Does anyone have any experience with these Saginaw transmissions? How much HP and torque will they handle? I am thinking of putting one in my '57 Pontiac. It's a basically stock low compression(8.5:1) with a progressive tri power. Car weighs about 3750 lbs. and has a 3:42 rear. The tranny has a 3.11 first gear and was out of a V6 Firebird mid 80's. Thanks KoolKat-57
Probably want to re-think that. I have a V-8 close ratio version behind a mild 327 with 2x4's. But I wouldn't want the mid 80's V-6 version unless you are going to be really careful with that heavy a car. The V-8 ones are pretty cheap. Tim
How are you going to drive it? I've never broken a Saginaw, though I once replaced a Muncie I managed to break with a Saginaw. Drive nice and I don't think its a problem. If any racing at all is in your future get something stronger.
Saginaws are good if you don't try to drop the clutch and leave 50' of rubber with them. I'd avoid the newer Vega/Monza boxes and try to get something that was behind a 327 or 350 for example. I think it'll work well with the 3:42 rear. Some of them had lower 1st gears than a Muncie. I'd rather always opt for a Muncie myself, but $$$ talks and the Saginaw should hold up for you. Bob
I think if your going to use it for a driver, and not a tire smoker--the saginaw will do the job. I know every body would like a Muncie or a super T-10, but saginaws are so cheap that if you blow it up at a stop light smokie launch--just go get another one.
Don't expect to be very abusive with one. There is a reason they weren't placed behind serious horsepower from the factory. You'll find people who tell you they have never blown one up which leads to two possible explanations. 1. They haven't put any horsepower through it,or,2. They haven't repeatedly powershifter it w/ some serious hp going through it. If these two explanations fail to cover it refer to one of the many fairytales you read as a child. Frank
You'll like the 3.11 1st gear with that heavy car. As mentioned, it'll be fine if you don't beat on it every time you drive it. Like anything, it'll break if you try. I like em.
Kool, I have used one in my 57 chevy with 2x4s on a 355 engine for 5 years now.. Have had a lot of fun with it and no problems at all.I don't do burn outs as my car is slamed 4" in the rear and would have a lot of spring wrap up. TOM (Tired Old Man)
Yep, no big power, no abuse and they'll last alright. They're 1/4 of the price of a muncie or t10 here. And those are an easy swap in. So you can get on the road and take it easy on the tranny then upgrade later. Or take care of it. I've used them a bunch over the years, but like Frank said they don't like big power. The cool thing is the cast iron cases are strong and they are relatively cheap to rebuild as well.
The teeth on the input shaft are the week link. That is the most common part that I have found broke in them. The input teeth drives each gear except when you are in high (1 to 1) so they see the most abuse. Just my $.02
Me and a buddy of mine installed a Monza Saginaw 4 speed in a 454 powered '74 Firebird about 12 years ago. The car is a mid 12 second car with 4.56 gears and 9" slicks. We used a Mr. Gasket V-gate shifter, and the tranny is still in the car after hundreds of drag strip passes.
I have had similar experience.I think it is more a matter of how you clutch and shift.You can break anything with even a small wrong move.
Are you still running the 347? The bolt pattern of the muncie is differant from the early manual transmissions unless you have a 58-60 bellhousing to bolt up to the 347.
I pulled this off of the Inliners board: "I don't think there is a way to tell exactly which car it came from. You can figure out the year and gear ratio. The only way I've identified them was by the grooves on the input shaft: 0 Grooves - 1st/2.85, 2nd/2.02, 3rd/1.35, 4th/1.00 1 Groove - 1st/2.54, 2nd/1.80, 3rd/1.30, 4th/1.00 2 Grooves - 1st/3.11, 2nd/2.20, 3rd/1.47, 4th/1.00 3 Grooves - 1st/3.50, 2nd/2.48, 3rd/1.66, 4th/1.00" The 2.54 and 2.85 1st gear trans came in many mid to late 60's Chevy's with 283s and 327s. The 3.11 trans is popular with many Inliners due to the gear spacing. AFAIK, the 3.50 trans was used in Vegas w/ the four banger. Hope this helps, Kinky6
I always felt that the Saginaws shifted a bit rougher than a Muncie. I had two cars that had them, between the two about 120K and never any problems with them. And a friend had one in his SS Nova after he blew the Muncie up and BEAT that car hard. It lasted through three engines though.
i have been using the saginaw in full size pickup trucks because you can get one with a 3.25 first gear which helps when you are pulling a trailer with a car or tractor on it. never had a problem. they will handle a smallblock ok i have one with a twisted imput shaft it was behind a 454.
I had bad luck with them.Had one in a 69 Nova behind a pretty healthy 327.I broke an input shaft once, put syncronizers in it once, and blocker rings a few times.If you ever missed a gear it would scratch from then on.Finally replaced it with a M-22 and that was the end of my problems.I don't know maybe I just had a worn out POS.
I've rebuilt ,bought and sold a number of Saginaw 4 speeds. The closer ratio models are somewhat stronger than the 3.50 first gear version.Snap rings can come loose from abuse,the gears get to slopping on the mainshaft,then it goes to shit.Check the front bearing for wear,pull the retainer is necessary,I've seen lots of bad bearings.While the retainer is off,check the seal,hard as rock?,new seal is 5 bucks.Same for the rear seal,common 350TH seal. Or just drive and don't worry about it,I have some 3.11 first gear trannys I'll sell ya if yours breaks
Thank you to all for your feedback and input. I am going to rebuilt the trans and a spare 347 in the next couple of weeks and once the global warming kicks in I will do the swap. I have an NOS Ansen castiron scattershield along with '58 bellhousing mounts and a modified crossmember so it should go fairly smooth (LOL) It looks like my biggest single expense will be the shifter! WOW are Hurst prices up there! Appreciate it, Kevin Different isn't always bad!
my buddy has a mid 80's dodge full size pick up 6 cyl..i can mostlikley get it for free..are these trans. saginal? ...if so can the clutch and pressure plate be used with an sbc? <input id="gwProxy" type="hidden"><!--Session data--><input onclick="jsCall();" id="jsProxy" type="hidden">
I've been using a Sag 4-spd with a B/W O.D. behind it for about 20 years in my 52 Chev. It has a 322 Buick with tri-power and a 4.11 rearend with traction bars. I've had no trouble with it other than the shift linkage (the O.D.). Before I had it in the Chev, I had it in a 68 Chev van with a 300 Buick 4bbl and a 3.30 something rearend. I used it to haul the Chev, on a car trailer, accross the state of Wisconsin. The best one to use has a straight input shaft, I was told that is a V-8 one, the other is relieved behind the clutch splines. JRL
Because they were designed off the Saginaw three speed with overdrive is the problem. With four gears in the main housing, 1st,2nd,3rd, and reverse, the gear teeth could be of the conventional width. But because it was designed off the three speed case, the designers narrowed the gear teeth to put all forward four gears along with reverse in the main case. Unlike Muncie,Borg Warner that put reverse in the extension housing. Because when the Saginaw was designed for adapting overdrive, they needed the extension housing for the overdrive gearing. The Saginaw was a decent transmission when used correctly. Kind of like the five speed that Borg Warner put in the Monzas of the late 70's. They were designed for low torque engines, but I knew guys that put them in Camaros in that era and blew them up with regularity. They were not strong enough to stand even a mild 350 engine.
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