Hello everybody, About a year ago I aquired a '51 pontiac 2dr body shell that has had the roof cut off of it. It came with a frame seperate from the body and the frame has nothing attached to it. No suspension, steering, crossmembers or plumbing of any sort. Just a big red rectangle. I haven't been able to find any of the pieces I need to put the frame back together in it's original form and I am not really sure I want to anyhow. I am wondering what some of my options are for swapping in a newer frame. I have heard mention of using a newer Caprice and I have been told to use a S-10 but all of this is just casual hearsay. Does anybody have any good advice or links to some site with a build thread that could help me to make a more informed descision? I could probably find a donor pontiac and just swap in an original style frame but I don't really want to spend a couple of thousand dollars just so that I can have old equipment that requires a full refit and another pontiac body shell in my barn. It just seems to me that if I have to spend a couple grand on a frame, why not upgrade? Folks around here seem to believe that any old rusty basketcase is only a quick buff from the barrett-jackson auction and they want slightly above top dollar for their junk. (well, not junk, but a 3/4 dissolved car is not worth $2000 to me.) Thanks for any tips or thoughts you may have. Evilhorde. Edit: Yes I can use the search function, and yes I am doing that right now.
I`m not sure where you are, But I have a 50 pontiac complete car with title here in Virginia That I`m not going to use. Somebody cut the roof to do a chop but didn`t have a clue what they were doing. The front clip is nice and so are the doors. If you want it send me a pm.
yeah, I think the distance would keep it from being a good deal. It`s a shame what was done to the car. but it can give up its good parts to help save a few others.
This is what I came home with: Floors are good, braces were welded in before the roof was cut. Just too bad about having nothing attached under the frame. It came with some straight front axle and a rear both painted the same red as the frame. As well as convertible roof irons, rear skirts and a ton of assorted random stuff. I guess the fellah had a plan. He was in the hospital dying of cancer and I got the car from the new homeowner before he had it hauled to the crusher so I never met him or got any idea of what he was thinking.
Make sure with what your dealing with , American Pontiac and Canadian Pontiac suspension parts do not interchange. Canadian Pontiac use the Chevy suspension.
You currently have a frame that fits the car exactly and appears to be in good condition. Here's what I'd do. Find yourself a non running pre-'88 Juguar XJ sedan. Usually from $200 - $400. (I had to give $500 for mine, but it was a runner!) Swap out the front and rear suspension systems. Both units unbolt from the Jag en bloc. The front system seems to be a natural for the '49 - '54 Chevy frames, I'm assuming your Canadian Poncho frame is the same as or closely resembles the US spec Chevys. This swap has been done lotsa times. Do a HAMB search. The rear suspension is contained in a rectangular steel cage. Some fairly basic fabrication should let you bolt that up without too much angst. So for a few bucks and some sweat equity you now have excellent suspension, rack & pinion steering, 4-wheel discs and probably a decent rear end ratio (those do vary some.) The track width is correct, and it even uses the same wheel bolt pattern. Sounds a hell of a lot easier than a frame swap!
I thought the Jag track width was wider than the Chevys but I did not really research it too much? The biggest problem I would have around here is finding a Jag donor . I think this would be a nice swap for my 51 Chevy...
Here are a couple HAMB threads that get into the IFS swap on various cars. There's a lot of reading there, but a lot of good info, too. http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=392990 http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=381637 This thread is from a different site, and is a swap into a a totally different type of vehicle ('53 ~ '64 Ford F100). I've included it because it has some really detailed images of the Jaguar components, and the author's thought processes, problems and solutions would likely be of benefit on any swap. http://www.how-to-build-hotrods.com/f100.html
Thanks a lot, Retro. You have been very helpful. It so happens that a cousin of a co-worker has an XJ-12 hiding behind his house gathering moss. "I love it when a plan comes together"
Are you sure about that? I'm not doubting your word, and I'm certainly no expert, but I have done quite a bit of research on the subject. I've never heard there's any difference in the dimensions of the 6 vs. 12 sedan suspensions, other than heavier springs to support the V12's additional weight. I emphasized the word sedan, because I believe there is a different wheel track on the XJS sports model. That's a whole different automobile. It's kinda hard to gather some of this information. Most online sites that offer any dimensions at all usually don't bother with wheel track. The few Jag widths I did find listed were all over the board, varying by as much as 6 inches for the same model! From my research, the correct Jaguar donor for a '49 ~ '54 Chevy should be a '68 thru '87 Jaguar XJ sedan, series 1, 2 or 3. In 1988 the newer series XJs were introduced. In Jaguar parlance this is the XJ40 series (although they were still called XJ6, XJ12 etc. - can be confusing as hell.) This series is a whole different critter! No hard info available regarding suspension swaps, other than some vague references about them being "too wide". Pervert that I am, an XJ40 is what I ended up with for a donor. Guess if I'd get off my ass and out in the shop I could shed some light on the subject! The only thing I can report at this time is that a rough front track width check between my '50 Chevy sedan and the '90 Jaguar showed the Jag to be only 2" wider. Keep in mind that doesn't account for different wheel offsets, tire widths and etc., just the overall width, stock for stock.
Retromotors I saw somewhere that the track is wider. It may have been the xjs 12 cylinder. I have a 93 XJ40 that I am using for my 49 gmc. Several sites list the track as the same as the GMC/Chevy 47-54 pickups. I know that the mounts are different and if you plan to mount the axles as Jag did you need to keep the arms on the rear and keep the Steering joint because of the flex in the rubber mounting. I have already made $500 off parts over the $700 original cost. Still have a ton of parts left to sell. Just can't bring my self to use any of the electrical parts off the Jag due to the reputation for electrical problems.
HA .... I hear ya! I grew up dealing with Triumph, BSA, AJS, Ariel and other British motorcycles, so I'm definitely not a stranger to "The Prince of Darkness". I'm not sure which Jag you have, but on my '90 model a great majority of the electrical parts are Bosch. I think Lucas pretty much cleaned up their act, too. Somebody dragged 'em screaming and kicking out of the 19th century! Still, there's that stigma ....
I have the 93 XJ6. It has more relays and wire than the Space Shuttle. It ran great. drove it for about a month. The electrical had issues and when the battery wouldn't start it because of the cold I started parting it out.
The Jalopy Journal
