Technical Overhead gantry - Thoughts on using wood

Ziggster, I'm not sure if you were planning to add support to the building as well as build a crane. Those boards will support anything you ever throw at them, but its just not ideal for making a crane. I think had you gone with steel you would have already been done. Not making these comments to criticize, but hopefully others will learn that using wood creates other problems and really isn't cheaper. The prices you quoted for the chain hoist and the trolley are a lot higher than Harbor Freight prices. Don't know if you can order from the USA or if there are any HFs in Canada.
Looked up the current prices and they are about $60. I know I get them on sale for less than that. I gave my son a coupon the other day for one of the chain hoists for $39. Some times its best to take a break from something thats frustrating and wait a few days till enthusiam returns......as well as energy. Happy New Year !

 

Agree that the wood is not ideal compared to steel, and I could have used the box sections as well for vertical supports, but it would be more fabbing and welding that I wasn't willing to put up with. The issue with using steel for the 14' span is trying to find something that would be suitable. Simple "I" beams for that span were too expensive new, and even a few used items were several hundreds of dollars and not the right size, length, etc.
Princess Auto up here in Canada is like Harbor Frieght, but of course prices are in Canadian $$$, and things here are usually more expensive than in the USA.
I have the forth vertical column installed, and will install the second main beam later tonight. Hopefully, all goes well, and starting tomorrow I can start fabbing up the truck assemblies from the 1 ton trolley.
It's all going to work out. Trust me. I'm an engineer. Lol.

 

Glad you still have a sense of humor. Wish I was up there to give you a hand !

 

Finally got the forth post installed, compressor piping rerouted, and second main beam installed. Now to get everything square and level. It is not too bad, except one corner is a little too low for my liking. I've already jacked up it up about 1/4", but that is as far as it will go. I may have to ream out some of 1/2" bolt holes to raise up the L section steel beam another 1/4" at the low end.
Overall, I'm very pleased so far, I hung off the cross beam that is just straddled temporarily across the two main beams, and nothing budged, and I'm 250 lbs plus.

 

I like seeing engineers getting their hands dirty doing the shop walk and building stuff...WAIT where the Heck did Ziggster GO...did he vaporize all that's left is his Boots...

Looks like a brick shithouse of Lumber...I haven't been following all your handiwork but I suspect that cross beam between the Runners is part of the Lifting beam not completed or was that to check the width.

I used to use a crane like that metal though to lift and move MD80 Wing Spars...it was damn handy with all the freedom of movement...You will be able to cover just about that whole space in movement...very handy...​

 

With some engineering trickery, I managed to raise the main floor support beam 1/2". That is as much as I'm comfortable raising the main beam without causing any possible drywall cracking on the main floor walls, etc. The floor was drooping a bit in this area anyways, so I kinda killed two birds with one stone. You can see my "spacers" sitting on top of the main vertical best. The 12 ton jack I used had no issues raising the main beam.
It is about as good as it is going to get as far as being level, unless I start reducing the height of the other three beams, which at the moment I don't want to do just yet.
Now to gets this square and parallel.

 

Managed to mod the 1 ton trolley by extended it 8". Turned out ok with some minor warping. Got it back some with my press, but I was afraid of cracking at the welds. I though the steel the trolley was made of was 1/4", but it was more like 8 mm. Had to return the 1/2 ton trolley as I managed to get one of wheel bearing cocked while trying to remove them. I gave up trying to get any of the wheels off after that. Good news it was on sale, so saved $40.
I'm going to try to finish things up today as long as there are no issues, but there always issues. Lol...

 

Keep us posted! I would like to see better pictures of the cross beam! Maybe I missed it but what is your goal in terms of capacity?
Also, around here you can find American made chain hoist all the time for $40 to $50. Same on the trolleys. But you do have to look for them. I have several of each , or did have before my son and my wife’s son raided my shop! ( with my blessing, lol) .








Bones

 

I'm going to use the 3.75" x 1.75" box section. They are rated at 2,500 lbs each on a 8' span which is essentially what I have. I'm only going to use the one, and weld two of L shaped sections to it for the 1/2 ton trolley to slide on. That will keep it simple, low profile, and way stronger than I'll ever need. I'm going to weld a 6.5" x 6.5" x 1/4" plate to each end of the box section, and then they'll be bolted at each end to the 1 ton trolley with qty 4 1/2" bolts.
Yes, here in Canukistan, everything is typically more expensive than in the USA, and then you add the 30% plus exchange rate, but we have "free" health care. Lol...

 

Yep, my brother in law helped with that program, some years back!







Bones

 

Had to call it quits for tonight. Was getting a bit cold in the garage. Going down to -12C tonight. All this grinding, cutting, welding is a bit much for a government desk jockey. Got to get ready to pass some papers at work tomorrow. Hope I can remember my password. Lol.

 

Hope your wearing a good dust mask...that is not necessarily good Iron for the system...can't wait to see you swinging around Vintage Hotrod Speedster on it...

Passwords are easy 123456...

 

Funny you mentioned that Stogy, ax I picked up some replacement filters yesterday as my mask was hard to breath through, so I didn't wear it on Saturday, but I should have judging by what was coming out of my nose.
The amount of steel dust on the garage floor was pretty amazing. Of course, the 1/4" plate I picked up from Metal Supermarkets wasn't sheared straight, and my cut-offsaw wasn't exactly square either. So, being the semi-OCD engineer I am, I had to get my steels plates square, which required a lot of grinding. Even grinding of the welds on the trolleys produced a lot of debris. Oh well, most of that is now done. I'll see if I can work on finishing week nights as I'm getting close.

 

I haven't compared pricing but all the metal I've ordered at Loucon metel to spec has been accurate (tape measure accurate ) and square. I've also had some 16 gauge channels made which were well made and I thought was reasonable priced.

Phil

 

I had Loucon bend up my chassis "C" channels from 11 GA. I asked for 12' long, they said they could do it, but it is not entirely square down the entire length, but I'm sure I can tweak it in my press as required. I've used them before, and as you said, they are reasonablely priced and fast. It's just that they are in the west end (I'm on the Quebec side), and they are not open on weekends IIRC.

 

Well after much cursing, much fiddling, and no alcohol, I managed to get the cross beam attached to the two modified trolley sections. I guess "truck" is the proper technical term.
It runs freely along the main beams. It can twist a bit between them, but it doesn't get stuck. Overall, I must say it turned out not bad. I've learned a lot about what not to do, and have much respect for the pros out there who don't get enough credit for the talents they possess.
I feel I should weld everything in place as everything I welded so far has managed to warp or shift during the welding process. I still need to attach the L shape sections to the cross beam, which I'll do in the next couple of days. I need a drink...

 

Actually it looks pretty good. If you are talking about welding the crossbeam to the end plates in addition to the bolts, I wouldn't. That part looks plenty strong. Leaving just bolts there will allow you to remove it if you have a wheel issue or need to shim or adjust later. I think you did a heck of a job, and the first time you use it..........you'll have a big ol smile because you now have it to use forever. One suggestion. I can't tell from the pictures for sure, but I would put some stops at each end of your long beams .
If you are warping, try welding shorter beads and letting them cool before welding more. And when someone gets on here and wants to build a wooden crane sometime in the future, you are now the "go to" guy for advice.......

You mentioned adding L shaped sections to the crossbeam. Looks like you are using an I beam for the crossbeam. If thats correct, I don't see the need to add anything but another trolley and a hoist or come--a-long .
Again, congratulations sir,.....,..

 

This gantry was (may still be?) displayed at the Peterson Museum... photos taken in 2006.
@Ziggster very neat setup you got there.

 

No, I'll leave the bolts. I was just referring to the welding of the main beam to the end plates and perhaps the welding of the L shape sections to the cross beam. The cross beam is just tacked at the moment to the end plates. It was actually very hard to get things aligned when welding the cross beam to the end plates, because the cross beam section was not square. The top and bottom are not square to the sides. See pic below.

It is actually amazing that such a thin walled section can support 2,500 lbs over an 8' span.
Luckily I had a floating protractor and just set the angle the same for the plates when attaching them at each end.
The cross beam is actually also a bit twisted along the longitudinal axis, and the first one I chose was also a bit convex along the same axis. All this complicated trying to get things square and parallel with respect to the end plates.
The cross beam is a box section (3.75" x. 1.75"), and too narrow to support the 1/2 ton trolley, so that is why I'll attach the L sections, but I realized doing that, made it too wide for the main support pin that came with the 1/2 trolley. Luckily, the main pin that came with the 1 ton trolley is long enough. I just have to enlarge the through holes in the 1/2 ton trolley plates to accommodate the larger diameter of the 1 ton trolley pin.

 

@Ziggster are you going to have an additional trolley on the cross beam supporting the block and tackle?...pretty darn cool...

I did snoop back a bit and saw your Parts list and believe that is the plan...however I am still curious...

 

Yes, that is the plan, otherwise I wouldn't be worth my salt as an engineer.

 

My father and my older brother were engineers - civil engineers - had no mechanical inclinations what so ever , needed directions for everything. My mother was the home. / auto repair person , when my father was getting dressed , her common line as he reached for his zipper was ," would you like the directions?" LOL

 

I'm hoping that it's just the angle the picture is on, and that your crossbeam will clear your ceiling lights...

 

It clears it by inch. At least this measurement was correct. Others not so much. Lol.

 

There are certain things that really need to be correct dimensionally. Probably the main one is the long rails being parallel to each other consistantly from end to end. Variations in height and slight bowing or twisting can be annoying but still work reasonably well. I knew that getting the ends of your cross beam right was going to be difficult. That was why I suggested the double angle iron brackets to increase the distance between the trolley wheels. With the double angle iron, the cross beam can be predrilled and bolted in place on one side . Then you go to the other end of the crossbeam and c clamp it to the angle iron braces. Then just drill holes through both pieces and insert the bolts. Its automatically in the right place. Trying to butt it like you did gives you a little higher placement for the crossbeam between the trolleys, but makes it much more difficult to aligh it and get the length right. They both work, but I learned that the hard way when building mine. Don't worry about perfect dimensions elsewhere, just see how it works and it may be satisfactory just the way it is.
On the bolts vs weld, I meant welding and leaving the bolts. I wouldn't weld, I'd just leave the bolts and go with them.
Keep going, you are almost there.............

I still think it would be much easier if you could just find an I beam for the crossbeam and save the metal you have for some later project.

 

You’re right about the angle iron and cross beam. You always want some means of adjustment especially on home-built stuff where accuracy is not the best. It's amazing how hard it is drilling holes and cutting steel accurately with just simple tools. A millimetre here, there, etc. It all adds up.

Just drilling the holes in the trolley plates, and cross beam plates took me over three hours. I paired the two cross beam plates and drilled them together, so that's 4 holes through 1/2" thick steel using a 1/2" bit. Then I separated them and used them as respective templates to drill out the trolley plates, so that's another 8 holes in total for the trolley plates. Then I had to ream out all 16 holes on each side to enlarge them for some play as 1/2" was the largest drill bit I had.

The idea of using an I beam is better for sure, but I used what I had purchased. Is it the best. No. Is it the most accurate. No. Will it work. Yes. Can I say I built it myself. Yes.

There is an old Russian Navy saying. "Perfection is the enemy of good enough". Lol.

 

I've been busy lately and just came across this thread. I'm a structural engineer and I've designed and verified load ratings of many monorails, gantry cranes, and overhead cranes in industrial facilities as well as crane lifting beams and lugs. I have some observations for the OP and some advice for others:

1. Wood typically continues to dry over time causing shrinkage and cracks. Wood that cracks and separates looses its original properties. If cracking or separation is observed, please reinforce or replace prior to use.
2. Wood at most home improvement stores is typically stud grade at best. Use professionally graded wood free of knots and cracks. You get what you pay for.
3. Steel taken past yield will still retain some strength but will start to elongate and sag prior to failure. Wood however provides much less warning and is prone to sudden failure. We have all heard of wood decks overloaded with people suddenly collapsing.
4. Wood screws are not be used for load bearing wood framing. Screws have much less shear strength than nails plus its not allowed per the building codes. When joining multiple plies of wood together use construction adhesive between plies and nail with at least 10d nails driving half from one side and half from the other. If the OP used screws please drive nails in between the screws that are long enough to engage all plies.
5. When figuring loading on a beam its more than just the weight of what you want to lift. If you want to lift say 500lbs don't forget the weight of the trolley and chainfall or electric hoist. Additionally, you need to add the effect of impact loads especially when using an electric hoist. Someone clicking it on and off to drop an engine into a car can cause a bouncing that amplifies the load. You need to add at least 10% of the total weight (everything hanging from the beam) for a chainfall and no less than 20% for an electric hoist. For a 500lb load rating I would design for about 700lbs.
6. Don't forget the load that can occur perpendicular to the beam in its weaker direction. If you are picking a load offset from the beam its putting the beam in torsion. Wide flange or "I" shaped beams are very poor in torsion. The beam should be checked for 5-10% of the total load in that direction. Additionally you want to brace the beam and posts laterally in each direction for stability.
7. The deflection requirement for monorails and gantry cranes is L/450. This not only provides for ease of movement of the trolley but also helping keep it from rolling away on its own.
8. If you're using a trolley on a steel beam or an angle many times the controlling factor is not the span of the beam but instead the thickness of the flange on which it is rolling on. The point load on the flanges can cause them to bend and in a worse case scenario the trolley can be pulled off the beam. Don't skimp on flange thickness.
9. If attaching to existing structure be sure to check the capacity of everything you're attaching to. Load path is key and the whole system can fail from a loss of a connection. Provide redundancy when possible and a high factor of safety.

If you do not know how to check all these items, please find someone that can. Lifting overhead loads is very dangerous business and can seriously injure or kill yourself or others. Just because something "looks like it should work" doesn't necessarily mean it will.

 

Thanks for the tips. Good to know. I'll add some nails to the main beams. I'm no structural engineer, but I'm a mechanical engineer and know of the concepts and theories you mentioned.

Nothing is attached to the house structure, and all vertical posts are resting either on foundation, or on floor joists. Those resting on floor joists are either directly above the main beam supporting my floor joists, or next to the foundation. They all have been blocked to spread the vertical load out from just one floor joist.

No electric chain hoist, and main cross beam is designed to support 2,500 lbs. At most I'll be lifting 500 lbs. Trolley for cross beam is rated for 1/2 ton. Trolley for main beams is rated for 1 ton. I've joined three 2" x 10" x 16' joists together that span about 14'. From what I could find, a single joist that size and span is rated for 1,200 lbs. Together with the attached 1/4" thick L sections (using qty 6 1/2" x 6" lg bolts) it seams things are sufficient strong for what I intend to lift.

 

Very good information. Myself, I always just over build and then test it. I find that I can usually overbuild for little more money than trying to build just strong enough. Later I have found I always end up lifting something that is a lot heavier than what I ever thought I would need to lift.I have built multiple cranes in my shop and my sons shop and never had a problem. I prefer using steel, but everyone has their own reasons for the materials they choose. Many people choose wood because they feel steel is too expensive. Some good and reasonably easy wood setups can be done.
I always watch for auctions and try to buy steel beams there because I know I can get heavy stuff reasonably cheaply. I have a whole trailer load waiting for me to unload it right now. The pictures I'm going to post are of a simple beam crane in my garage. It was one of the first ones I built. It would be really simple and pretty quick addition to anyones shop. Since I got such a large beam, I didn't have to worry about calculations. I'd probably be just as happy with a 6" I beam but I can lift anything with this. I welded brackets on top of the beam that stick up thru the ceiling on each side of the roof trusses. Then I drilled holes through the brackets and trusses and placed bolts thru the brackets sandwiching the truss. They give a lot of strength when any load tries to tilt the beam sideways. Bolted the uprights to the floor and added some braces where the uprights meet the I beam. With a little shopping around at auctions, scrap yards, and Craigslist you can usually find this stuff. It may take a while, but be patient and you can find stuff. Probably
$200/$300 would easily provide the needed used materials. I've lifted even heavier things than this with some of the cranes I've built. You do have to be careful when planning how to put large beams in place though.

 

Geeeze. I just saw your post. That is on a totally different level. Yes, if I had a proper shop, steel is the only way to go. I can't even imagine moving heavy machinery like that. Many times, old lathes, milling machines, etc have come up for sale, and they can weigh in the several thousands, so there is no way I can have that in my house. Perhaps, one day, I'll build myself a proper shop.
I finally finished up welding the L sections to the cross beam. I'm a very bad welder, but I think something is wrong with me machine as the wire seems to stop, and so does the arc. Perhaps it is because the wire is very old.
It was a royal pain, but I added welds about every 6 inches on the top and bottom of each L section. That was about 60 welds.
I quickly mocked it up and had to use the chain hoist to lift the damn thing into place.
It runs smooth. I'll clean everything up over the next few weeks so I can start actually working, and in the spring I give it a nice coat of paint.