so, i made a straight channel style rear crossmember for my '32 frame. the spring sits up inside of course. as i tighten the U bolts the spring moves one way or the other, which isn't good. my thought is to make a slightly curved plate to go between the spring and channel to seat the spring. same curve as the spring. your thoughts on this?
It's a good idea to have some curve for spring to come up to,the factory did it WHY?=. A lot of hotrods handel like junk going down the road for more then a lot of misstake done in there builds,most can be fixed fairly EZ if know is around. You hit on one that is often over looked,but can be got away with some times,mostly by luck for some. With a flat crossmember pad plate[ether front or back or both,what happens is pulling "U" bolts up to hold transvrs springs,even with a nice center bolt hole for spring,the spring rocks to the side pulled the most by "U" bolt first loaded=this puts the other side down making that wheel have more lbs. on it then the other side. What that dose to steering is not good,makes car pull to one side, even with all other adjustmint dead on/ I call that a two legged chair becuz only one front tire and the kittycorner rear tire are holding most of the car up. Its much better to have all four tire carrying there shair of load. When one front wheel is loaded more then the other,the castor on that side will over power the same amount of caster on the other side of axle making car pull to one side even though your front end sitting are right. With some one about your lbs. in the driver seat/EZist way to check on already built cars ,is find the dead center point at the bottom of your rearend from one side to the other across rear, get a floor jack and add a small part of angliron with the "V" pointing up on the jackpad and jack your rear up at that point dead center,looking at witch rear tire comes off the ground first and by how much before the other one clears too. If they both are even great=you have a four legged chair and not a prob ,but if not,you need to get it better. Checking the frame stays level side to side as you go,helps to know witch "U"bolt to let off and other to pull more[may need to play at both ends of car if both spring pads are home made flat type.
it could be as simple as welding a couple of short 1/4" bars into the channel, spaced equally from the center hole. how have other folks done this? interested in different approaches.
not needed... no Ford front crossmember had a curve and only model A and model T's had it in the rear.. ALL ford crossmembers 1932-48 were FLAT
i would think it would stabilize the spring and help with body roll. and actually be able to tighten up the u-bolts completely, no?
I dont fully have the answer but i think a cut down leaf from a model a spring could be used some how..... with some welding.
First off, what year spring are we talking about here...? As mentioned above, A and T rear crossmembers are the only ones with any real curve built into the spring mounting area. If you're trying to clamp an A or T sping into a flat crossmember, then, yes, you need a curved pocket. If not, just tighten up each side equally, jumping back and forth and call it good.
it's a 40 rear spring in a flat C channel crossmember. i have a problem calling it good if it isn't seated tight. just equal tension on the u-bolts seems to be a "close enough for government work" thing. maybe it'll be fine and maybe it could be better. that's why i'm asking for your thoughts. probably something few people think of, but i'm wierd.
oh a 40 spring. Yah its good enough for the girls i know, but maybe not the government. The government would probably mull it over for a few weeks before doing it the same way as always.
The spring should not move at all when the u-bolts are tight. It sounds like you are saying that you have tightened the u-bolts as tight as they will go and the spring is still loose. If that is the deal, then a simple flat spacer on the bottom side of the spring pack should allow you to properly tighten the u-bolts. Just a simple piece of flat stock the same with as the spring and 8" long or so and around 1/4" thick may be enough. Drill a hole big enough in the center to fit around the through bolt. Use 2 if you need more. I have used sections of old or removed leaf springs for this too. Another old pratice was to remove the top 3 leaves (to lower the car that thickness) and then put the removed leaves on the bottom of the pack so you can still tighten the u-bolts.
Here is a 40 spring, the small piece of bar stock is 5 1/2" long and there is a 1/8" between the ends and the spring. You are over thinking it, tighten down the bolts and call it good.
no, they're not loose by any means. i'm not that dumb. i just thought a curved upper plate might be a good idea. i do like to think of various ways to do things better for safety and handling though. seems it's not needed, but had to ask the braintrust. by the way, what is the stock spacing between the u-bolts on a '40 rear spring?
If the U-Bolts and spring clips are coming straight down 90 degrees to the crossmember and onto a curved spring that will cause whats happening. A and T springs and crossmembers are curved and the U-Bolts are canted so the spring clips seat flat on the spring and pull it up into the crossmember. 32 etc springs and crossmembers have that flat in the middle and the U-Bolts come down 90 degrees and the spring clips seat flat on the spring. Flat crossmember and curved springs dont mix. look at the pic, of course its going to pull it all wacky
Tight is tight "Even tension" is not tight no matter how you look at it. F6garage's pic displays even tension. Maybe he'll be kind enough to show one tight. During the tightening process the spring will walk back and forth into its seated position. Once it's tight as in full metal to metal contact which in my understanding is someplace beyond even tension, it won't move or should I say shouldn't move.
My pic is how it shouldn't be. The spring should touch the crossmember across the area slightly past both sides of the spring clips. The u bolts should be canted with a curved spring. The crossmember should be curved also to match the spring. The pic I made shows how the ubolts are trying to close up the gap between the flat crossmember and the curved spring, which won't work well. When you put an A spring in an A crossmember and put the Ubolts on they are canted so the spring clip sits flat on the spring. There is no gap to close up like in the pic I made. The gap is the problem.
exactly! hence my original question. it's not going to pull up metal to metal into the crossmember, except just around the center bolt. so i'm looking for a solution. there's always a solution. the addition of a slightly curved spring seat on top of the spring and upside down u-bolts at an angle through angled plates above the crossmember is one option. another is angled u-bolts from the top going through a lower spring retaining plate with the ends angled down to match and a spacer up top to keep the u-bolts from sliding inward. to me this is something that needs to be "over-thought".
How about a Ford crossmember. There's an option. You're going through a lot of time, effort and probably the same expense as if you would have bought an A crossmember. I mean, unless you don't have the room for one. Either way you choose, new crossmember, different spring or some kind of spacers for yours, fill the gap somehow.
If its not metal to metal at the u bolt then its just not tight. The entire area between the ubolts will go flat not just by the center pin.
This is where your thinking is flawed. Springs by their very nature are flexible and as you tighten the u-bolts the spring will draw flat to the crossmember.
You are out of your mind... It will absolutely tighten down flat between the ubolts. Just tighten the sonofabitch down and forget it! Much more important things to worry about in life.
Hahaha! Everybody's making fun...but I do feel his pain... I've got a flat rear crossmember in my So-Cal A-V8 frame...40 ford repro spring...same weirdness when tightening. The problem(if it even is a real problem), in my opinion, isn't the flat crossmember...its that the ubolt mounting points are too wide. Wider you go...the more those bolts wanna bend in towards the middle of the spring... Far as I can recall...the boys over there at SoCal said it doesn't/probably won't/doesn't have to go completely, completely flat right out to the edges of the bolts on their setup. Just tight...and pretty close to flat. I could probably flatten mine out completely with my heavy impact...just seems like it would be really over flattened...and in my case...pull the frame down too close to the rearend, and flatten out my shackle angles. John Walker...I don't see nutting wrong with making a piece to better seat your spring. Hell! I think SoCal and other alikes could make some money with a series of lift spacers like that with a real mild curve to lock the spring in while giving you lift. Maybe go in half-inch increments up to 2 inches or something. Or...Depending on your level of satisfaction with your ride height...you could rework the crossmember to put the ubolts closer togehter. That would give you a seated spring and more rake. Might***** with your shackle angles though. Might be over thinking it from a practical/get er done standpoint...but then again...practical and get er done are just that. Keep us posted. dubbs
You'll bend the bolts... They get rock-rock-rock solidly tight on the turns before it goes flat on mine
Bending the bolts evenly could be another option!!! depending on if your setup would allow for that to work. Or offsetting them Maybe?
The Jalopy Journal
