I have been forced into finishing my 39 Plymouth with a 354 Hemi. The builder was not able to finish and now the first thing I want to do is start this massive engine. I bought it with the information that it is all new rebuilt, my question is can I cold crank the engine to get the oil where it needs to be or should I take out the distributor and spin the shaft. Also should I just use regular oil? Thanks Joe
Years ago the machinist that did the work on a SBF I built lent me a pre-oiler he made from an old brake pressure bleeder. Dumped 5 qts. of oil in the tank connected to the engine via the oil pressure port, pressurized it to 50psi, opened the line, and instant oil pressure. More recently I used an old paint pressure pot to do the same thing. I've also heard of guys adapting a garden type sprayer as well. Just a thought. As far as what oil to use be prepared for differenting opinions.
Camshaft type will dictate oil type along with engine history. Is it a new rebuilt, is it used with plenty of miles? How long has it sat not running? Priming is always a good idea no matter what shape the engine is in, if it won't build pressure, don't install it.
Put "Hemi tech Index" in search and start reading. You pull the dizzy & int shaft. You'll need to notch a rod to spin the pump. One person runs the drill motor the 2nd turns crank slowly with a breaking bar. There are 2 places where you'll hear the drill motor change, one is where one bank of rockers fills, and the other is where the other fills. Use break in oil, or oil with ZDDP additive. Oil for regular use should be pre-SM. If sitting quite a while you might drop the pan and spray additional lube on the cam.
The trick is when you have your short block done is to stick a welding rod down the rocker feed hole in the block . Slowly turn the engine over when the feed hole in the cam lines up the rod will drop about an inch. Mark the balancer then repeat on the other side . Saves a lot of time later.
seeing that you didnt assemble this engine i would make sure that the intermediate shaft is in properly engagement with the pump. there are a few main cap and shaft length combinations that can cause a huge disaster. dont over look this step.
By al means do not just spin your Hemi off the starter motor to try to prime. They don't work that way. George is pretty well correct.
Spark plugs out to make it easier on whoever you conned to roll the engine around. 1/2" drill, oil priming tool I borrowed. I ran the drill and my buddy turned the assembly slowly, two full revolutions. Always Gibbs break in oil for me. They cost far to much to get in a hurry at this point and cut corners.
I have a shaft that I use to prime by spinning the pump. I am out running errands, but I can get you the dimensions when I get back to the shop.
The pressurized can method is an easy way to insure oil goes where oil is supposed to go before trying to rotate the assembly. This can be especially helpful if you have any doubts as to the assembly process. The only place that will not get oiled will be the rocker shafts unless the crank is at TDC (pass side) or 255 crank degrees (driver side). If you don't want to build a pressure can you can buy one from Melling.
$14.95 can get you a priming shaft from Hot Heads: https://hothemiheads.com/oiling_system/oil_pump_shaft.html
Guess that I'm just getting lazy. A pressure can lets me do it all w/o additional hands and then not have to fuss with the intermediate shaft/gear vs oil pump notch. After 3-4 engines the Melling unit (or brand X) been paid for in labor savings. Most guys have enough material cluttering the shop to make one. Hell, make 2 and sell one...
One thing you might run into is the oil pump drive being different than what you expect it to be. A lot of rebuilt early hemi's are put together with a conversion kit that uses a later small block Mopar oil pump. The stock hemi pump is a slotted shaft drive, whereas the small block pump uses a hex drive. When you pull out the intermediate shaft you'll be able to tell what type of pump is in it. If it's all new rebuilt and hasn't been run, it's easy to peek straight into the spark plug holes of an early hemi to see if there are new pistons beneath those 90 pound iron heads to confirm that at least some of it is new..
Length: 18" Diameter: 0.4315" Slot depth: 0.375" Slot width: 0.1930" Or drop $15 +shipping. This fits a Melling M-50, which is the stock pump.
I second what he said, use a super strong magnet to pull the intermediate shaft and check the bottom end before ordering the priming rod so you are sure to get the right style. I keep a Hex and a Slotted Priming Rod on hand because they pretty much cover all 1951-91 Mopar engines. Just went through this process on a 325CI Dodge this weekend, takes a really tough drill to spin that much hydraulic pressure, but shouldn't take long to see PSI on the gauge and rockers (if you have the valve covers off). ~Peter
The Melling M50 is the direct replacement for the 392 and 315-325 Dodge. The 354 uses a different style along with a different style of pickup tube for the rear sump.
Assuming the 392 is similar to a 331; Before you do anything, make sure whoever did the engine work put the correct plug (1/4" NPT) in the oil galley. No plug, no pressure!
I built a flathead and wanted to pre oil it. I made a tank from some 3” pvc. One end was a cap and the other a screw off cap. A line was run to an oil port and pressure applied. Worked great for about $10.
I will take all of the information to action. One other question I have no way to put oil in with the valve covers on. Therefore no breather. Should I take the block off cover off and put a breather or put breathers on the valve covers. I would be ok with the look of the original type breather.
A real PCV system would be better. In any case, you cannot have a non-vented oil system. I mean, you can, but it will push out gaskets, and then vent itself, puking oil in the process.
I definitely want to vent the engine would the PVC system give better performance. I know Hot Heads has a nice system.
The PCV system will facilitate longer engine life. This might not sound like a big deal, Hemi parts are not cheap, and getting harder to find. A good PCV system will get spent combustion gasses out of the crankcase before they destroy the oil, and moisture out, as well, before it foams the oil, and causes rust. Yes. Breathers in the valve covers can act as the intakes, so long as they have foam in them. On my two, 354's, the PVC valve is there.
I my case my engine is recessed into the firewall. No choice but to use a pressurized system. In my autocross days I used an Accusump https://www.cantonracingproducts.com/accusump
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