As many will get to know . I have taken on the responsibilty of bringing back the Valley Custom " Ina Mae Overman Lincoln" . I need some thoughtful help on charting out the correct path for the direction of the restoration. How far , to what time period, and to what level should the restoration go. Its fairly obvious that the car will need an extensive ground up effort but what determines what is fixed , or left alone ? What color should be chosen ? The White , Gold or Green ? Will it matter ? Should anything be upgraded and what are the effects? What prove***** and written do***entation is still needed or necessary ? When you first look at a project of this type the answers may seem easy , get rid of the 390 and the 9" rear, but once you start to think a little deeper into things ,he easy answers can become very difficult. Vintage race car restorations have expierienced this dilema. A An example of a challenging issue is the r/door. The original door is intact and for the most part unaltered , except the outer skin has been damaged and badly streched. Do you repair the door to keep the originality ( a difficult repair for even the skilled ) or replace the door and just shave the handle , ( An easier and less costly repair )? I know at some point I may have to say something will not be able to be saved but I need to make a very sincere effort before going in that direction. Ina is still around and I need to respect her privacy . She did a taped interview several years ago and mentioned she would be heartbroke to see the car ,especially if it had not faired well over the years ( which it has . If you have seen the Lincoln in its prime I'd be interested in speaking to you. I knowthe answers are here on the HAMB and any help that can be provided will be greatly appreciated. Sincerely
gold version... keep all the original metal you can and repair, use only correct things down to the bolts.. you should have plenty to complete this with the parts cars.. please, please, please dont upgrade or keep any of whats been done, get her back to her old ways.. its an AMAZING CAR
You could always take it here and have them do the work, their pricing seems fair. http://public.fotki.com/Rikster/11_...alley_customs-1/ina_mae_overman_52/962a3.html
sheesh! That is nuts! That is one beautiful car. I haven't seen it in gold... but I think gold is a fitting color for it.
I understand respecting Ina's privacy but I would be inclined, if possible, to send her a letter explaining that you have the car and are restoring it and see which version she feels is the best representaion of what she was planning. It seems that when these cars are found and worked on the people who were involved initially in the build are very excited to see their past restored and shared with the newer generations and usually seem very interested in offering suggestions, help etc. If she decides not to respond you haven't really imposed on her to any great extent and you move on from there. I really think she would be the best source and authority on which version was what she had intended and thus should be restored to. Just my 2 cents. P.S. It is an incredible thing you are doing in restoring this great piece of custom history no matter which version you end up doing. It is enthusiast like you who keep this history alive and I for one would like to commend you on your effort.
WOW.... Behold the power of the HAMB... that is awesome to see the original slip from the car... I'm getting a kick out of the $5 and change 'rear window rubber'
It needs to be gold. PERIOD. That is the last version that Valley custom did and to restore it to an earlier version would mean "Undoing" some of their work which just doesn't make any sense. It needs to be restored fully, frame off. Replacing that door would be best for the car. Much care will be needed in restoring the frame where the motor swap and rack were put in, It needs to be put back to the way it was as the way they lowered it is ingenious and was the subject of a magazine tech article. There is no reason for upgrades. it needs to be RESTORED. I love that car. I was honored just to see it and to speak with Ina Mae. I am glad Johnny sold it as it was the right thing to do. I had dreams of restoring that car and have thought out every detail. It must be done right or please don't even start. Man I love that car. Good luck! I can't wait to see it all done.
Gold version... Still a difficult choice to make, since it is an historic car and has underwent re-designs over the years done by Valley Customs. And this car does not stand alone. SAR has the Valley Customs Ron Dunn Sectioned Shoebox, and they have the same dilema, Restore it to its first version or the second updated version. As for the last car I would say the first version, since the later version was done after an accident. But in the case of Ina Mae Lincoln its clearly a case of an update on the design, something that was well thought out. And not done because it needed repairs. The gold version looks to be the best balanced. The new wheel openings look very well balanced with the rest of the body. Much better than the stock opening on the first version, which look kind of odd, when you see the round openings of the later version. Also new headlight treatent looks more in place on this cl***y custom. As for the door. I think Valley Customs would have just replace them with a donor part.
No answers just opinions. If I'm paying the bills, I'm selecting the iteration that I like the most. I'd have to bite the bullet to keep the original sheet metal intact. Especially if it's only one door. Compromises have to made unless money is no object. The art is deciding what is significant and what is not. The color can always be changed unless custom features were added through out it's life and were not there in the early color scheme. Pick the time period that you like and be faithful to that era. It can be a ***** because the car starts dictating to you what it requires rather than the other way around. Good luck with it and please keep us updated.
That car inspired me to rework my '56 Olds....I'd say Gold Version and restore it for what it is, if you want to build an updated car, then build a "clone" and sell this to somebody that will restore it. My 2cents Awesome to see
The gold version, because Valley Custom obviously decided that the first version needed more design tweeks and who are we to second guess what they saw in their own work? The whole value and appeal of it is that it is a rare, surviving Valley Customs design, so anything that was done to it after it last was in the hands of Valley Custom should be un-done.
Some great advice, especially Bob Bleed, Cleatus and Rikster. Even Rik's opinion of how Valley Custom would have approached the current necessary repairs back in the day. The car did look awkward in some of the early photos, it looks perfect in the photo Rik attached. No doubt the SW Chicago HAMB & Eggs Saturday morning breakfasts are gonna be even more interesting in the coming months (years) - can't wait.
Well, all I can say is that Larry is a very methodical craftsman and I dont think he will let anyone of us down with this restoration. You all will be in awe when you see the finished product I'm sure!! GET TO IT LARRY, TIMES A WAISTIN !!! Mike
Make that two of us. It would be a crime to undo those headlights to make it the white version. They're very similar to the ones that they made for the ron dunn sectioned shoebox, if you look closely... and beyond that, they're beautiful. If you want to take it back to the bronze/gold version, you may as well start with a completely stock coupe, because you're going to end up changing every pannel on it. Every nut, bolt and washer should be exactly like it was in 1955 when it was painted gold. It wouldn't make sence to do it any other way. As far as the rear end, and the door... the rear end should be changed, and if the door should probably be swapped unless you feel you could make it straighter than straight. But like I said... It's in very capable hands. Just please go the right path with it. A very wise man once told me, "You never own a car like that. You're just a caretaker until the next guy gets it." Hearing about the Facel broke my heart... but I'm sure you can get it straightened out to back how it was, just a shame someone had to do that.
Hey, Whatever iteration you/whomever decides on PLEASE don't overplay your hand on the paint! This past winter I saw the Azetec, the Sam Barris Mercury & the Hirohata Mercury all with beautful paint, overdone paint, but beautful! Someone nodoubt, got paid well to coloursand and polish the urethane 'till the cows came home. I'm guessin', given your line of work that you've seen a lacquer paint job or two, ditto an old alkyd. Today's urethanes look nothing like a nitrocel- lulose lacquer job, which was probably what Neil & Clayton shot on it in '55. Urethane is great if you're goin' for that"street rod'' look, but for a serious kustom with major history-looks about like a ****** in a prom dress- ya ain't foolin no one! S****ey Devils C.C. "Meanwhile, back aboard The Tainted Pork"
This is a good thread. I have never seen this car so I did a search which lead me to Ricks Valley Customs profile. (I'm going back to that one to read it in full). But I couldn't find many shots to compare the various versions of this car you are all talking about. Can anyone post up some pics for comparison. It does seem fairly evident which version is favoured. I'm just curious to see the earlier versions. Pete
These are some of the exact points that must be weighed and decided upon. This is the real meat and potatoes of what I was hoping this thread would be about. I dont like the look of a urethane clearcoat finish on a car like this. Yet the old materials were just not as durable . We actually thought of testing some of the new urethane clears with various small percentages of flattening agent to see if you could cut the sheen a little to reflect what the color originally looked like. We may use a catalized acrylic enamel as far as the color and body . Remember most of the refinishing at the time was done with the old Dulux type enamels. I'll try to scan the article and post it for reference Just to minimize the color choice issue . I agree ,the gold version with the headlamp mods is the only way to do this car correctly.
In the artical in the rodders journal, where they covered the Jilek sectioned 40 convertible at Pebble Beach, they mentioned the paint work on it. "A two stage Glasurit urethane that mimics the original black nitrocellulose laquer" For whatever that is worth. But I agree. There's something about a laquer paint job. It just has a certain depth to it, and a much deeper shine.
gold,,,no question,,,, what an amazing survivor,,, that lady had some good taste........ i hope she gets to see it when you are finished.... id love to see the look on her face when she sees it restored to its former glory
Reskin the door frame if you're squeamish about replacing the entire door. That way you can keep the majority of the original steel. HOWEVER, a door from a donor rolled down the same ***embly line...you'll be redoing the original Valley work whether you replace or repair the door, so it's George Washington's axe. "My family bought an axe from George Washington's estate when he died. This here's it. 'Course, we've had to replace the handle six times, and the head three..." Slick paint is the same problem concours muscle car restorers have too. Factory paint was very eggshell. Today's paint isn't. We judge vintage cars--whether we like it or not--by today's frame of reference. It may be CORRECT, but it'll look like a cheap paint job. You'll know it's CORRECT, and a few others will, but that kind of thing always strikes me along the same lines as guys who **** about vinyl over CDs and HD over regular tv. I can't imagine anyone looking at that car when it's done, being displayed, and then poo-pooing the paint for having too much sheen or no runs. -Brad Oh, and for crying out loud, don't upgrade it! no discs, no alternator, no late-model stereo. I'd add lap belts if it doesn't have them, and i'd also install a dual reservoir master cylinder to keep from wrecking it. (unless you're never going to drive it) Other than that, as it rolled out.
Hey Larry, Any chance we could see a shot of the damaged door in question? Unless the frame of the door is completely crushed, the skin has little if any crown and could be built with little work, no? Admitidly, I don't know what kinda money you have to work with, but I'd try to save the door. Of the paint options you have to play to, the acrylic enamel seems like a close winner. None of my experances with semi-flat clears have been completely trouble free, in the long run. I've had several ''anamated'' debates with cl***ic car judges on the subject of urethane paint. I've asked, "would you sign off on the use synthetic/nylon wool blend instead of Wilton carpets? What about the use of a good grade of vinyl instead of Connolly leather, some of todays vinyls look very convincing! And what about the use of Formica instead of the Carpaithian Elm originally used for the dash/facia?" A resounding no was the answer in all cases, "so why would you sign off on plastic paint on a cl***ic?" And the fat radials have to go, as well! Pimpin Paint
Well, I'm more of a Hot Rod guy than Custom enthusiast and never knew anything about this car untill the post started. I've worked on a few historic race cars, and picking the year for a full restoration of a vehicle that has a 5-10 lifespan is a tough choise at times. The car needs a ground up restoration, I personally like the bronze version, wish that photo showed the car on level ground. Like most cars seeing it vs. photos will change the overall impression. How about some side by side photos with the Facel Vega? Good luck with the project and keep the HAMB updated with progress reports.
The door isnt a question of money or time. I have the skills to repair it correctly. It a matter of determining when to give up on a part or other issue. I guess it is really about getting your head right with your decisions on the issues . Talking to people with knowledge about the points in question will help guide us to the correct decisions. Your challenges to the judges are many of the points in question . On a stock version automobile some of this is very cut and dry but on customs , race cars and the like, the variables are not so easy to pin down. I' ve watched judges and questioned what they really know . There are some really knowledgeable judges as well as some that are in the early stages of learning. I'll post a pic of the door . The answer wont be found until the repair is started .
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