Well, maybe not quite, but close... When I bought my '64 Chevy C10 pickup 19 years ago, I already had plans to modernize it. Three years later, I bought an '88 pickup with the idea of cutting off the front end of its frame and welding it to the rear of the '64 frame to get power disc brakes and power steering. Because the newer truck had such rusty parts, I ditched that idea. I did take the 5-speed transmission, though, and got rid of the stock 3-speed original gearbox with unsyncronized first gear and broken second gear! It was a bit tricky to drive. Over the years, I’ve considered all kinds of solutions: a rack-and-pinion from a modern car, maybe an entire front suspension from a newer vehicle, etc. But since I didn’t want to spend too much energy on this truck instead of on Mechanix Menace, I stuck with the original front suspension and steering. I did install drop spindles, power disc brakes, and Öhlins shocks, so it hasn’t been completely stock... After driving a truck that was heavy to steer at low speeds, had play in the steering, and 6.5 turns lock-to-lock, I finally decided last summer to buy a ready-made kit with a power steering box and adapter plate to save time. Yeah, right... Originally, the steering shaft in the column is solid and runs in a straight line from the steering box to the wheel, so in a frontal crash, there’s a high risk of getting impaled! To improve safety, I also bought a collapsible steering shaft from another company. Both parts came from major, well-known American companies. The company that makes the steering box is even an OEM supplier to Chevy. You’d think they’d know what they’re doing—but nope... When I ordered the collapsible shaft, I was skeptical of the design. It’s a round bar with two flats (double D) that slides into a flattened tube. The slightest play on that small diameter results in major play at the steering wheel rim. When it arrived, of course, I was right! After lots of tinkering and testing different solutions, I flattened the tube even more, which reduced the play, although the tube is so flexible that there’s still some play under greater force. To fix that, I mounted a couple of sturdy flat bars that I can tighten just enough to eliminate the play while still allowing it to collapse in a crash. Flattening the tube increased lateral play. I solved that with four set screws, adjusted just enough to support the inner part. One thing I don’t get is how they can sell this part at all! You either have to cut and machine splines into the existing steering shaft, or like I did, turn and mill an adapter to weld on. In the end, it turned out fine! Now to the steering box itself! You get an adapter plate that you’re supposed to bolt to the frame using two of the original holes from the old box. Then you drill two new ones. The new box is then fastened with three bolts through the frame and a fourth into the adapter plate. Early on, I saw that things didn’t line up properly. When I mocked up the box, it turned out to be tilted 15 degrees off!!! Plus, the inner tie rod ended up in the wrong spot. When you steer, you get different bump steer on each side. Ackermann geometry is also off, though maybe that’s less critical. At first, I considered installing it as-is. It would work, and maybe you wouldn’t notice much, but I want it right and perfect—so I decided to do it properly, which meant a ton of work! First, I had to make sure the truck was level side-to-side. I used a cross laser and shimmed the height with cardboard pieces between the jack stands and the frame! Then I had to lie on my back and juggle the 14 pound steering box into place using a stool, wood blocks, ratchet straps, and clamps. After lots of measuring with a laser, tape measure, and angle gauge, I finally got it right. With the correct placement, I could mount the box using all four bolts through the frame, which makes it sturdier. Why they didn’t do it right from the start, I’ll never understand! I’m going to write to them and ask what they were thinking—if they even were... Once the box and shaft were in place, it was time for the hoses. The box manufacturer had a kit that was supposed to fit, but I got suspicious when the hose fittings had imperial threads and the box had metric threads... When I emailed them, they said that with exiting thread engagement it would work... Seems pretty sketchy! Especially with hydraulic pressure of at least 1200 psi. In the end, I had a local shop make hoses with banjo fittings. When I tried to install them, the banjos wouldn’t seat properly. Turned out the banjo bolts bottomed out in the box threads... Oh well, I just turned down the lengths a bit and that solved it! When everything was finally in place last weekend, I took it out for a test drive. What a difference!!! From 6.5 turns, it’s now 3. Sure, with 10% less max steering angle, but still! The power****ist is too strong, so I’ll eventually install a smaller diameter restrictor in the pressure line. Right now, the steering is way too light with too little road feel. But the turn-in feels almost like a race car! Previously, the slow steering and play made it pretty stable—you could wiggle the wheel a bit without anything happening. Now, with the light and quick steering, even the slightest movement causes a change in direction. Takes some getting used to. A bit heavier steering would probably help. One thing that became very clear is that the old-school feel is almost completely gone—for better or worse. Now it feels almost like jumping into any modern car, with disc brakes all around, Öhlins shocks, an engine that cruises at 1400 rpm at 60 mph, etc. But overall, it’s a huge improvement—you don’t have to break your arms to park, you can take tight 90-degree turns without driving extremely slow to be able to turn the wheel quickly enough, and you’ll probably be able to catch slides out of roundabouts more easily! More testing to come! After way more work than expected, I’m actually really happy!
That collapsible column sounds like a GM one. They’re should be a moulded nylon inner between the tube and the rod.
It's from CPP. Real*****! They don't even answer my e-mails, even though I have purchased lots of parts from them.
In your attempt to make a perfect fit of the collapsible steering shaft, I'm wondering if you've defeated the function of the safety originally designed into it. Your steering column may not collapse properly in a frontal collision, as @Oneball alluded to above. In at least some OEM applications the inner and outer steering shafts both had holes in them that were aligned when****embled. There were some****emblies that had what appeared to be a plastic rivet that passed thru the holes in both shafts. Upon impact the plastic would shear off allowing the steering shafts to collapse. On some other vehicles there was what appeared to be a plastic material that was injected into the holes in the inner and outer shafts. I seem to recall that at one time GM offered a repair kit with a syringe and some sort of injectable resin. I think it was listed in GMs Standard Parts Catalog but I'd be surprised if was still available.
When I changed to PS/disc brakes, etc on my 66 Suburban I used a PS box from a 74 Chevy truck, saw a magazine article that showed the difference in the frame rails under the box. The newer trucks are recessed in this area, so used a slitting disc and a big hammer to copy the later frame recess then welded it all up, this made the steering radius equal on both sides. Then I threw it all away and built a rectangular tube from frame stub and all new modern suspension.
The typical Saginaw collapsibles used the 2-sided flat-shaft and corresponding tube as used in GM cars and Jeeps. I agree; that seems to be very critical for minimal play. I bought a new Ford 150 a number of years ago and its steering definitely had very noticeable play. The dealer took care of it. ? unsynchonized 3-speed ?
If I knew that this kit would have been such*****, I might have gone with another solution from the beginning.
Not to confuse the issue, but have you considered an IFS from a mid-eighties Jag XJ6 for instance? They are a complete “dropout” unit with R&P steering.
No. But for a long time, I considered buying a BMW 7-series that I could take the entire driveline and front and rear suspension from.
Nice story. Before trying to calm the steering down some you might want to increase the caster, possibly by quite a lot. It should cut down the sensitivity, improve stability and the power will take care of the increased steering effort. Where's @enjenjo when you need him! Chris
In the old days I had a 66 suburban. Wanted power steering. Used a 72 pick up box. Made a reinforcing plate for the in side of the frame. The stock column bolted up. Made a new driving truck.
Before I retired,closed down my race shop {did racecars of all types n some hotrods},I'd get those that were sent to me,as they were having probs with steering ,ride or handeling. My shop was known for fixing all of this*****. Most steering probs were wrong set ups,but hard steering most of the time came from owner {old one or new one } doing stupid stuff to car or truck.> The common things,were new tiny streeing wheel { the factory wheel was big,to be EZ to steer with< if your tummy is in the way,stop sticking so much food in. Running low tire PSI,ya,it rides shofter,but steers bad,front end setings,like too much caster,or tow wrong,new rims that hold tire out from stock by a lot>bad scrub,steering box adjusted screw up,often out of center: Those things,when set right,make steering pretty nice vs how it was,and didn't need to cut up stuff.
I'm a huge fan of the Jag IFS/IRS suspensions. Sports car handling with luxury car ride when set up right. Too bad the expensive-to-work-on motors and truly horrible electrical systems sullied their reputations so badly. The IRS was around from 1961 through 1996, the IFS from 1970 and also until 1996. The parts well is deep with multiple suppliers as they were built pretty much unchanged for 30+ years, so rebuilding these isn't an expensive deal. Both ends are on drop-out subframes, so adapting them isn't all that hard. In most cases they can attach to your existing frame. There are multiple Donor cars to look for; all '70-87 XJ6 series 1-3 models and '87-92 XJ12s. Starting in mid-year '87 Jaguar came out with another XJ6 model known as the XJ40, stay away from those as it's a different design and much harder to adapt, although some parts are interchangeable (good for converting from inboard to outboard rear disc brakes). You can also source from any XJS '75-96 as these are the same with minor changes in spring rates being the only difference. Virtually all of the XJSs came with factory positraction. Dead ones are getting rarer, but they still turn up. The last one I got for free!
At risk of being outside the parameters of the HAMB, and only because @Crazy Steve broke the way, I spent onehelluvalotta time adapting an 86 XJ6 IFS into the highly modified frame of the 40 Chrysler in my avatar. Also narrowed it up 2 1/2” Turned out good (IMO) Of course there are always things that one would improve on, the next time around. Chassis has been completed, including a 331 Hemi & TorqueFlite xmsn. Waiting on a shop to do the body work.
I was under the impression you could bolt in 71-87 power steering and disk brakes onto one of these. I had a '66 Suburban with that stuff in it, also had a 5 lug rear out of a same-era truck, and it steered and stopped really nice, I don't think anything was modified to put that stuff in.
I don't remember all the details, it was many years ago, I did buy the later center link, tie rod ends, idler arm, ball joints etc for the later truck, yes, made it like a Cadillac, almost drove too easy, the reason I changed it to tubular A-arms and coilovers was because it was lowered so much (dropped spindles and shocks) the original A-arms were too close to the ground.
C10 stuff is super EZ and plentiful. I’ve done the.x-member swap and seen just the ball joints swapped and later spindles used. Drop spindles can be had for whatever ball joint c10-30s ever used.
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