Folks Of Interest R.I.P. Our Hot Rodding history.........

I would invite you to come by but it would be quite a commute and if you moved here you would probably work faster then my wallet allows.

Truth is that pretty much anytime someone wants to stop by I am around and don't mind chewing the fat.

 

Safarinut and Traffic, thanks for those stories. As a grandfather myself, that is exactly what I am trying so hard to do with my grandsons. I just want to matter to them. When I'm gone, I want them to have great memories of me, as you do of your grandfathers.

 

Times shared...we take along in memories. Great story of gramp's cars Ray.

 

I have family members that are forever wanting me to write my memoirs. I am not famous and don't feel that I should do that, biographies and autobiographies are for those of note, not for some broken down old mechanic. I tell them if they want to know me spend some time with me.

As for hot rodding history, I think that we share a lot on here. I hope that somehow the electronic files survive. I am not sure that I will leave much of a vacuum when I go but it would be nice to know that something that I have shared will be remembered even if I am not.

 

When I was young, I tended to hang around with the guys that had hot rods, I bot my first Model A when I was 14 yrs old , put a 1941 engine and trans, that attracted some 'of the guys'
In those days I knew guys that upholstered, or did body work with lead, then bondo, when bondo was a bad word, how to chop a top, or channel a Model A, 32,34 or a 40 Merc , fixed radiators, fixed transmissions, knew about gear ratios, in rear ends, or transmissions, how to shorten a closed driveshaft, how to wire a car without a wiring kit, how to chop a convertible top and make it STILL fold. And so many talents, because they explored and saw no reason they couldn't do stuff.
O silly me, I really thought when I got old, ALL my friends would still be around, just older.
Well, its later now, and most have p***ed away. Taking with them all that talent. leaving just memories,, My HOT ROD HEROES are all p***ing away, or have lost interest.

 

I guess I've always gravitated to the old folks. One in particular took me under his wing when I was a teenager working in a marina. (before hot rods I was racing boats). Once I proved that I was p***ionate about learning the skills, that I had proper respect for both my elders and the job at hand, and that I was willing to work hard paying my dues, he spent a lot of his own time teaching me. It's funny, he was one of those genius mechanical minds that people went to to have problems solved, or things created, as much as have things repaired. But at the same time he was a grumpy guy that didn't like or have patience for many people - he rarely kept regular hours, and the shop was likely to be locked if he didn't want to be annoyed. Eccentric only scratches the surface of Albert. I don't really know why he took such a liking to me and decided to spend so much time p***ing on his knowledge. But I'm forever thankful he did.

Its been thirty five years, but my work habits and approach to solving mechanical problems are still rooted firmly in his ways. I can close my eyes, smell his pipe tobacco, and hear his voice . . . Usually repeating one of three things . . .
- Quit wasting time fixing what failed - Fix why it failed.
- Slow down, understand what you are doing and why you are doing it.
- Winning begins long before race day.

In the days of the inline Mercury Outboards he built motors that dominated several stock cl***es, won championships, and set records. No one could figure out how his motors were so much stronger, yet p***ed inspection 100% legal. (He would never cheat). The reason was that he had studied and identified a design flaw in the engine design. A flaw no one realized was there. His cure involved nothing more complicated than using a very specific sealer, in a very specific ***embly sequence he devised. The trick cost maybe $1.50 per motor, and added 300 rpm and a bunch of low end torque. More torque = more aggressive propellers = faster boats = wins!
Fifteen years later his stuff dominated some of the production cl***es in Offshore Racing. In that case not from speed, but by solving a durability problem in lower units that had stumped even the factory. And his fix was so simple that when he later revealed it to the manufacturer, you could hear engineers banging their heads on their computers from three states away.

And the moral to this long winded story? Go talk to the old guys. Ask questions. Most of these guys come from a generation rooted in humble hard work. They aren't blowing their own horns. But they are a wealth of knowledge, and are happy to share it with anyone who takes the time to ask.

***** And if you, like me, are inching closer to old guy than kid status . . . pay it forward. P*** what you know down to an interested young person. Don't get hung up on the fact that you may helping them solve problems on a type of car you and I aren't really interested in. Most are working with what they can afford. And most have had little exposure to traditional stuff. You can steer them in that direction along the way. But don't lose track of the fact that the root of all this is "FUN WITH CARS".

 

Thanks to all who are taking the time to post on this thread. For most of my life I have learned something;no matter how seemingly trivial, from the older generation. A lot of the time it came about by just taking the time to LISTEN to what they had to say.
When I was just starting out learning to pinstripe and letter,my uncle recommended that if I were really serious about learning the craft I should get a job as an apprentice in a sign shop. He mentioned that his usual sign painter was looking for such a person and that I should go see him.
I went down there the next day only to find that the job had already been filled. Tony(the owner of the shop)talked with me a little bit about where I was and what I hoped to accomplish in the business. I had brought a few pieces with me and showed them to him. He gave me some suggestions on what I could do to improve my work and then paid me the best compliment of all: He said he wished I had come in earlier to apply for the job!
The point was that in an hour of conversing with him(actually listening more than anything)I had picked up more knowledge about sign painting than I could have in six months of trying to learn on my own.
When I first started working in the body shop of the Mercedes-Benz dealership there was an old gentleman named Paul (Gil) Gillmaine who was in his early 70's at the time. The body shop manager had hired him knowing that he was a great "pick & file" man and had never used plastic filler. He would sit on his little hand made stool and patiently work along;not taking coffee breaks as others did and at lunch eating by himself listening to Paul Harvey. Even though he worked slowly he probably accomplished more than any two other workers in the shop.
One day I was repairing a stripe on a customer's car and Gil stopped to watch. When I had finished he remarked that he used to do a bit of striping when he was younger. In the course of our conversation I learned that he worked with a sign painter during the Depression years. His job was to come along after the sign painter had laid down the letters and add the shading. He also striped borders around the signs. I remember him telling me that they charged 50 cents per wheel to stripe wagon wheels which were still very much around in the 1930's. He also mentioned that they used lacquer for most of their work and the trick to brushing lacquer was to put a couple drops of castor oil in the paint to retard the dry time. He said you had to be careful because if you added too much it would NEVER dry!
One day Gil brought in his old sign painter's kit to show me. Just a small wooden box with a couple of raggedy striping and lettering brushes inside he proceeded to demonstrate how he worked. Getting some acrylic enamel paint and thinner he mixed up a little on a piece of cardboard.There was an old door sitting on a trash barrel being stripped of parts to install on the new one and he proceeded to lay down a pretty credible stripe along the character line of the door.
He mixed a little more paint and then laying just the tip of the brush next to the line he just did pulled a hair width line right next to it! He apologized for the little skip in the line and the fact this was the first time in 35 plus years he had picked up a brush!
We had many conversations after that and then one day Gil was not at work. Found out his wife had gotten really sick and he had to stay home to take care of her. Later found out they had moved to Florida.
Wish I could remember some of the stories he shared but that was forty plus years ago.
No time now but I will tell about my conversations with my wife's ex- father-in-law who was an old time California hot rodder.. Those conversations I SHOULD have recorded as he has p***ed on.

 

"Quit wasting time fixing what failed - Fix why it failed."

Thank you. That's the smartest thing I've read in a while.

 

Sadly some of the greatest conversations we never had are the ones that would have meant the most to us.

 

I learned what I know today thanks to Bruce Ervin from Brook In. He was the smartest most patient man I ever knew. I was smart enough to shut my mouth and listen and watch. Thank you Bruce R I P Don Down the road from you!

 

Funny when you're young you don't always want to hear what they have to say, then in the middle somewhere you're kind of too busy to hear it all and then they p*** and you find yourself saying the same things. I sound more like my dad everyday and yet miss him more than ever. The guy worked hard, taught me much and thanks to him I'm able to enjoy life greatly.
On a related subject--getting kind of scary to try and find someone local to rebuild or work on something you can't do yourself. The talented "grey hairs" are getting scarcer and scarcer.
If someone organizes a recording effort, I can think of some local folks helpful to me getting up to speed.
Pete

 

My Dad was an old-time gearhead. He was a Dodge Bros. mechanic in the 20's. I remember him talking about the Dodge race team using their shop while in Charlotte for a race at the 1 1/2 mile boardtrack. Musta been around the mid/late 20s... I'd give a gold nickle to be able to ask him more about it...He p***ed in '65..
In my business , I meet a lot of people..I make it a point to engage them in conversation . Sometimes their history & experiences lead to some fascinating discoveries about the past...Usually steer the palaver towards auto related things and it's surprising the things you can learn..
I'm 74 and still interested in learning from the "elders"...even tho I are one....
Stan

 

I feel very lucky to be around some "very experienced" men. In my car club, the Camsnappers, most of our members grew up in the 50s-60s. These guys are an endless source of information. Most times I just sit back and listen to them talk about the old days- and the current projects. I am building a model a roadster (first time hot rod build) so I am always asking them questions. They have done it so they know- it's great. Again, I feel lucky. Thanx to the Camsnappers of Newburyport, Ma for putting up with me for the last 13 years, Ron

 

I've never actually posted here, I was about to post *yet another* T5 tech thread because I can't make sense of the other million, but I stumbled on this thread instead. While I don't like inter-generation grumbling, cos I think we all have our strengths, it's definitely true that in general my generation (millenials, gen Y/Z, whatever) has moved away from hot-rodding as a hobby. What that means is that every younger person who does like it finds the experience of guys on here invaluable. It's especially true for me because my family is from outside the States and my dad was never that into building his own cars (more of a boat guy).

Basically, even though every generation is going to have it's own favorite pastimes, I'm sure there are a lot of people like me who would like to soak up every story and tidbit like a sponge, and if it isn't hotrodding there's something else someone wants to hear about. Please keep driving your hotrod as often as possible, because you can bet I'll give you a thumbs up and ask about it if I can. And if anyone just happens to know everything about 307s and T5/saginaw swaps, please PM me (lol)

 

Ain't that the truth. I seem to spend more days thinking about my parents as time goes by. My dad p***ed away over 30 years ago and It seems like I was talking to him yesterday. I would give anything for 15 minutes of conversation.

 

A couple of local guys (after attending another funeral) decided to have a pre-funeral party. Essentially a party, a get together, before one of the "guys" died! Great idea...going to do it every year. 80 or so attended last October...there will be less this year!

 

I'm hoping I caught that right. What a great idea, can you imagine Ken Burns doing a do***entary like "The Civil War" or "Baseball" on Hot Rods. Interviews with all the guys still alive, the cars, the clubs and the local hang outs. Hell, the sound track alone would be killer.

 

Safariknut, thanks for bringing up this topic, it's especially important to our hobby. 20 years ago, I got excited about building some Track Roadsters, and doing some vintage racing. While towing my unfinished prototype around to car shows and displays, I got invited to a yearly local event called the "Old Timers Picnic". What a treat it was, to meet a fine bunch of men, some I had heard of for most of my life. The majority of them were WW2 Veterans, and after the war, they were the foundation of hotrodding and racing in this area. Some raced everything from Roadsters, Midgets, and Modifieds, and even Indy Cars, along with the talented fabricators, and engine builders who were instrumental in their success. I was fortunate to be accepted by this group, and made some lasting friendships, along with learning the history from the guys who were there when it happened. The picnic is still going, and I have only missed 1 since 1996, however we have lost so many of the participants. If you know of a local legend in your area, I suggest take along a recorder and pay them a visit, it will be one of the most satisfying thing you can do, maybe write a story and tell us about it. This shot is from 2001, the car was built in '65 by my friend Rolla Vollstedt, who is 97. I just got off the phone with him, thanks for the reminder.

 

Hey PnB, I have to disagree with you. I'll tell you why...

As a kid, my Dad used to tell me his hotrod stories. I loved the stories, but I could never remember all the details. Later in life, I would often call him up and ask him about some detail that I had forgotten. A couple of years ago, I told my Dad that I wanted him to write down all of his stories, so that I would have them collected in one place, and didn't have to worry about forgetting them again. I had to bug the dog **** out of him to get it done, but eventually the project did get done. Not long after he finished putting his stories together for me, he was diagnosed with cancer. He p***ed away less than a year later. At least I will always have his stories, and can p*** them on.

 

I am old also. Some of my young friends call me a fossil. but this thread reminded me of somthing that was said in a war movie. The problem is the few of us are getting fewer. I thing it was Tyrone Power... On another note This weekend I will be going to the Moonshine festival in Dawsonville Ga. Lots of very stories to listen too. Good heath to every one.. Bobby.... OH YES YRS YES I have a roll cage and ch***is that Fab 32 built when he worked at Ed Howe racing.It is a work of art.

 

Interesting point. If it was to be accurate, I feel there would be a lot of disappointed people because there was no such thing as rock-a-billy or anything else billy on the dry lakes in 1947 (for example.)

Here's a list for 1946:

Top hit records[edit]

Frank Sinatra in 1946

Nat King Cole in 1946

• "A Fine Romance" by Martha Tilton and Johnny Mercer
• "Aren't You Glad You're You?" by Les Brown & His Orchestra featuring Doris Day
• "Candy" by Johnny Mercer, Jo Stafford & the Pied Pipers
• "Choo Choo Ch' Boogie" by Louis Jordan & his Tympany Five
• "The Christmas Song" by the King Cole Trio
• "The Coffee Song" by Frank Sinatra
• "Coming Home" by Dorothy Squires
• "Day By Day" by Frank Sinatra
• "Doin' What Comes Natur'lly" by Dinah Shore with Spade Cooley & his Orchestra
• "Five Minutes More", recorded by
  • Frank Sinatra
  • Tex Beneke-Glenn Miller Orchestra with vocal by Tex Beneke
• "Fools Rush In" by Jo Stafford
• "(I Love You) For Sentimental Reasons" by the King Cole Trio
• "The Gypsy", recorded by
  • The Ink Spots
  • Dinah Shore
• "Hawaiian War Chant" by Spike Jones & his City Slickers
• "Hey! Ba-Ba-Re-Bop", recorded by
  • Lionel Hampton & his Orchestra
  • Tex Beneke-Glenn Miller Orchestra with vocal by Tex Beneke
• "Huggin' And Chalkin' " by Hoagy Carmichael
• "I Dream Of You" by Archie Lewis and The Geraldo Strings
• "I Get A Kick Out Of You" by Margaret Whiting
• "I Got The Sun In The Morning by Les Brown & His Orchestra featuring Doris Day
• "I'll Be With You In Apple Blossom Time" by Jo Stafford
• "I'm A Big Girl Now" by Sammy Kaye & his Orchestra with vocal by Betty Barclay
• "I'm Always Chasing Rainbows" by Perry Como
• "Laughing On The Outside", recorded by
  • Dinah Shore
  • Andy Russell
  • Sammy Kaye & his Orchestra with vocal by Billy Williams
• "Let It Snow, Let It Snow, Let It Snow", recorded by
  • Vaughn Monroe & his Orchestra with vocal by Vaughn Monroe (first charted December 1945)
  • Woody Herman and his Orchestra with vocal by Woody Herman
• "Oh What It Seemed To Be", recorded by
  • Frankie Carle & his Orchestra with vocal by Marjorie Hughes
  • Frank Sinatra
  • Charlie Spivak & his Orchestra with vocal by Jimmy Saunders
  • **** Haymes & Helen Forrest
• "The Old Lamplighter", recorded by
  • Kay Kyser & his Orchestra with vocal by Mike Douglas
  • Hal Derwin & his Orchestra
  • Sammy Kaye & his Orchestra with vocal by Billy Williams
• "Ole ****ermilk Sky", recorded by
  • Hoagy Carmichael
  • Helen Carroll and the Satisfiers
  • Paul Weston & his Orchestra with vocal by Matt Dennis
  • Kay Kyser & his Orchestra with vocal by Michael Douglas & the Campus Kids
• "One-Zy Two-Zy", recorded by
  • Freddy Martin & his Orchestra with vocal by The Martin Men
  • Phil Harris
• "Personality" by Johnny Mercer & The Pied Pipers
• "Pe*** Papa Noël" by Tino Rossi
• "Pretending" by Andy Russell
• "Prisoner of Love", recorded by
  • The Ink Spots
  • Perry Como
• "Rumors Are Flying", recorded by
  • Frankie Carle & his Orchestra with vocal by Marjorie Hughes
  • Andrews Sisters with Les Paul
  • Betty Rhodes
  • Tony Martin
• "Shoo Fly Pie and Apple Pan Dowdy", recorded by
  • Stan Kenton & his Orchestra with vocal by June Christy
  • Dinah Shore
• "Sioux City Sue" by Bing Crosby and The Jesters
• "South America, Take It Away", recorded by
  • Xavier Cugat & his Orchestra with vocal by Buddy Clark
  • Bing Crosby and The Andrews Sisters
• "Stone Cold Dead In The Market" by Ella Fitzgerald & Louis Jordan
• "Surrender" by Perry Como
• "Symphony", recorded by
  • Freddy Martin & his Orchestra with vocal by Clyde Rogers (first charted December 1945)
  • Benny Goodman & his Orchestra with vocal by Liza Morrow
  • Bing Crosby
  • Jo Stafford
• "Take the A Train" by Duke Ellington
• "The Things We Did Last Summer", recorded by
  • Jo Stafford
  • Frank Sinatra
  • Oscar Peterson
  • Vaughn Monroe
• "They Say It's Wonderful", recorded by
  • Perry Como
  • Frank Sinatra
• "To Each His Own", recorded by
  • Eddy Howard
  • Tony Martin
  • The Modernaires with Paula Kelly
  • The Ink Spots
  • Freddy Martin & his Orchestra with vocal by Stuart Wade
• "We'll Gather Lilacs" by Geraldo and his Orchestra
• "Winter Wonderland" by Perry Como
• "You Won't Be Satisfied" by Les Brown & his Orchestra with vocal by Doris Day
• "You're The Top" by Paul Whiteman and his Orchestra

 

I was thinking swing, western or otherwise. That would carry you into the 50's where all kind of possibilities open up. Mr. Burns seems to be pretty good at period sound tracks.

I see I posted to fast. A lot of those songs would fit perfectly. A little Spade Cooley and Bob Wills wouldn't hurt.

 

Yes he is, but he would have to be guided by something like the Billboard top 40 of the particular time, not just special interest or regional genres.

At the end of the day, it would have to be about the car people, the cars and racing.

 

Not necessarily. The billboard charts only listed what was being played on the radio, by a few big stations in the major markets, where the DJ was paid to play certain songs. It didn't reflect regional hits. It did not include "race records" on the charts. It also did not take into account what was being played on jukeboxes across the country, which is where most of the teenageers got their first taste of rock and roll.

 

I tend to gravitate towards the older than me crew.

While engine shopping I met a very cool guy named Ron. He is very knowledgeable and all around cool. Unfortunately lives pretty far away. Listening to his stories of the old days is always a great time. I told him about the hamb but like many folks his age he is a fan of computers. I guess it's up to some of us to p*** it along.

I also know Bernie who was a mopar racer in the 50s. I have been listening to his stories since I was a kid but back then I never really understood what a hemi or a cam was. He tells most of his stories pretty consistent but he loses details. He is old and sadly forgets stuff, I wish I took notes as a kid. He never touched a computer and probably never will. He has a hell of a time when we go out crusin.

 

There was a gentleman in the town I grew up in who was a dyed in the wool hot rodder and whose son was following right in his footsteps.
He worked for Raytheon during the day as an instrument calibrator and evenings could usually be found out on the local highway(US route 1)with his Cadillac-powered 50 Studebaker racing with the locals. His Studebaker was the ultimate definition of a,"sleeper"; stock looking on the outside with no clue as to what lurked under the hood and driven by an,"old guy with gl***es". He surprised many a kid who thought he had a fast car.
He was also a designer of sorts. He had developed a breakerless ignition system and installed it in a 55 Chevy convertible his wife owned.It consisted of a rotating metal disc with cutouts machined around the perimeter and filled with a phenolic material that didn't transmit current. This served as the,"make and break" component that was normally accomplished with ignition points.There was a small spring loaded roller that rode against the perimeter of the disc that supplied the current to the ignition wires. It worked pretty well except that he hadn't yet figured a way to utilize an advance mechanism.
His son (also named Ken) worked at Raytheon as well and shared his father's love of hot rods. The first one he built that I saw was a T roadster powered by a fuel injected 58 Pontiac engine. Didn't look like much but it went.
He sold that and built a Model A roadster to race. Had a 283 Chevy in it but his tow car was the jewel. It was a 1940 Ford DeLuxe sedan delivery he had found it in a garage in a neighboring town where it had been stored since 1943! The speedo showed but 3,000 miles. The flathead came out and one of his dad's Cadillac engines went in. He raced the Model A briefly but soon tired of that and started on another T roadster;this time a 1927. He liked it better than the earlier car because it had more room for the feet.
The model A was traded off to another local hot rodder in exchange for a Latham blown 339 cu.in. Chevy motor that had been in a 1958 Corvette. This was to become the basis for his roadster known as ,"Iced T' for it's refrigerator white paint job. I was commissioned to do the striping and lettering on it in exchange for a dropped axle with hydraulic brakes and split wishbones that I needed for a car I was trying to put together. I did this in 1960 and in 1961 the car was photographed to appear in Hot Rod magazine. It finally showed up in the November 1963 issue(and in the 1964 Yearbook).
Ken went on to found his own company that made vacuum metallizing machines and eventually evolved into a huge aerospace business.He was a consumnate inventor like his dad and held many patents for the industry. He was always a hot rodder though and still found time to build another crazy vehicle. One of his last creations was an enlarged T roadster powered by a 572 cu. in Merlin big block putting out over 900 hp.
Sadly Ken p***ed away last year from complications of a liver transplant and cancer. I remember him remarking once just before he got the new liver that,"Here I have all this money and it still won't buy me another minute of life". I remember talking with him on the phone about a week before he p***ed away. One of his greatest joys in his life was to be able to talk with old friends and bring back the memories;good and bad. Those are things that money can NEVER buy.
Hope I haven't bored you with my railing on and on. Just remembering some good times with good people.

 

Am not. Oh wait a minute you weren't talking about me.

@ the Ol' Man's 80th B day a whole van of his cronies came rolling in, some of them I remembered but they were just not as tall as I remembered. One in a wheel chair reached out and grabbed my ear and said, climb on red I'll haul you around just like when you were a little kid. Then he started a story and I finished it, he laughed and said, "Damn it I didn't think you would remember." I guess they were only in their 20 or 30s from when I remembered them "hauling me around" but the stories and advice never changed to that day. I hated to see them go, they were history on steroids.

 

I agree 37hotrod. Billboard only means the songs were popular or socially accepted not that they were the best. Sorry about the stray from org. post. With all the talk of people p***ing, I just thought it was a good idea.

 

when I was 16 I traded my 29 Model A tudor, by then I had replaced the '41 flat head with a Studebaker V8,, for a 1940 Ford standard coupe, I was determined to put a Chrysler V-8 in that 40, We lived on a corner, had No garage, no body bothered stealing anything, they knew better and times were different.
Pulled the hood off, started the project, everything was looking pretty good. An older wiser guy stopped by, And said: when you get ready to put that hood on "give me a call" Of course I didn't know him yet,, That hood was off for 6 months. If you have EVER tried to fit a 40 Ford hood, you understand the word Frustration, He showed me HOW to put it on correctly,
and MORE important he taught me to drill four 1/8th inch holes, 2 in each side, so if I ever took it off again, All I would have to do was put a piece of 1/8th welding rod in each hole and tighten up bolts..He called it indexing. Ron become one of my best friends, and at 81 he is still an active Hot Rodder, with many neat cars. We share so many neat memories, can yak for hours..