I’ve seen some builds on here with no front brakes… how well do these rigs stop? My racing background has me upgrading brakes and suspension before increasing horsepower. Not having brakes on the front axle seems foreign to me. Enlighten me why you would build a rode with no brakes on the front axle.
Anything with no front brakes today is either a drag car or something emulating a drag car. The idea is weight reduction, and hot rodders in the 60's-70's did what the drag racers did. However, guys back in the day drove in traffic of that era. Any car in today's traffic has to deal with trying to stop as well as the modern car in front of them. I'd be willing to guess the average '26 Corolla can stop as quickly as an Indy car from 1970. Things have changed and the public has no idea that your T bucket can't stop like their modern car. And the idea of "being careful" won't save you when some knucklehead sending a text, looking at a map app, trying to adjust the defroster (on a screen) while sipping a $7 latte pulls out in front of your pride and joy.
Model T's didn't originally come with front brakes. Barely any for the rear either. Mine is pretty fast for a T and keeps up with traffic just fine. It has extra rear brakes but still no fronts. You just drive it with the ***umption it has no brakes at all. Always keep an eye out for an escape route if you don't want to rearend any one and never follow too close. Zach
I don't believe that it is even legal in most states to not have front brakes on a licensed street driver car.
Hello, Yes, T buckets were a thing for some time and most did not have front brakes. I have to admit, it was a little shaky driving down the street with such a small car and big motor with no front brakes. But, it was for a customer and getting the experience of riding in a small open custom roadster. The sound of the motor sitting in plain sight and the take off from a stop sign sure made one feel like flying over a road surface, which we did. The T-roadster was built to drive and also could be in any car show. It was well built and fit right into the looks of the time. The San Diego Prowlers’ Fred Castro had a very nice roadster for the experience. It was a tight fit, but both of us squeezed into the seats for the ride. Jnaki No, my wife did not want to go for a ride in the open roadster. She had her choices well set. Ha! But, as the history of the roadster goes, back then the roadster could be seen on most highways in So Cal cruising to events, everywhere. Eventually, front disc brakes were attached and now the stopping power was a good as the “go” power…YRMV
Extra fine looking T you have there.... Ol' Speedy Bill Smith used to say every youngster needed to learn to drive in a Model T and would wind up as a better driver as a result
I do not think it's any different then driving a big 80,000 pound truck that do not stop like most p***enger vehicles, need to be observant and aware , Just thinking maybe every vehicle is under brake sized ?
This is a traditional hot rod and custom site. A few traditional cars did without front brakes. Some people build to that design. There are other cars that have single masters, drum brakes, spoke wheels, old tires and a host of other things that are not the most up to date in terms of vehicle dynamics. They are building for their fancy and use. I would never build a Porsche race car, but if that makes you happy, go for it.
Sprint cars only have two one on the left front one on the left rear. Over the year many oval trackers have shut off the left front on light 1/4 bull rings for better corner entry. Front breaks are not always an advantage.
I’m asking about street cars… Even my dad’s A/A dragster had front brakes… it was not street driven or street legal. His first dragster was a model T (body). I will ask him if he had front brakes on it…
Like mentioned above. With today's inconsiderate drivers and a world of cell phones, I wouldnt risk it on a street car. I feel I'm already pushing things with 90 year old parts, a single mc, and drum brakes. I wouldnt feel comfortable with brakes only on 1 axle. Just my 2 cents.
Two come to mind. "Because it looks awesome" is probably the right answer. Functionally, well, they're hot rods.
Model Ts used a transmission brake as the primary brakes. They had that and a parking brake. The Rocky Mountain brakes were an aftermarket add on.
I'd never build anything street driven without front brakes. My concern is most of those t-buckets etc back in the day with only rear brakes weren't driving down hiways with 70mph speed limits, cars around them that had the short stopping distances of cars today. Not to mention all the distractions today, cell phones, google maps, center touch screens etc. Add into the fact that a lot of race cars did it, they did it with nothing in front of them but the very end of the track, their brake system is used basically once then allowed to sit and cool down whereas in-town driving that single pair of drums is constantly starting and stopping building heat and brake fade. I understand it was a fad and I'm cool with that but so was thin wall/exhaust tube roll bars, gas tanks mounted on the front bumper etc but it doesn't mean I'd want it on anything I drove on the street. Also being careful isn't always the answer, I've seen plenty of accidents on this forum that wasn't the drivers fault. When it's just you, you have to watch out for every other idiot out there and in today's world there's plenty. I had many many close calls on my motorcycles growing up and none were my fault, for that very reason after 20 yrs of riding I finally sold my motorcycle... ...
It was fairly common on semi tractors of the 60's, 70's, and even early 80's to not run front brakes. The logic behind it was that straight axle I-beam front suspensions of the era didn't have good anti-dive characteristics, and in a panic stop situation, the front would dive, unloading the drive axles, and causing loss of control, especially with early air brake setups that didn't have good bias control between the front and rear brakes. Plus the drive axles typically had much more weight and a larger contact patch, and ended up doing most of the real work anyways.
23,000 miles on my car, no front brakes, rear discs only. Simplicity is a reason, wheel choice is a reason (12 spokes are the best wheel ever made) but neither are the main reason. In my opinion, if you have properly sized (small) front tires on your hot rod, front brakes are a hindrance. When you hit the brakes hard, the front wheels lock, and then you are no longer steering, you are sliding. I have had a couple instances where things have gotten hairy with people pulling out in front of me, BUT I CAN ALWAYS STEER. Coming from building vw's, I've locked up my fair share of small front wheels. its not fun. If you look into the world of drag racing (only racing sport with a comparable wheel/tire size) you will find that they proportion up to 90% of their braking to the rear wheels for the same reason. you do have to drive differently, but in a small hot rod you should do that anyways. awareness is key. yeah, who's going that slow. To be clear, I'm not arguing that the ultimate driving experience is no front brakes, and I'm not telling you to pull off your brakes (unless you want to mount up those sweet 12 spokes) What I'm saying is you should cater your brakes to the way you drive and the tire size you will run. If you tried to run a set of dragster style front spokes with brakes, you'd likely destroy the wheel in a panic stop. either that or blow a tire. with my setup I have optimized my rear brakes, and decided that my car can run with no front brakes. your milage may vary. .
Two things....... There are way more types of racing than sprint cars, most of which benefit greatly by having better brakes. Front brakes are always an advantage on registered road-going vehicles. That's a no brainer.
Model T's came from the factory without front brakes so a stock one is legal. Anything else isn't even close to legal.
haha to be fair, I did steer away from hitting Erik. kudos to Asian man for not clocking me in his honda pilot.
I spoke with my buddy with 3 model Ts tonight… None of his have Rocky Mountain brakes. One of his, with a Ruxtel rear differential will get up to 65 MPH on the blacktop going down a hill. Back in the day on pre 1926 roads, maybe 40 MPH was top speed for a T. The band brake in the ****** was adequate unless a u-joint broke. The energy that brakes need to dissipate increases by 4x for every doubling in speed. Something about .5mv2… IYKYK I also saw my dad tonight, neither of his A/A dragsters had front brakes but they both had a chute in addition to rear brakes so there’s that. A street car emulating a 50s or early 60s drag car and skipping the front brakes is missing the chute and a long runway to slow down.
Hey, Olboy; "Enlighten me why you would build a rode with no brakes on the front axle.". BJA is pretty close. In the 60's, what eventually became referred to as a "Fad-T", quickly morphed into the no-front-brakes w/ skinny wheels/tires(even motorcycle tires). The Look, was derived & copied from the wildest stuff on the strip, the Altered - esp the Fuel Altereds. Hence, the rear axle being shoved forwards almost up to the buckets'-back, big fat tires(lots of times slicks, 10x16x~31" was the Top Fueler skin of the day), engine-room-length increased, the front end using suicide-style(not invented then/there, but became real popular), & the very thin-width front wheels, using acvw-sized tires, eventually using motorcycle tires on wires. No-one ever suggested it was the *best* choice/combo... . The small tire patch was problematic for any *real* stopping power, but The Look demanded that "solution". Does look pretty good(& clean), but I don't *think* I'd actually run w/o front brakes(although I have considered it - for a very specific type of rod, just to try it, since it could always be changed later) - even if they're only go-kart-sized, in my mind, *something* is better than nothing, although it'd need to be correctly sized - for that tire size used. Even into the late 20's, not all street cars used front brakes. I, however, like them on my stuff. Personal decision. "I’ve seen some builds on here with no front brakes… how well do these rigs stop?". & then there's wheel width(s) - wasn't 'till the mid->late 60s that decent widths were available. Lots of wheels @5", maybe 6-ish" was about it. So no great amount of braking/stopping ability there... (you *could* find some hoops abit wider, but they were pretty thin on the ground - at least from the factory...). Adding to the traction issue(s), since you brought it up, was most cars back then were shod w/bias-ply tires. ****-lousy grip for acceleration, ****-lousy grip for braking, ****-lousy grip for cornering, ****-lousy grip for ride, & ****-lousy grip for tire-mileage. Theme here... . As far as speeds in the 60's, haulin' it wasn't unusual at all, but also, as mentioned, most other cars' brakes ****ed hugexlarge too. Not today, & the *"quality"* of drivers' skills have seriously deteriorated, even though the cars have vastly better everything. Again, it's a personal choice, need to consider where you live, n drive, & esp who/what you'll probably encounter. ;( . A hot-rod T can sometimes get away w/o front brakes, as they're very light, ModelA & larger w/o front brakes is borderline suicide, imho & equally stupid, eligible for the Darwin Award, hopefully enjoyed by that one alone... Marcus...
A lot of dune buggy/sand rails are built with no front brakes. They often use steering brakes with a lever to shut off brake fluid to one side or the other. These vehicles are often driven on the street in some locations but are very light so can get away with no front brakes.
It does sound crazy coming from a racing mindset, but it’s mostly a traditional/hot rod thing. Back in the day, a lot of early rods ran mechanical brakes or pretty weak hydraulic setups, and some guys ditched the front brakes to simplify things, save weight, or just because the parts/setup weren’t great to begin with. It kind of stuck as a “traditional” style choice. That said, from a performance and safety standpoint, front brakes do the majority of the work—so a properly set up car with front brakes will always stop better and more consistently. Most modern builds (even traditional-looking ones) run front brakes for that reason. The no-front-brake setups are more about nostalgia and style than outright function.
Simple,if your going to drive on todays roads with todays cars around you,knowing cars around you have 4 wheel disk with a ABS or better,should do a lot,to keep stupid out of Q &A.< Only one "A",today you better have 4 wheel brakes { Fixing stupid is,sometimes too hard! }just let it die on its own !! }
The original question was 'how do these rigs with no front brakes stop?' The real answer is: Not worth a damn. Under the best conditions, no front brakes are marginal, at best. They sort of work with a light car that has undersized tires on the front. Driving slow helps. Rear disc brakes may help. Long stopping distances help. A parachute helps (but would be a pain when street driving). Being lucky helps. Enter into the no front brakes at your own risk, and have really good insurance, because you may need it (make sure the insurance company knows you don't have front brakes on a vehicle that should have front brakes, or they can legally refuse to pay out in the event of an accident). If you do not have a bone stock model T, and choose to have no front brakes, then use the rear end of my vehicle for your stopping ***istance, I will do everything I can to remind you just how stupid that decision was. Being cool, or having cool wheels are really poor excuses for having poor brakes. 50s & 60s semis and large trucks had really poor brakes, as did most cars up through the 60s. Someone without front brakes needs to tell me how they can steer out of a problem if the rear tires lock up.
The Jalopy Journal
