Hey guys, new to forum, never posted but always checking out threads and whatnot. Building a 1960 falcon with a 1970s sbf. Just installed a haywire vehicle harness. I swear I followed the directions, and have double checked related connections and still stumped. My issue is, when I turn key to run position Starter cranks, turn key to run, and it kills starter. From ignition cylinder I've got ignition wire going to ballast. I've got solenoid wire going to "I" on starter solenoid. Battery going to one side of starter solenoid that battery hooks up to, and a wire from that terminal to alternator as well. Accessory wire going to accessory hookup off fuse box/harness. On starter solenoid small "s" terminal runs to opposite side of ballast. Any suggestions? I feel like it's probably something simple I'm over looking. Maybe two wires going in and out of ballast need swapped? Tried swapping wires around on solenoid terminals with no luck. As I mentioned, haywire inc harness kit. Universal ignition switch/tumbler. Same ballast and starter solenoid that was in vehicle and working properly before the rewire. Any help is greatly appreciated! Thanks guys. Tried calling customer service at haywire but all tech guys are out until next week.
Have you checked the ignition switch to be sure you have everything on it right? And to make sure that its correct. I had more than one of them that were junk switches.
Sounds like you are wired wrong at switch, when you turn it to on it powers up the start solenoid. If you have the original solenoid switch it has two small terminals, one will go to the start lug on ignition switch the other goes to the ignition coil to put full 12 volts to it during start only.
It's all wired wrong. I do mostly GM but letters should be the same.. The wire that comes from the ign switch that has power in "start position" goes to S on solenoid. The "I" terminal on solenoid needs to bypass the ballast and then it feeds full 12v to coil DURING cranking. It goes to the ballast, on the coil side of the ballast. Wire that is hot on ign switch with key in run position, needs to go to to the far side of ballast. That forces the key/run voltage to go through the ballast. That "I" wire from solenoid goes to the near side of ballast. Near means closest to coil. That allows full 12v while cranking but it needs to be on the unresisted side of ballast
Here's a few pics of what I'm working with. Here's a quick "diagram" I drew to help distinguish what wires are going where. Thanks guys!
The only thing wrong I see in the sketch...is the coil is wired backwards. (on neg ground systems) Minus on coil goes to points/condenser Plus on coil goes to "coil side" of ballast. One thing that is optional: The green wire from "I" on solenoid can either go where you have it on ballast, but it also can go to plus on coil, if it looks neater/cleaner.
To start with, how can I find out if ballast is installed proper, or needs to be swapped around? Test with volt meter? The coil has positive going to distributor, neg to ballast and tach gauge. So I should swap them? Could this cause my crank in run position symptom? Green wire looks better running to ballast. Trying to keep as many wires out of the engine bay as possible. Thanks a ton f&j, I appreciate your help so far!
Also does it matter what side of solenoid that starter wire and battery/alternator wires hook up to? Swap them maybe?
Does your altinator have an internal regulator as well as the external regulator you show wired in in the photos? If it does when you are wired right the engine will want to continue to run even after you kill the ignition & you will have to pull the connector to the external regulator to kill it.
"To start with, how can I find out if ballast is installed proper, or needs to be swapped around? " >>> Your ballast sketch is correct as is.....EXCEPT the black wire from ballast needs to go to Coil "plus" side. "The coil has positive going to distributor, neg to ballast" >>>>>Backwards now, switch to minus to points/condenser, and power goes to Plus on coil. "and tach gauge." >>>>normally a "tach wire" goes to MINUS on coil. But, some brands of tachs have both a power feed that they show going to coil plus, and then these will have another tach sensor wire that goes to Coil Minus. "Also does it matter what side of solenoid that starter wire and battery/alternator wires hook up to? Swap them maybe?" >>>> I don't work on Fords that often to have a definate answer for various "brands" of solenoids, but you can easily test what brand solenoid you have there. Unhook both small wires. Leave the two big wires on, and battery connected. Then test each small terminal on the solenoid to make sure that both are dead..no power. I would imagine that any brand should have both terminals dead, no matter which side the main battery cable is connected to. Read post from Chessterd5....he is correct that feedback from some alternators, wired wrong, can backfeed the ign circuit.
It is an external regulator alternator. I goofed up a little. With wires hooked up as shown above in pics I get no crank. If I swap green/purple ("I" and "s") on starter solenoid around I get crank in accessory and run position, nothing in crank position.
I think the ignition switch is wired wrong. Most Ford switches have the 'accessory' terminal as the center one (the one you're using for the solenoid). Verify what terminal is which; when turned to 'run', you should have continuity between the 'bat', 'run', and 'acc' terminals, no reading to the 'start' terminal. If the switch has an accessory position, when you have it turned there you'll have continuity only between the 'bat' and 'acc' terminals. When turned to 'start', all terminals except the 'acc' terminal will read together; the 'acc' one should no longer read to any other...
"I goofed up a little. With wires hooked up as shown above in pics I get no crank". >>>> You mean "pics" or like your sketch?? (I prefer to use your sketch when explaining it) If you are wired like your sketch, it should crank over with key fully clockwise. "If I swap green/purple ("I" and "s") on starter solenoid around I get crank in accessory and run position, nothing in crank position." >>>>>>As per your sketch, don't swap the I and S...your sketch is correct. There could be wrong wire hookups or backfeeds, etc...or bad switch, etc...so... Do you want to start from scratch by spending some time unhooking some wires?? (We will be testing the switch itself, as well as solenoid.)(also testing for backfeeds) If so; let's start at the ignition switch. Unhook all wires off of the ign switch EXCEPT the main BATT wire. Also, let's unhook both SMALL wires on solenoid. -With only the Batt wire connected to ign switch, and key is off...all the other bare terminals must be dead. - Now turn key to ON. Do you now have power to "Ign" terminal and "ACCY" terminal? - if yes, that's good, and also:... -if yes, also make sure the S terminal is still dead with key ON position. -If that checks OK, now hook up the IGN wire that feeds the ballast. Do you now show power to, and through the ballast, to plus side of coil? -If yes, now hook up the S wire to ign switch. -someone hold key to Crank position, and the unhooked wire at the S terminal of solenoid should show power. If yes, then hook that wire back onto the S terminal on solenoid. Test to see if it will crank the starter.. Reading what Steve wrote: "Verify what terminal is which". There is a possibility that you might have some terminals that the "words" seem to indicate where you think the wires go, but you could be mistaken. Words that could be near two terminals....
So here's were I'm at: Solenoid- green to "I", purple to "s". Tested solenoid, no power on either I/s terminals w voltmeter. Swapped ballast/coil wire to positive lead. No crank at all In any position. Swapped green and purple back and forth n no crank, not even in run position. Going to double check alternator/regulator wiring, fuses, and report back tomorrow am. I have a Continental here too that's got a starter solenoid I will swap with the one in falcon n see if that does anything. Thanks again for your help guys!
I'll repeat, if you have the 'acc' and 'start' terminals reversed at the switch that will account for your issues....
Straining to see the letters on his switch photograph...but I think I see Accy, IGN, and Batt, and those look correct according to his sketch colors. His switch looks generic. I don't see a letter "S" but if the other three seem correct.....
F&j- ran through your diagnostic on ignition switch. All was good until I hooked up ignition and tested power into the ballast. No power at ballast. Traced ballast wire back to find that the plug to feed ignition switch had ignition and accessory switched around. Fixed that. Up at the ballast I have 12v going in, not coming out. One of the wires coming out goes to + on coil, other goes to "i" on solenoid. No crank still. Replace ballast?
Crazy Steve- you nailed it with accessory and start reversed. Haywire switched these two around inside a plug that feeds wires to ignition switch.
Good morning guys. So here's where I'm at. Replaced starter solenoid with one I know for sure works. Jumped starter and battery terminals and it cranks. No crank with key at all still. All power readings are good at ignition cylinder. At the ballast, I have 12v going in and .9v coming out. It's my understanding these ballast drop power coming out to around 9v. Does the solenoid need 12v to work its magic and allow power to pass through? If I'm not getting 9v for coil, I'm assuming it won't get any spark either. Replace ballast? Or run another wire from ignition cylinder to solenoid? Thanks in advance
The 9 volts out of the ballast resistor can only be measured with the motor running. If it's not running, you'll see low voltage if the points are closed, full voltage if they're open. A better test is the ohms of the resistor; you should see about 3 ohms through the resistor. To test the wiring/resistor, bypass the resistor by connecting the wires going to it together; if it now starts, the resistor is bad or the wrong value. As to the key switch not operating the solenoid, you either still don't have the solenoid 's' terminal connected to the 'start' terminal at the switch or the switch is defective. That wire should run directly from the switch to the solenoid, nothing else connected to it.
I ran a jumper wire from ignition to solenoid n it cranked right up. I'm assuming I've got a break in my wire somewhere from the ignition cylinder to the solenoid. Going to trace it down and see what's up.
One more note pertaining to the wire from the regulator: Hook this wire to the 'acc' post on the ignition switch. This will ensure power going to the system (acc is activated with ign in 'run' position; however, when switch is turned 'off', acc is no longer 'hot', and is disconnected from the coil activating wire.) To eliminate doubt about ignition switch, disconnect all wires except for the red 12 gauge wire (POWER) Now, turn the key left (counter clockwise) and check all posts: the 'acc' should be hot (12 volts) Now, turn the key to 'run', and check: acc., it should be hot; 'ign., it should be hot. Now, turn key to the 'start' position. 'Run' and 'start' should be hot, 'acc.' is generally bypassed in 'start' to ensure full voltage to crank and start. Simple test, eliminating most areas of 'doubt'...
Got it all squared away and I believe everything is wired properly. Will fire and crank right up now. Going to flush fluids and wire up e fans next and see what other electrical gremlins I'll run into. Thanks so much for the help everybody!
I agree with Steve the coil wiring has nothing to do with your no crank issue.the coil wiring will come into play once it is cranking. enough have pointed out the+ - coil wiring but right now you either have bad switch or I believe you have it wired wrong can not tell from pic what is marked on center post but ign should send power to starter solenoid to crank.once you figure that out then move on to wiring to coil resistor etc.whoops did not read past Steves post to see Mikes post
I tried to reply twice yesterday via my phone. The APP for android sucks.. The problem is shown in the pic of your solenoid. The ford solenoid oreintation is directional ! The large terminal next to the S terminal is the battery , The other large terminal next to the I is the starter. When you apply power to the S terminal the plunger moves and activates the I and the adjacent large terminal. The I and adjacent terminal are connected together internally..permanently !! The pic shows it wired backwards.. Also, very important to be sure the mounting ears have a good clean ground.. The solenoid has to be grounded to work. This is one of the times you dont want to ask how I know this...LOL.. Dave
Got it cranking properly shortly after I posted this. Just started messing with car few weeks back and now I'm having issues getting spark. Exhaust shop installed new accel shorty plugs in it. New wires(assembled properly), got it to fire a few times and barely ran. Misfiring badly. Inspected accel plugs vs autolites that used to be in it and noticed the reach on the shorty accels were about 1/4 shorter then the autolites. Bought new autolites today along with new coil and got no spark still. Tried adjusting dizzy each way a little bit and still nothing. Coil is p/n 2-5195 from oreillys. Cap looks decent, no burns no cracks. Rotor looks decent. With key in run, I only get 2.5 volts out of ballast. I ran a 12v jumper to coil + and still nothing. Do I need a 12v from starter wire on solenoid to go to coil as well so it gets a full 12v momentarily while starter cranks, then run off voltage from ballast? I only have ballast wire to coil hooked up. What voltage needs to be coming out of ballast to coil? I'm assuming around 9v. How do I test ballast? What else should I be looking for on cap/rotor? I feel like I'm close. Haha Don't want to keep throwing parts at it if I don't have to. Thanks in advance. Sorry for timely response to you guys. Life got in the way!
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