Featured Projects Paint vs patina

You definitely need to get it running before worrying about body and paint. Since you mentioned it does not have any engine and transmission, before you try to find another stock engine/trans, consider why people usually remove them.

You will find the car a lot more enjoyable to drive if you upgrade to a more modern V8 with an overdrive transmission. While the stock stuff may sound intriguing, it will be a dog in todays traffic. Add A/C to an underpowered engine and even less response. When you do get on an expressway, you will be relegated to the slow lane and spend everyday watching semis appear in your rear view mirror........then pull out and pass you. Take whatever car you currently own and drive it in the slow lane at 60/65 mph somewhere and see if you enjoy the drive. I live near I-65, and have to haul a trailer occasionally, so I usually get in the slow lane and drive 70/75 and its not enjoyable. But that may be something you are comfortable with.......but I'd think about it some before dropping money into a small six with no overdrive.

 

Just a friendly reminder....these are not normal cars, engine swaps can be challenging on them, even for experienced builders.

 

Agreed, because of the torque tube rear , you'd have to swap rear axles as well, since there isn't a readily available open drive conversion available. So you be talking about custom 4 link or similar rear suspension as well.

 

Does steering and the suspension and chassis design make swaps difficult in these Ramblers?

I'm curious about the "not normal cars" comment.

 

Definitely. One of the most frowned on suspension conversions is the IFS in a prewar Ford; however, with the removal of the buggy spring and front crossmember you can fit about any V8 easily. I haven't done this but I've seen a lot of them.

 

My suggestion for you would be to paint the firewall and inner fenders and any of the frame you could get to. You won't want to do it later, so bite the bullet and do that first, then you can do the bodywork as you go.

 

I figured and at I one time I would have found it funny, but I am just burned out on all this fill in the topic of your choice....

-I don't like patina, you need to paint it
-I don't like channeled cars, you need to unchannel it.
-I don't like the way that built in period car was built you need to change it.

If someone asks for an option give it, but once someone has made their choice move on and get over it unless it is dangerous than by all means speak up, if you see an easier way to do something yes say something, but if no one asks don't give it!

 

I don't follow what your prewar Ford example has to do with the Rambler wagon this thread is talking about.

 

Earned patina...OK
Faux patina

Join a rambler or AMC club. Mention what your looking for and your location.
Probably score a good running original for very little from someone converting to a V8.

 

He's giving a more common example of how factory suspension can interfere with engine swaps

 

Roadside -- I was going to tell you I have a low mile 195.6 I'm selling, but wrong coast! There are a couple Rambler clubs in your area:
https://www.rosecityramblerclub.com/
https://www.facebook.com/groups/1045037616213087/
There used to be a third, Cascade Rambler Club, but they became inactive 5-10 years ago (times flies by when you're getting old!).

 

You want a girlfriend who's pretty but not too pretty.

Pretty enough that you're proud to take her places. Pretty enough that the other guys take notice.

But not so pretty that you're afraid to leave her alone.

Still, you wouldn't want her to fall in the mud and just leave it. Or wear the same spaghetti stained top all the time.

Or fart in church.

 

i vote hemi

 

I voted paint but I’m changing my vote.
I’m cutting some slack because of your age, at 16 get it running and enjoy it!
If your a true car guy, there will be plenty more cars that will come into your life, with luck you will have the same dilemma, deal with that question then.

 

The question to me isn't a simple question. My car while the paint isn't bad and there really isn't a lot of rust, if someone came up to me and said "hey, I'll paint your car for you for free", I'd let him. LOL

When I was putting it together I had just blasted the frame and was getting ready to paint it (simple black) when a buddy said to me that his dad had built a model car back in the early 60's and had painted the frame gold and he always wanted to do that. Off it went and he painted it gold.

I was cleaning up the fire wall and had to go back to work and I came back to my car and the firewall was painted (same guy).

Another buddy needed a ride to pick up a car (about 7-8 hours away) and I took him. He is going to flake my roof.

Maybe some day the whole thing will be painted.

 

I'd wash it really good, and put matte Patina Sauce on it.

That is easy, and will not prevent you doing something different later on.

 

As for powertrain, given the narrow engine compartment, and steering position, I would look for a running donor with a Small Block Ford Winsor. 289-302/5.0.

Grab the engine and transmission. Sell the rest for scrap.

 

Fake patina: To be clear I have never tried it or liked it. Recently on here a thread about how to fake magnesium look on aluminum wheels got great kudos from senior contributors. Fake paint patina? It gets a pass as well. Fair is fair.

 

Patina. I remember her.

 

It doesn't have to make sense...

 

I am not suggesting fake patina.

I am advocating cleaning it up, and getting an easy to apply, inexpensive preservative on it, for stability and longevity.

There is no powertrain in this car. That is obstacle enough. He's 16. He might want to drive it before he's 55.

Once the car is fully operational, he can move on to making it pretty.

 

Modernize the driveline, front to back. Easy-peasy SBC and appropriate trans/rear will make that car so much more enjoyable than the original, which was a dog back in the day when it was new. You'll have to address the suspension as noted. That should be more than enough to keep you busy for a while. Lol.
Andy

 

Save the paint for last. It's not terrible looking, just a few dings and spots. Wouldn't hurt to spray a matte (not shiny!) clear over it to keep the rust down, even with a spray bomb. If everything mechanically falls into place and you love the car, you can paint it later. Like gimpyshotords says, get it running and enjoy it! Paint was always the last thing I did when I was young too. Mechanics first, interior comforts second (well, except for seats... got to have something decent to plant your butt in, and a passenger!), then make it look good on the outside.

This is a torque tube car. That makes an engine transplant a little harder. The enclosed driveshaft also serves as the locating arm for the rear axle. Go to a modern trans and that has to go. It's possible to keep it, but more work and expense than swapping the rear axle. Late model Rangers (93-2011) have the right axle width (58.5"). You only need the 8.8 if going with big poser -- over 300 hp. The 7.5 is good enough for a cruiser with 300 hp or even more, as long as you aren't hammering on it (with over 300) and just running street tires that fit the wheels ells (practical limit is 215 width, 225 squeezes in but can scrub on turns and bumps). You can keep the original rear coil springs, but need something to keep the rear axle under the car. "Truck arms" are preferred, but people have done three and four links and even leak springs. See https://theamcforum.com/forum/rear-end-swap-5666-classic_topic11214_page16.html to see several ideas/installations. That's page 16 of a long thread -- look through the other pages also. There is at least one where a guy kept the torque tube in a 50s Nash, but it's similar to the 56-66 Rambler big cars. a friend in New Zealand has a 63-64 Classic with a Toyota five speed behind a later model AMC engine (I forget if it's a 232/258 six or 304 V-8) and has a similar setup to retain the torque tube. With a modern trans you're more likely to want a different rear gear ratio anyway.

I bought an entire 2003 Ranger for the drivetrain for my 61 Rambler American convertible (2.3L Duratec four, five speed auto, and the American models all have leaf springs and open driveshaft). A Ranger or Ford van with 4.0L V-6 drivetrain would be an excellent choice for your car, and you could use the entire drivetrain. You will likely need a custom length driveshaft though. If I had a big Rambler to swap my brother has a late 90s cargo van with a rebuilt 4.2L (pushrod, not OHC) V-6 in it that I'd use in a heartbeat.

As someone pointed out, the big car with the original 195.6 was a bit of a dog, especially compared to modern cars. It had the modern equivalent of 90 hp (127 hp in 1960s terms). It was built as an economy car and drove that way. "Adequate" is the best way to describe power. Good for around town and leisurely cruising, not for stoplight racing or long fast (over about 60 mph) highway cruising, especially with a load. People drove different back then! If you didn't want the best economy you bought a V-8 Rambler. Even the 2.3L Duratec I'm using in my car is a 40% increase in power over the stock engine. It would even be ok in the big car, but I'd use more engine -- at least the 3.0L Ranger V-6. It would drive/perform about like a Ranger.

 

My favorite new paint job is “mild” fake patina. BUT, it has to be so well done, that most people that look at it don’t realize it’s fake. Really quite a trick to pull off, but when you are driving the wheels off of it…no worry about a stone chip or scratch!

 

Clean it up, get it running, and enjoy it as is. Paint it down the road if you choose. Perfection takes time and money and I've seen it kill many a project. No to fake patina.

 

Paint isn't as important as the clear coat.

You could rattle can that car and put a good clear coat on it and it will last for years.

Flip side you can go all out on paint but, a cheap clear coat will have the paint peeling and flaking within a year or two.

For me, I use high UV resistant clear coat over Custom Kanz spray paint and m'y cavalier looks better than OEM 9 years later.

 

keep in mind this.... it cost the same to do this car as it does a 55 chevy... those ramblers when sold were sold by the pound... 55 chevy's are worth gold when done...

 

an old painter told me this years ago... over fifty..... if you paint a turd, even put glitter in the paint... when your done you have a shinny turd with glitter

 

if I was you at 16... the fun and learning would be to part that car out.... you learn a lot about cars taking them apart... hopeful that you didn't pay too much... that car doesn't have any value as the scrapers pay by the pound, and without the motor it won't weigh much....maybe if it was a 2 door wagon... but still... it'll never be worth a 55 chevy..... if you wanna learn to buff... good car to learn on....but not worth the compound...

 

heh...interesting take on it!

On the other hand, when I worked at a junkyard 45 years ago and there were still a lot more ramblers on the road than they are today, we had an early 60s Rambler wagon as a yard car. it lasted a long time, because no one every wanted to buy any of it's parts. It finally quit running and we started using trucks for yard cars, they never lasted long because someone always wanted to buy parts from them and make us money.