I would be curious where you got this figure. I bet I could find an insurance agent that would write a polikcy for $20,000. a month, as long as we are just guessing. If the building is owned, form a corp for the building. Then form another corp for the business. Lease building from the first corp. That is what Corporations are for, to protect personal assets. I know of a business that has been doiong this for 20 years that I know of and is still going strong. Owner is on the premises every day and loves it.
Update: Insurance so far is looking at $10-15k a month. Right now it is tied up in underwriting so we will see. Thanks again to everyone who offered opinions and ideas.
CHECK THESE OUT -liability insur, rent, overhead, utilities, permits, disposal fees, restrictions of property useage, parking spaces, number of employees, LABOR LAW REQUIREMENTS FOR YOUR STATE, fees(phone, alarm system,) computer, inventory space for tools, ADVERTISING, ETC., ETC.
I had that same idea years ago and never did anything about it - just saw an ad for that exact thing in the recent crusin news.
Agreed, with the way things are panning out with my CPA and insurance agent, in today's day and age the running cost are raising the shop rate need to high to bring in customers. (They may come in but they would be running when they saw the price) Oh well.
To answer just the question you asked. No, i would not be interested and $0.00 would be a reasonable rate. If I only need a space for a few hours, I'll just do it in the street in front of my house. If I had to do something that was very time consuming, any hourly rate would be too costly. Just my two cents!
Read post #2..than #14.. bummer..it would have been nice..but definetly in another time and place for sure
Good call, the lesson's learned and information gathered were all well worth the effort. I'm glad I went through things with a fine tooth comb before I made any moves that would have gotten me in over my head.
I would not be interested. I had friends who did this in Toronto, it did not work out. Better off to have a storage place with detailing, I think that would be a better business model.
This is what the Military bases do for us G.I.'s they have stalls and lifts. i know pricing is different and everything costs outside the gate. i.e. electricity and water and such. they charge 4.00 for non-lift stall and 7.00 an hour for a lift stall. they have all the basic handtools you would need and most pneumatic ones as well. if someone loses a handtool you charge em what it would cost to replace it. you inventory the box when you get it and inventory it again when you leave. you mop up, pay and get the hell out. i've thought about opening a "auto hobby shop" once i get out, but the wall i keep running into is the liability insurance like people have said. i spoke to a buddy of mine who actually did this in FL. he borrowed tools from one of those auto part stores under the loaners program and rented out a building and charged people like 10 bucks hourly or somethingcheap like that. he said it paid off in the end. good luck in your ventures. Raf-
Now that you've received input as to what people would be willing to pay, please indicate, (since you know all about your costs such as insurance), what you would have to charge just to break even. Since HAMBers aren't your target market, there's no harm in sharing. I'd be curious to know, as, surely, others here would as well.
It was coming out at $50+ an hr with 6 bays busy 10hrs a day 7 days a week. That was with the only employees being myself, my wife and one other.
Ever since I read and watched the book/movie Christine, I have wished with all my heart that there was a well equipped garage where I could rent out a bay and share tools and experience and knowledge with other joes who weren't flush with cash but overflowing with communal know-how. Sigh. If you can overcome all the namby-pamby insurance liability and environmental issues, I'd say go for it. Lord knows I REALLY could have used something like this in High School.
Thank you. Now's the time to gently and politely point out that many HAMBers here recommended(for free, and got derision in return) that you'd arrive at the same no-go conclusion for which you presumably paid at least a couple of professionals. The best return on investment that you got in this endeavor was what you got from the posters here.
Actually I had no out of pocket expense other then what I already pay for internet, cell phone, and maybe the cost of a pad of paper and 1 ink pen. Thanks though.
Did you say you were going to offer classes as part of this business? How much were you going to charge for those?
I think your involving yourself in it so much increases your liabilities and expenses more. I like the DOD garage plan. what makes it work is that the patrons have already met a standard for discipline and responsibility which the civillian public has not. That could be duplicated with a club owned or leased property. incorporate the club with a group of guys and require being sponsored in. if someone sponsors in a dufus and can't keep him in check then it's on that guys membership privileges. I've thought alot about it myself and how i'd have to cover my ass. With unlimited funds I imagine a central clubhouse/shop with opposing individual bays inside for work. they would have a wide avenue between them with demising concrete block walls extending to the ceiling or topped with firewalls. a gate for each bay rather than a door. individually toggled ventillation for each bay. a sprinkler system. floor drains in the commons area in front of the bays under camera where it would be harder to sneak dumping(expulsion if caught). an office area and hall for meetings and events. fire-safe storage units on the property with outlets, lighting , and sprinklers. A wash bay. A commercial paintbooth, several booth ventillated touch up bays, community equipment like hottank, welder, etc rented by the hour to pay for it. safetyclean recepticles for oil, antifreze, solvents. old paint. A clubmember could be given 1 outside storage bay as included in membership and would have to rent central facilities as needed. The wash bay would be coin operated this would keep everything open well managed and available. You'd have to have the club hire or appoint a property manager, secretary, accountant Security... night patrol. passcards or badges..whatever else you can think of. If you don't envision anything that big just open some fire-safed storage units with sprinklers, lights, and power and lease the units to people making them responsible for any unit maintenance. remember if you yourself do any work on the property then the irs can consider all income from that property to be self employment income not portfolio income. You could still have a paintbooth to rent out and post waste disposal information where they can dispose of solvents etc. If you collect oil and antifreeze some companies buy that stuff to recycle it. have all responsibilities in writing and require a credit card and check-in check-out punchlist and don't ask to pay for anything for but bill them and enforce that policy Buy the property yourself and lease it to the club and it will be portfolio income. If you own the property and have anything to do directly with the operation of the property or it's maintenance then it may be considered self employment income instead and you'd end up paying personal income tax plus self employment tax on the gross revenue instead of paying capital gains on the net revenue. You could also if renting bona-fide shop bays be strictly commercial in how you lease your space. lease only to individuals or clubs that can provide proof of insurance. I used to rent an apartment garage unit from a contractor who had done repairs for the aprtment company and did not get paid. the judge awarded use of the garages to the contractor untill his bill was settled and held the property owner fiscally responsible for any subsequent repairs to the property needing to be made by the contractor. he was renting them out for 35-40 a month and he let us work our my stuff there plus it was cross the street from a carwash so it was lawn chairs and beer watching the hotties wash cars on saturday
I didn't read the whole thread but my 2 cents is that it would work better if it were set up near a military installation.When I was in the military,the auto hobby shop was always full with a waiting list.But in Brentwood?County music stars have their own garages.....
I pay $200 a month for my shop space. It is a bit high, but I have full access to two lathes, a mill, TIG, MIG, ocy-acetalene, a plasma cutter and all the pneumatic and hand tools I will ever need. -drZ
I like the idea, kinda like the old Motor Pool my dad used to visit when he was in the air force. I'm sure you like the idea of helping out hotrodders but most guys who are into cars already have a place. More likely than not you would end up with non hot rod people trying to fix thier daily beater with a shitload of rugrats hanging out of it while they try to get to work. But I still like the idea!
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