 as is all the chevy 2WD picks up from about 67 or until what 98 or later . So millions.

    Many dragster were 5on5 back in the day. I have a set of magnesium Americans in 5on5 of a old dragster.
     
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  20. It certainly wasn't 5x4.25". What the heck even uses a pattern that small and would be considered a HAMB relevant car?
     
  21. KenC
    Joined: Sep 14, 2006
    Posts: 1,087

    KenC
    Member

    .
    early 60s Mopar A bodies. The only sizes available were 13 and 14s. Rare today.
     
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  22. Starting out, I never gave a thought to "wheel sizes" and just drove whatever was on the series of used cars I had until I was a couple of years into my twenties........ which coincided with the advent of "muscle car" offerings and me having personal credit to buy cars and car stuff on the "99 Easy Payments Plan".
    So, I'm full of piss and vinegar in a fresh offering from the car dealer, an auto loan coupon payment book, and a double-O license to kill 4-door station wagons. Those days, I'm living paycheck to paycheck, but do have a little discretionary spending money in my pocket and I'm convinced that I need slicks for-da-track. I should mention that I'm a "GM guy" and it's the mid-1960s so I start looking for what I called "small GM" bolt pattern steel wheels........ new ones. But I want 15-inchers because my new "slicks" are 15", ya know. So my wheel education gets a kick start as I find out that "small GM" 14's and "big GM" 15's are different bolt patterns. WTH?! Why did they do that?
    So, after immersing myself in a crash course in wheel school for a few days, I wind up buying a pair of "big Corvette" 15" steelies that have the "little GM" bolt pattern.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2023
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  23. Bandit Billy
    Joined: Sep 16, 2014
    Posts: 13,770

    Bandit Billy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I have often wondered why the 5 lug wheel pattern was not standard in the US. It would have made it a lot easier to buy wheels. Everything I build gets 5 X 4 3/4. That way everything in stock, including paint rollers, fit whatever I am playing with. And there is always a spare.
     
  24. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 20,153

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    Yessir, even my hose reel is 5 on 4&3/4 bolt pattern!
     
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  25. Bandit Billy
    Joined: Sep 16, 2014
    Posts: 13,770

    Bandit Billy
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Think how easy it would be. You see a guy with a flat, everyone has the same bolt pattern, easy peazy. If I ran the world, it would be simpler, kinder...and chrome plated.
     
  26. tubman
    Joined: May 16, 2007
    Posts: 7,369

    tubman
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    My era? Wide-5.:D
     
  27. LOL I have sourced parts to match my wheels before. :D

    @Ned Ludd I was born in the mid '50s but I am basically a '60s kid. The bulk of the cars and trucks I have owned or built have been built between '53 and '68. So 5 on 4.5 and 5 on 4.75 are common for me. A few 5 on 5.5 as well or 6 on 5.5.

    Early A body MOPAR were 5 on 4.25 and were not commonly used by anyone I knew.

    Most of the purists are going to say 5 on 5.5. I define hot rod a little more loosely than that. My current ride would not be considered by any of them. ;)
     
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  28. It seems like I have acquired quite a few old GMs with bad rusted lugs. I have actually taken a breaker bar and snapped them off on purpose. LOL

    @Ned Ludd here is something to add to your list, several vehicles that we may consider to be hot rod fodder left the factory over the years with lug bolts instead of lug nuts and/or left and right handed lugs.
     
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  29. seb fontana
    Joined: Sep 1, 2005
    Posts: 8,834

    seb fontana
    Member
    from ct

    Super:rolleyes:
     
  30. -Brent-
    Joined: Nov 20, 2006
    Posts: 7,528

    -Brent-
    Member

    And when it comes to aftermarket wheels, it seems like there are a lot more of Chevy-pattern wheels available, which make the Ford 5x5.5 wheels more expensive. I'd have a rack full of aftermarket options if I went Chevy pattern.
     

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