Howza Bruthas, Okay, I am new at this and want to do it right and stay within my budget. Firstly, let's take a look at what I have. The front is a '40 Ford axle/spring/wishbone set up. The rear is a Model A piece. The rear appears to be the simpler of the two and I think I know what to do there. Spread the 'bones, lop off the ends and weld some threaded pieces and install a set of tie rod ends. Then fab a bung to hang off of the frame to mount it. I think thats right, Right? The front throws me. Firstly of all of the pictures I have seen of suicide front ends, all seem to have the spring above the axle or behind the axle. My front end assembly has the spring in front of the axle. Can the front wishbones be heated and then positioned as desired? Will the spring in front look alright? Due to my lack of experieince I am taking cautious steps and don't want to screw the project up. Also, what is the best way to remove some leafs to drop the car? I am thinking of every other spring to set it down right. Help!!
just cut off the mount on the front of the bone and buy some spring perches that replace the pin that hold the bones to the axle.
you can mount the spring behind the axle but im mounting mine over the axle. Someone has to have a pic of it mounted behind... you weld perches to the inside of the bones like eyeballs 27T... hope that helps~
Remove spring leaves from the top down. Don't remove every other one. Speedway sells bungs to go in the ends of split wishbones. They are better than a threaded piece. Good luck---
Excellent. What is good to use as the front crossmember? A piece of tubular steel? Rectangular steel? Also, my ideas for the rear are good aren't they?
[ QUOTE ] Remove spring leaves from the top down. Don't remove every other one. ... [/ QUOTE ] Just Curious... Why are you saying to do that just the opposite of every other person on the planet?
what tuck said. tuck, you got those 'bones installed yet? i'm curious to know if you can see all that intricate work you did on them once they are installed. that is really cool, whether or not anyone else can see it.
I have 40 bones on my roadster. As stated above just cut off the stock perches and get some aftermarket spring perches. Mine are from Speedway . They also sell threaded bungs and frame brackets to mount the ends. I used heim joints instead of tie rod ends. I think they're stronger. Don
atch i need to get my machine work done before I can bolt it all together. I just got the inside scoops for the backing plates from root...(THANKS ROOTDAWG) i think when its all said and done it'll look really cool. I'm playing it low key untill im done w/ this busy semester. I'll post pics for sure! The imfamus tire slashers sculpted~ Heres a link to my roadster photo page... the pics take a while to download b/c i didnt resize them for the web but you can get an idea of what im doing with the same style axle. im getting my spring from POSI's they want the measurement between the eyeholes where the bones connect on your axle and they'll hook you up. I think it costs around 100 buxx heres the link ROADSTER BUILD PICS
Don't split the bones in the back. There is no advantage, and I could write a book about why not to. If you are going to use the spring in front of the axle, the spring you have will be fine, just bend the perches to work with the new angle on the bones. If you want the mount the spring over the axle, the easy way to do it is get a 28-34 axle and just use a standard spring for that application. you have to rework the bones alittle to make that work with the older axle, but it's easy. Dave
[ QUOTE ] My front end assembly has the spring in front of the axle. Can the front wishbones be heated and then positioned as desired? Will the spring in front look alright? [/ QUOTE ] You can run the spring in front.This will help lower the front without too much extra work. The frame will need to be stretched,or the front crossmember modified,to maintain the correct wheelbase.If you use the stock crossmember,the wheelbase gets shorter,and it looks like Hell. Split the 'bones and mount as usual.Then heat the spring perch right in front of the axle and bend so the eye is parallel with the centerline of the chassis. Then measure the eyes center to center and heat/adjust to suit an available spring. I think Isky's Roadster used the spring in front. Model A wishbones on the back will need some serious reinforcement if your running anything stronger than a Briggs and Stratton.
Spooky,I would use the 40 front spring in the back.It'll get the car done low,but you'll hafta build a flat x-member too. Get the perch pins Tucks talkin bout.After you split your bones put em on and put the perchpins in place.Measure from perch pin hole to perch pin hole.Should be 39 inches.Minus 5 inches is 34.Take this measurement to your local spring shop.Tell em you need a spring 34" eye to eye with bout a 3.5' arch and 3/16" thick,with 6 or 7 leaves. In the back you do the same.Use the 40 spring.You can make your perch mounts yourself outa some tubing.Get your shackle kit for the front and rear springs while your at the spring shop.On your way home go to a steel shop and get some thick wall tubing that the shackle bushing will just slide into.Use this tubing for the rear perch mount. usually mount the rear spring behind the diff to get the car down low without the spring intrudin way up into the car.Use some 1x2x3/16 about 8" long to build your spring perch mounts.I usually split my rear radius rods about a foot apart,just enough to get the trans and exhaust threw to the back.I hope I haven't confused you too much. C9 has some good shots of his rear suspension setup.PM him and ask him to e-mail em to you. I usually build my own front x-member too.Iuse 2 1/4" square tube and cut the bottom off.If you use 3/16"thick it'll just give you the perfect amount of room for the spring to go up into.Gets the car down a lil lower too.You'll hafta do some trimming on the bottom of it too,to get your u-bolts to work........Shiny
If these images work they may give some idea. A spring over axle was going to raise me up a few inches, height is perfect as far as I am concerned. I had to widen the spring pocket in the crossmember to take the wider spring. [image]http://photo.starblvd.net/rrgarage/3-2-5-1071718838?m=1&pg=2&ro=1&co=4[/image] [image]http://photo.starblvd.net/rrgarage/3-1-4-1071664751?m=1&pg=2&ro=0&co=3[/image] [image]http://photo.starblvd.net/rrgarage/t3-3-1-1072142991?m=1&pg=2&ro=2&co=0[/image] I am afraid I went too far back for my bend, clearance is close on the frame, go closer to the front end than I did. I don't want a panhard so I may have to change them. The spring on it now has too few leaves, lacking 4 from being stock, going to put them back and get stock shackles, these are about 1"longer, just threw them on to get by.
DrJ---- Most of the pressure from an individual leaf comes at the end. For example the main leaf is supported by the next leaf very close to it's ends. If you remove that leaf the end of the main leaf is unsupported for about three inches causing the ends of the main leaf to sag. Who the hell is everyone else on the planet anyway. They aint riden in my roadster but if they were I'd probably want to add some leaves.
Here is the best example of sring in front EVER! http://www.cruisin-usa.com/50pg83.html The Frank Mack Roadster, on the right.
I'm gonna run spring in front on mine. I'm using a flat cross member to get it a little lower also and I moved the crossmember forward so I won't have the short wheelbase. Front axle remained in the stock location.Still in mockup stages but does'nt seem like I'm gonna have to remove any springs to get it lower. One thing I'm not sure I like at this point is after moving the crossmember forward, the frame horns don't extend out in front of the car as much. Alot of people cut them off but I wanna keep mine. If I don't like them in the end I'll buzz them off.
[ QUOTE ] Speedway sells bungs to go in the ends of split wishbones. [/ QUOTE ] Yep, just buy those. I don't think there's a machine supply place in the country that carries the bastard thread tap that Henry uses for the tie rod end. Speedway sell's the tap and they sell the bungs. If your gonna be goin into hot rod production, buy the tap. Otherwise, just get the bungs.
Thanks Unkl from the North, you had set me straight before, it just didn't take hold. Felt it should be pointed out that if rear wishbones are pivot points the torque tube is still used they all have to line up. The end of the bell on the tube is not the center of that joint, it is something like 9/16 or 11/16 beyond the end. Draw and cut out a disc that fit's perfectly inside the bell, turn's out to be around 4", and draw a line thriugh the compass pivot point. Put it in the bell and measure from there. The leingth has to be projected to that point. Also they need to line up horizontally. The test is to bolt the wishbones, coupling, housing and tube up with no tires or spring and swing it by hand, mine was smooth as silk. I used front wishbone centers with the rubber balls, some give there but tie rod end's would have to be adjusted balls on. My tube is shortened, I believe the wishbones will be too short for a stock leingth tube, have to add on Also there will be no twist of the rearend, only up and down. Sure won't need a sway bar. Is it going to stand up to everyday use? I have no idea, find out come spring. Probably will get hung up in hayfields, gravel pits and the like, but who cares
Yeah, but the rear end now can't move independently. With the wheels and spring off, and the frame supported, try lifting up one side of the rear. The other side lifts up too. The way you have it set up, the rear end is forced to always remain parallel to the frame, and cant conform to the road like the suspension was meant to do. At best youll get a very rough ride, at worst, youll start breaking stuff. Why not leave them unsplit, so you don't have to deal with all these problems? Dave
[ QUOTE ] The rear appears to be the simpler of the two and I think I know what to do there. Spread the 'bones, lop off the ends and weld some threaded pieces and install a set of tie rod ends. Then fab a bung to hang off of the frame to mount it. I think thats right, Right? [/ QUOTE ] I wanted to explain what was involved if he was going to do this similar to mine. I had my mock-up quite far along and came to realize this flaw in my design. Hate to see someone cut up hard earned vintage parts. That's what I meant by no pivot, independent of the frame. The theme of using allmost all pre '50 parts brought this on and it may not work, but I have the stuff and alternate plans to change it if it's not feesable. Also the fuel tank won't allow wishbones to the torque tube. If I test it in my yard and woods trails and it get's around it'll go anywhere. I suppose I could have a more flexable pivot in front as in a log skidder? Naw. If not, back to the drawing board. Fun at any stage.
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