History So when did the gasser noses drop down

Ha Ha Ha!!! Now that's funny I don't care who you are.

I thought you said you read this whole thread?

 

I did read it all and the small bickering was nothing like most of the stupids usually come out with...glad to see the "Can Rats" as I call them staying out of it. !!
But I like your comments anyway ...
Cheers.......

 

Every time i read g***er threads i get confused.

Was it typical in the early '60's to see gas cl*** cars without raised front end?

 

Yes, until around the time that Ohio George raised his Willys. He ran it for a while at around stock height before he went tall with it.

 

http://www.jrthompson.net/ohiogeorge_willys1.html#willys1

So I guess sometime between the mag cover and the end of that race season he raised it.

If I had a '62 falcon (for example...haha) and wanted to make it into a 1964 representative gas cl*** car...is raising it a 'must do'?

 

If you want to impress today's fans, probably

 

Ha ha, clear as mud still

 

Interesting observation Jim.
If you're going to build to an era, do you build something that could have been built in that time period (in this case, I think there is enough evidence that it could be stock height, or raised to about any height) or something everyone thinks was typical of that time period (raised with an "axle"). If it's not what they think, there is gonna be lots of discussion about it. Just look at all the posts on this thread and all the threads on the HAMB about it.

 

So is it alright to use wrinkle wall slicks and still be period correct for '64?

 

Not if the car is sky high.
Old style slicks = raised cars.
Wrinkle walls = coming back down.
I'm sure you can find pictures of raised cars with wrinkle walls if you look. But, it would have made an evil handling car even worse.

 

OK...I'm going to build a '64 period correct car that's ahead of it's time. Hahaha

 

"Retro Cutting Edge" technology!

Nothing wrong with being ahead of it's time. The High & Mighty used an adjustable 4 link.

 

Actually Larry he ran it lowered then raised it a ton then within a year or so had it down to close to stock ride height. Some place I have tyhe progression in a pictorial maybe in an article about him.

I have probably said this before but I think it is worthy of mention, most of those old cars set pretty high at stock ride height, when we see one setting stock it looks raised to us because we are accustomed to seeing them lowered.

Here is a stock willys ( not the best pic but doable), with the skinny stock whels and tires, now imagine it with slicks and front runners.

Next time you get a chance get around a stock model A, look how hogh they sit stock, it was common for cars of that era and it was that way for a reason, the same reason that we lift off road vehicles, there was no inter state and they had to be able to get trough the wagon ruts, and ruts made by big trucks.

Just by an Avanti and leave it stock, you got a '64 car that was head if its time, disc brakes and all.

 

Good point.

 

Nice shot of a stock '33 ******! You don't see them this way too often.

 

On the most popular hot rod fodder it is hard to find a stocker. I got lucky with google on this one first image up BAM.

 

Yeah there's certainly alot more '37-'42 stockers out there than '32-'36.

 

Someone brought up stock Anglias in conversation once. I looked at 'em and said I thought they came from the factory with smallblocks, four speeds, and slicks.

Off to work----dang it.

 

Yep, not many of those left stock either. But then, why would ya'!

 

I actually had a chance to buy a stock anglia in '98. Still had the right hand drive and came with two sets of paperwork, the English and a clean Kansas ***le. 1,200 bucks andI could have driven it the 20 miles home. The missus handed me cash and said am I driving it or are you.

I p***ed on a couple of real deals that year and am still kicking myself in the *** over it. Some times I am just as dumb as wood.

 

Ah yes ******, but if we all had that crystal ball we would have filled our garages with Cobras and Jag XKE's when they were only $5000.00 new!

 

There are pictures from the '63 Nationals of Ohio George's 33 Willys with the frontend up. Also Bones Balogh's car in '62 with the frontend up at the '62 Nationals. And the Hill/Zartman Willys at the same '62 Nationals.
I think you have to go back to the late 50's and very early 60's to not see them up in front, or to the late 60's and early 70's when they came back down.

 

Ha, the Ol' Man had a buddy that drove a Lester Jag in about '59 or '60. He was a beatnick type and I guess he traded something of value for it, a sculpture or something???

Anyway the OL' Man restored one for a wealthy fella right around the turn of the century. Headlights came from South Africa from a collector, a grand apiece. I doubt that the beatnic guy had that much wrapped up in the whole damned car.

 

Wouldn't have taken a crystal ball to decide to fork out $1200 for a stock running, driving Anglia in 1998! What a bargain that was!

 

Nope it just would have taken common sense. I do not recall my resoning on the whole deal but I'll just about bet that it sounded like a good idea at the time.

I think that one really needs to take a pic of the Zartman Willys and a stock Willys and study them. I think you will find that it sits pretty close to stock ride height.

I think that when we look at guys like Ohio George or Big John we have to realize that there is and always has been a distinction made between the pros and the ******s. I think that the rules were also different between blow gas and naturaly aspirated gas cl***es. Clear up until '64 for instance naturaly aspirated g***ers were still a street legal cl*** where as blown gas was not.
Look at it this way, George I thnk it was in '62, someone correct me if I am wrong on the year, went to coil overs. There was a big row over it at least big enough that George had to get some help to stay on the track. The shock company, I believe it was Monroe, again correct me if I am wrong, gave him a letter stateing that they were stock replacement shocks. Now the rules stated that one must use OEM type of suspension and the shocks being stock replacement parts made it OEM type of suspension, it also lifted the car a ton but if you bolt a stock part on and the car comes up you can say that it was not lifted to gain a weight transfer advantage, it just happened when you put the shocks on.
I said all that to say this, any one of us could have one the same thing. But minus the backing we would have just become outlaws and had to race on outlaw tracks. The big guys played or play by different rules than we do.
So what you have is commonly and uncommly done things. It was not just at the races it carries over into our own concept of history or tradition if you will. if you look in a magazine you are going to find an uncommon car, if you want to know what was really happening you look in someone's old picture album.
Here is another example, the fella that owned the Wappid Wabbit back in the mid '60s was an amature photog. He kept a pictoral journal of the Nats at Indy, which was displayed in 3 different publications of The Rodders Journal, around #46 or so. This would have been around '65-'67. This would have been the heart of when we think that lifted cars would have been the norm. Not many cars that are up in the air so to speak, and I don't recall a single tri 5 chevy with a straight axle in the entire pictorial. There is a pic of Big john's Willys before it was candy red, probably one of the rarest pictures on the planet.
If you want common you don't look to the uncommon rodders, or racers.

 

Actually it's funny you mention that, as there's a nice picture of Dave Hales stock Willys on p. 48 when he bought it in Nov. '62, and then the Hill/Zartman Willys on p. 61 for comparison. No doubt at all that the H/Z Willys is much higher than stock. And the H/Z pic is standing still, so it's not ch***is lift.

 

Great thread, very interesting

 

If you take that thing to Sikeston and race it, I don't think anyone will know the difference...lol

 

Read post #59...

 

Deuces,
Do you happen to have rules for blown gas laying around somewhere? I have some of the rules but not complete. I think it would make a good comparison. I doubt if it was a street legal cl***, and I wonder if there were concessions made for cl***ing up.