The LS dilemma

So, my dad has a 1968 El Camino with a 1999 Camaro LS1 in it. He was out goofing around the other day and we think he broke a rod. This is an aluminum 5.7. I assume the block is trashed. He pulled it and bought another LS out of a Vette. He has a complete motor on the stand with all of the components all the way down to the AC compressor, Fuel Injection, ECU and the Painless Wiring harness.

He's wanting me to take it and build a short block for it and use it in something.

My question is this.
What should I do? Look for another LS1 block and just replace the damaged pieces or try and use a later steel block from say, a truck etc. ? I don't know what interchanges. This is way outside of my wheelhouse.

I don't know much about this crap, but it would be a nice start for cheap.

 

I'd start by figuring out what it might go into. If you don't have anything lined up, and you have room for it, just let it sit for a while.

If you want to find out what it needs, you won't know until you take it apart, or at least get the pan and heads off. That will take you an hour. No need to ask us to imagine it's condition?

 

I'll eventually break it down, but my shop is being moved from one town to another right now.
Let's just play worst case scenario. Let's assume I need a complete short block. What should I look for ? A later steel block from a truck or seek out the original LS1 block and components. That's my question. This won't be a hot rod build, just a daily driver kinda build.

I don't know what interchanges, so I don't wanna go scrounging for a salvage yard block only to find out it's a different design and the parts I have won't interchange. This ends up costing more in the long run. Make sense?

 

If you keep to a similar year range engine, then the outside accessories that you have will fit the other block. The main thing will be 24 vs 58 tooth crank sensor, and front or rear cam sensor. So look at the engine you have, is there a cam sensor below the water pump, on the timing cover? if not, then you want an early engine that also does not have the cam sensor there. The early engines have it on the back of the block, top center.

The iron and aluminum short blocks interchange pretty well within their year ranges, you might run into issues with crankshaft length, but that has to do with how the transmission attaches.


But they will also need to match what you put it into. You don't know what it's going into, so that to me is the thing that will decide if you can use much of what you have, including intake, exhaust, oil pan, and front accessory drive.

 

If it goes into anything I have right now, it will be either the 62 Caddy I just inherited or the 56 F100 I have. Either be has ample room for accessories, which is a moot point anyway, since dad left all of the accessory drives on it. He converted it to the tighter configuration.

It has the 24X reluctor wheel.

 

If the broken engine had a bunch of miles, I'd walk away from it. There's now 4 generations of LS's so you are mostly limited to the same gen as that one. Every time I tear into an engine, I spend a lot more than my original estimate mostly because of wanting it to be real good or improved. The number of teeth on the reluctor and the style of cylinder head are the 2 most obvious differences when looking for replacement short blocks or components. Here is a link to an overview of changes. https://www.jepistons.com/je-auto-b...rf5lYN5RsOY1_EdtdG58CaJjUa7QB1NvI6AIle7RpXuYP

 

It had roughly 100K. I need to tear into it and see what's salvageable. I just don't have time right now.

 

That link helps.

Read this:

As an example of mixing rotating parts, it’s possible to replace the 4.8L crankshaft with a longer LS1 crank (3.62- vs. 3.26-inch stroke) and machine that stock 4.8L bore to 3.898-inches (stock 5.7L piston diameter) and use a standard bore LS1 rotating assembly to construct a budget-based 5.7L engine that masquerades as a 4.8L.

 

that's like brand new in the world of LS engines....they get broken in around 200k

 

Right up until the connecting rods fail.

 

I ordered this. It's on backorder, but it would come in handy. Supposed to be out Apr 15, 2025.
LS Engine Parts Interchange: 1997-2020
by Joseph Potak, Jefferson Bryant

https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/ls-engine-parts-interchange-joseph-potak/1145505323

 

Perfect timing as my 2000 Silverado 5.3 only has 122K miles but it's 25 years old, has had a slight oil burning smell for some time but no visible smoke, it threw a "check engine oil pressure" alert two weeks ago so checked oil level and it was down at least two qts, last oil change was six months ago. Due to a screwed up neck among other issues (longer story) I have the local lube shop do it, was fine for a week then the alert again, oil level was full.
Thought maybe the oil pump was going out but a little research has shown that it (could be) a cam bearing issue among other things and it probably has served its time.
This is my daily and I know nothing about LS engines and I sure can't do the work myself so guess I'll look into having a rebuilt GM crate engine put in it.
Wondering if anybody has experience with these engines.

 

The oil level sensor is in the oil pan. It's a tan plastic nut with a connector. Costs about $20 for an OE GM part and takes 5 minutes to replace.

 

A 100,000 mile motor with screwed up rods is junk, unless its something out of the ordinary, or old, and would warrant dumping a bunch of money into. An LS motor just doesn't fit into the "worthiness of dumping a bunch of money into" as a broken motor.

Its on an engine stand, its not hard to pull the oil pan and take a look at its general condition. If you really want to dump money into it after you see what the bottom end looks like, its not hard to screw the pan back on for storage. If you keep it, tag it for what it is, so in the future you will know if its the correct motor for whatever project needs a motor.

I'm betting it will be one of those motors that you will scrap in 20 years and wonder why you kept it for so long.

 

Takes me that long to open the box sometimes!
The point I made was people were saying they tried "this and that" with no positive results, but thanks for the additional input as I hate throwing $$$ at something and not making a difference.

 

Ordering the book is a good step. Having something in black and white is good for us old guys. I purchased the "How to rebuild LS engines" I haven't used it , yet.

 

@DDDenny I've got no experience in these at all. I don't know what the local junk yards are like in your neck of the woods. I do know that these are like SBCs were 40 years ago; all over, easy to find and often deals to be found. Price out a set of gaskets, check for special tools needed, and consider the cost of changing the guts in yours VS getting a complete replacement. It's your time and money, but if the external parts swap, why bother digging in if the savings is small or worse, higher? It's cool to tear it apart and find out what makes it tick. It's also cool to have a good running engine for the same or less money and effort.

 

I'm of the opinion that "who thinks they are not buying a worse POS than they already have".

 

very true!

 

I have that one too....

 

Here are some basic things I look at when buying a used engine.

The 98-99 engines were the ones who had long flanges on the crankshaft and the heads will most likely be cast iron if it's a 6.0 truck engine. They also have an odd valve cover bolt pattern.
The LS1 and other aluminum blocks have cast in place cylinder liners and they are THIN. This is important because they can't be bored, only honed about .010, so one needing a rebuild may (probably) be junk. Replacing liners is a very expensive process. Basically, unless you are getting a new block or an LS7 block with pressed in liners.....I'd not buy a USED aluminum OEM LS engine.

Best choice is a cast iron 6.0 up to about 2007 as they are Generation 3 . A newer 6.0 is still good, but you have to deal with getting rid of the Variable Displacement junk they use to deactivate cylinders. That adds some expense.

(Edit Note) (A 6.0 with no trans is usually about $1000/$1200 but you can find them for a little less or a lot more. A 5.3 can be had as a rebuildable core for about $500 +/- several hundred. Thing to think about is that if you use a 5.3 and its $700-$1000 cheaper..........you can buy a stroker crank and rods with the difference and have a 383)

Most likely you will end up with a 5.3. These make good power. Most LS heads are very good even when stock. If you get a 5.3, you can stroke it to 383 if you want more displacement. Also, be sure you get the computer unless you plan to run an aftermarket EFI. If aftermarket EFI, be sure its one that will control your transmission. That's if you plan to run a 4L80E or 4L60E. If running a manual trans or a 700R4 or other non computer automatic then you don't need the trans control.....but you need to know which trans you will use before buying. (Note: A 4L80E or 4L60E will need a controller. There is no 4L80 without E. The 700R4 did not need a controller and ceased production about 1992. An upgraded version called a 4L60 was made for a few years. It does not need a trans controller either. THEN, they began making a 4L60E. It does need a controller. Important to know that.

If I was looking for another one, I'd try to find one complete with a rebuildable transmission (4L80E or 4L60E 2 wheel drive) Best is the 2002-2007. About $1500 or less ($1200) where I live. Also.......BE SURE YOU GET THE MOUNTING BRACKETS for the A/C and Alt/PS.

Here is a GEN 4 block. See the little towers in the lifter valley. Getting rid of the junk that goes with them and plugging those holes is how you make it work normally. But thats how you can tell Gen 3 from Gen 4. There are other ways, BUT I Gotta go.........wifey wants to go to the grocery..............

 

The lifters are starting to tick in my 04 5.3, which is a known problem. Never heard of a rod breaking.

Like was said, 6.0s are more spendy than a 5.3. The wore out 5.3 in my Burb really runs hard. I think some speed parts on a 5.3 would be plenty of scoot.

And if you want to really go nuts, I've seen quite a few guys put boost to a stock bottom end 5.3 and get crazy HP numbers out of them until they blow.

 

I thought that was the only reason to run an LS?

 

So, let’s not lose sight of the original question. I understand the differences in a lot of the LS series.

What I am trying to do is to pair up a good rebuild able short block with the LS1 components I already have. I have everything, including the aftermarket Holley oil pan. I just need to be able to bolt on my crap to another short block. If I can find a rebuild able core , I could come out with a cheap LS swap. Make sense? I’m cheap….

 

So...what have you figured out that you're looking for? I think you have most of the clues needed.

 

I still don’t know if there is a steel block that will interchange with the 24x wheel system. I don’t even mind if I use a 5.3. It’s just a daily.

I have that interchange book on order but it doesn’t come out til April 15.

 

Early engines are 24, later are 58. Doesn't matter if they're iron or aluminum.

 

He was out goofing around the other day and we think he broke a rod.

Sounds like the old man found a way to get some one to haul his junk away or free LOL

If a rod actually broke then what do you expect to salvage the head is most likely damaged as well . raise it up and snap the pam off and see what's what .

Its not rare and its not particularly desirable so unless you get all the stuff you need free id not spend a lot or waste a lot of time if its all tore up in side .
I guess its free to take it apart and save anything not broken .

Buddy just bought a similar engine for his project for $700 heard it run and it had a fly wheel for the stick .

Good Luck .

 

I helped a buddy with a 5.3 (cast iron) that is going into a project car of his. It came out of a 1995 Suburban a customer sold him. It went far between oil changes. At the engine shop, it went into the blast cabinet for 3 rounds before all the caked on sludge was gone.

The shop made him a deal on some Corvette heads they took in as a trade. All redone fir around $1200. It was bored .040" over, fitted with Wiseco pistons.

I learned a lot by stripping it down, I can see why they are popular.

 

He is 86 and was blowing the tires off of his El Camino, when he hurt it, so....


So, we borescoped it and really all we can tell is that #6 is at TDC, The crazy thing was it wasnt making crazy amounts of noise. It sounded like a broken rocker arm or something in the top end, which would makes sense, it were at the top of the stroke. Dad has it bolted to a shipping cradle, so I can't get the pan off right now. I may drag it down to the new shop and throw it on a stand, just so I can cure my own curiosity.

It is all free, so if I can find a steel early 5.3, I would do that.