Been out of town for three weeks and finally got caught up on the HAMB and my mail. Ryan's thread on the demise of the POPULAR SCIENCE print edition and the recent thread on MOTOR TREND and HOT ROD going to quarterlies is most interesting. The January 2024 issue of HOT ROD has the STATEMENT OF OWNERSHIP on page 79 and therein tells a confusing tail on the print vs. internet when it comes to the automotive enthusiast market. HRM circulation dropped about 75,000 copies in 2023 to an average of 314,058 and the issue closest to the filing date was 250,178. Included in the information is the number of PAID electronic copies, 28,303 average for 2023 vs. 32,203 closest to the filing date. That's nothing more than a spit in the ocean! I suspect that YouTube and the HAMB have more to do with the death of print magazines than the print rags switching to online only content.
I must admit that I would rather spend my time reading threads on the HAMB than reading an advertisement filled magazine that maybe only a few articles may interest me. What I love about the HAMB is that every day there is pages of new threads and posts from a huge diverse group of enthusiasts, versus one authors opinion…
You guys do realize it’s not just car Magazines vanishing right? The magazine rack didn’t go from 30 ft to 3 ft because the car magazines are what’s missing. print in general is pretty well in its grave and it’s nothing new.
As print disappears people are exposed to less information, people only search certain subjects and aren't exposed to other subjects. When you read a magazine or newspaper there were articles on a variety of subjects and you were exposed to more information. It's the same with TV and the internet, people have the choice of channels and only watch the channel that tells them whist they want to hear and aren't exposed to other information or ideas. I'm an old guy and surprised at the amount of history my grandchildren aren't aware of, most schools don't teach cursive writing, kids use a calculator rather than learning to actually do math. I realize there is a world of information on the internet and use it quite often myself but people need to be exposed to all sorts of information from multiple sources. Well that's enough I'll get off my soap box now!
Unfortunatly print depends on both circulation AND advertising revenue. When one sorce of income starts to dry up budgets get squeezed and content takes a hit to cut costs. It then becomes a death spiral. Some magazines will survive some will not. It was only recently that i heard some folks on another forum lamenting the decline of interaction in forums because of the rise of facebook groups..... go figure!
Magazines will stay around but will become specialized in what they cover. Magazines will also become more micro-owned, keeping costs as low as possible but still delivering great content. Take, for instance, rodding USA? A print magazine that has what we are after and is owned and run by a tiny team of dedicated people. To keep the magazines going, it takes US to support them and promote who they are and how to get them. Here is a link to Rodding USA. https://www.roddingusa.com/
True. Example: The Jockey Journal, HAMB motorcycle version. was a very active and interesting forum when I signed up about 15 years ago...very little activity now. Facebook, Instagram, Redddit and so on.
My wife and I are paper dinosaurs. We still get a daily newspaper and pay bills with written checks. Only last year did we start using a credit card for groceries because at 8 checks a month they are used to quickly.
@Model A Gomez hit the nail on the head. I live in a somewhat rural area near Omaha NE. and a few mornings ago I walked to the mailbox to get our Omaha World Herald, it had snowed, I could see where the delivery driver had pulled up to our mail box and as I looked up and down the street of 20 plus houses, mine was the only one that got the paper. My kids and most (if not all) of my peers don't subscribe to a paper or to magazines. They don't read books and all of my kids have four year college degrees. My collection of Hot Rod magazines goes back into the 50's but I quit subscribing a year or so ago because there just wasn't much to tweak my interest anymore. Not sure where I am going with this rant (currently my wife and I have Covid...maybe I am not thinking coherently We actually subscribe to two additional papers, USA Today and the Epoch Times, we get totally different views on the same subjects, probably a good thing
you have that 100% backwards. any question that pops into your head can be answered on google in seconds. I am a You Tube junkie. when you search YouTube for a certain subject that page is full of things you did not search for as well.. yesterday a post on new 1/25th scale models coming out caught my eye, I clicked on it and as I went through the day more model car sites popped up. "all sorts of information from multiple sources" is what the internet is all about. anyone who only relies on a newspaper, magazine or the nightly news for current events these days is incredibly ill-informed. if everything I have learned from the internet over the last few years I had to learn from print my 40 X 40 12 foot shop would be stacked to the ceiling with magazines
I grew up in a house full of my mom's Ladies Home Journal, McCalls, Readers Digest, and 2 daily newspapers. I was reading all of it before I was even close to 10 years old. What I learned from the womens magazines should have kept me from making the mistakes I made as I got older. I am also the only one on my street to still subscribe to 2 daily newspapers. Stood in the checkout lane the other night at the grocery store. Picked up a Readers Digest to thumb through as I waited. I was glad to see it's still being published, and wondered how much longer it would last. It's not what it used to be, but I bought that issue, anyway. Think I'll subscribe to it now. Things change, I get that. Damn shame sometimes.
I like the idea of Hot Rod going electronic. In the '90s I was working for a smallish web based hot rod magazine. Someone on HRM staff made an editorial, actually a rant about ezines. Now they all want to go electronic. It is driven as much by cost as anything else. Printing is pricey. I read the HAMB and am an administrator for a a couple of bike forums. But when it comes to a magazine I still prefer paper. A forum is way different than a magazine. A forum is user driven a magazine is not
After Rod & Custom and Street Rodder called it quits, I looked at the prices on the covers and realized that over the years I had spent a whole lot of money on magazines. Now that I retired, I'm happy I don't have to anymore with my reduced amount of income. I do miss the ads, thinking that if I am retired, are all those places I wanted to buy stuff from retired as well?
All I know is that I can't balance my computer on my lap in the can (crapper, kazi, whatever you like to call the outhouse), and I sure can't read things off my phone, especially postage stamp sized pictures (even though I wear reading glasses) , so I will just keep re-reading my old magazines. The last magazine I bought was about 1978, nothing much more happened after that I give a hoot about anyway.
Pretty sure it only takes a half second more for news to reach OZ, you apparently didn't hear of that invention called the tablet. Big ones too!
Back when one of my job functions was to keep up with EPA regulation activities, my employer got me subscriptions to the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal. And that was exactly the reason. I'd look for the articles in both publications about a particular regulatory action, and compare and contrast the content. Where they matched was news, where they deviated was opinion. It was an interesting job function. NOT! But I was well informed about the topics of interest to management. The white papers were a bitch however.
The internet doesn't (can't) give me what I got from fifty years of car magazine consumption but then again print will never provide what the HAMB provides.
I use to say that there are pros n cons on all subjects. I was long time against internet n facefook till I joined many years later and spent before that time around 100 bucks every month for magazines till I stopped and met many gearheads I knew from magazines. I finally deleted facefook coz of their communism standards, got tired of being banned for some dirty jokes, last time I created an account there I got an account warning within 12 hours. Had over 1000 gearhead friends, an Ol' Skool Rods N Sickles group with nearly 15k members worldwide n a page with over 12k followers. Met many kool guys I knew from facefook in real life on some meetings like rumblers bbq or kustom kulture forever, even LiL Daddy RoTh in 2017 or so. We knew each other for many years n had lots of fun there, also if he was afraid to ride my skoot but a friend shot some pix of him sittin on it. I also met Nash from Japan at KKF in 2014, I was at first official rumblers bbq which was the second one but public from that time. So the second bbq was the first public around 2010. Was a small meeting n since then it grew up like hell in germany. But I like that some dudes create new ol skool magz n feature natural fuckers who piss on normal crap. Sure it can be another hard bread but hard bread is still better than no bread. A few months ago I joined shitstagram just to find some old friends again. There's a bunch of interesting stuff like hot rods, kustoms, chopper shit, skate metal hardcore punk, motorsports, engineering, bmx n so on but on the other site it's boring coz of many many posers collecting stupid likes n hearts there's less communication. I'm pretty sure dudes with 500.000 followers or more dont have really much friends in real life. Many are consum whores copying stuff n posing like playboy bunnies. I remeber last times I pulled some old magz outta the shelf I tried to zoom in with two fingers to check some details :/
And of course best of all, out in a garage with a hoard of car friends, bench racing! I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm better now than I was then...
Forums are mostly dying off. Even though the HAMB is very active it is a small subset of the car community and the content is very filtered. The idea that the HAMB is a major reason for reduction in print media subscriptions is pretty funny. Print media in all forms and many hobbies is dying off due to increased free access to the information in many locations including Facebook, Instagram, magazine websites, YouTube, etc. When I visit a newsstand a lot of titles I used to enjoy are no longer there (as they no longer exist or circulation is limited). I used to only get to see coverage of car events around the world by watching the magazines for their coverage. Now all I need to do is Google it a few days later. One thing that is likely not captured in those circulation numbers you saw in HRM are Motortrend+ subscriptions. With my $7/month to get access to their video library, live motorsports events, and more, I also get digital access to every HRM ever published, including the new issues as soon as they are released. I can't find HRM on newsstands near me anymore in a print copy either.
Whattaya do when the powers out? I read 1950s hot rod rags by candle light edit: by kerosene lantern light, yeah I have those
Our burden is that we care about something thar was developed a hundred years ago. The modified automobile. I was once informed that, "The only thing constant is change". As far as media goes, printed paper was much older than the car. ( My youth was funded by both ) Communication and technical progress became accelerated in the20th century. So hang on to see how this century unfolds. Just do not lose or toss those Sacred old mags, ( my four cartons went with a flood ) ------ change
Hello, The difference between print and the internet is the amount of time it takes to publish an article or layout for a presentation, like a zoom class. The magazines have always relied on the staff gathering information, verify most of it and then cut and paste into a story board for the spaces provided. If it is a tech article, they have their limitations and column/photo spaces. A feature hot rod will have more color photos to showcase the detailing. But since a full color page is expensive, there are more B/W articles on hot rods and general stuff. Color sells, so it is scrutinized the most by the editor, publisher and staff coming in a distant third. Although the staff or contributors have submitted their stories for a color front page shot. Then the editorial staff adds in wording to ruin the color photo that took time and specific composition to get it right. Then someone on the front page group moves the color centered photo of a hot rod over to get the wording on another feature highlighted. For photographers, the color sells, for the staff, the different articles are the main draw. But, who reads the technical articles for hours at home or at a news stand? Only if there is nothing else to read or set aside for a rainy day… etc. Jnaki We had plenty of great color feature articles ready to submit to the various magazines. For each article written and attached, there was always a great color shot with excellent composition and background with no trees or garbage cans next to the car, etc. But, the choice is always the staff and especially the editor. It is his/her monthly issue job and he wants to put his/her designs or choices for whole thing, let alone, the cover that is guaranteed to be color. This process takes time, which is money to the owner or major publishing company. So, quality is necessary and they are/were very specific as to their choices. If the photo was a 35mm color slide, and there was a 2.25 x 2.25 color slide next to it, the larger and more colorful one with the details is usually selected. The internet set up seems faster and easier to drop in a color slide and if the color is off, then there are programs to “touch” up the detailing. So, that is time and money saved. Note: Time and money… the key to success and longevity in the business. in the surfing world, the original surfer magazine lasted as long as it did and then had to fold. The next powerhouse magazine, surfing, took over and lasted as long as they could. but now, the internet sites are colorful, have plenty of submissions and they can be picky or more picky as those photos get emailed to the editors. But, the longest running magazine so far is Surfer’s Journal. It is published by the former editor/publisher of Surfer Magazine and at first, it was the most expensive surfing magazine in the public eye. There were some doubts as to how long super quality photos and the magazine content and look would last. It is a coffee table book, not a throwaway magazine used as a temporary door stop. So, quality does exist if the staff and content is different than all of the rest. If the hot rod history has any ground to stand on, by going quarterly might save it in the long run. Outstanding photos, great writing and not just the run of the mill editors that come and go at will. The quality of the surfer’s journal is such that people keep buying and getting the same excellent production as if it is a coffee table book delivered 4 times a year. Note 2: Perhaps, the wait time between published magazines that come out quarterly means more “lead” time for excellent research and color scrutiny of photos on every running set up of the “next issue.” Also, one for the internet, plenty of false info can be sent to those sites. If no one wants to scrutinize the true facts before jamming into actual publications as fast as possible, then there is more time to check the facts. And, one thing is obvious from the internet, sites can be run by an 18 year old teenager with good typing skills, that has no inclination toward the subject, other than copy and print...YRMV
The other day I sat down and perused several vintage Rod And Customs mags, first time in many years. You know what, I found things there that I Never see on the 'net And it brought back many Pleasant memories!! That's All I Got To Say.
Back in 1999, I walked into a fellow gear heads office, and on the corner of his desk, was this fascinating little book of "Hot Rods and Cool Customs", by Pat Ganahl. I had never seen a copy of it before, and I was instantly impressed with it. I am sure a lot of "HAMBER'S", have a copy of this amazing little publication. You can look on just about any book shelf, of fellow gear heads, and it wont be hard to spot, because it can fit in anywhere. How in the hell did Pat Ganahl figure this out ? It's one of the most well thought out, high quality, informative, artistic, picture and information book's, I have ever owned. It must have been expensive to create it and to have it printed, and yet, it doesn't conform to any regular form of cool, collectible, coffee table book's, yet it's one of those book's that can easily be seen on a desk or on a coffee table, right along side any of the big hard bound books. It's easily portable, as in taking a copy with you if on a plane, or train. Everything about this cool book, should be a lesson about unique creativity, and thinking outside of the box. It doesn't need to be plugged in or recharged or rebooted either ! So, "PRINT versus the INTERNET" To begin with, print isn't dead , you are reading this, either on your computer screen, of laptop or I-pad screen, and what you are reading is the "Electronic" "Digital" printed word. One thing most of us baby boomers were not aware of back in the 50's, was when the salesmen sold our parent's, a new set of Encyclopedia Britannica, the very instant those books were printed, they were obsolete, as far as being current up to the minute information, still a great source of reference though. In today's world, an individual can't even look for a job, unless you have online access, the days of looking for a job in the classifieds, in a daily published newspaper, are long gone. I still enjoy my books, and some of the magazines I have collected over the years, but with out the internet, even being a member of the H.A.M.B. as we now know it, would not be possible. The fact that we all as members of this web site, are in a very real sense, contributing reporter's and editor's and reader's, all in one tidy package, and we can correspond with one another and the moderator's and administrator's, in real time, and the results can be seen in real time as well. Newspapers and periodicals, could never achieve that. "PRINT" Pat's little book, works when the electricity goes out, something to read, while waiting for the electricity to come back on. And it fits in your pocket, etc, etc. "INTERNET" A definite resource and a conduit of information, and the exchange of information, as well as a portable, up to the minute Encyclopedia, that lives in your phone, or I-pad, or home computer. Your results may vary !
The Jalopy Journal
