Projects Track Roadster 16 yrs in the making

Wow! That is a beautiful roadster and that reply was very eloquently written. You sir, have taste and class. Can't wait to see this finished.

 

The hood was fabricated from aluminum sheet; but only after the windshield header (upright flange) was removed and the cowling modified. If there is a “secret” to Jack Presse’s body modifications it is his decision to section the cowling/front side panel area. Once those mods were made, it was time to create a shape for the nose and the hood. Here I will discuss the hood; while the story behind creation of the nose will follow.

In the first photo Jack mocked-up the body on the 32 rails and positioned a tire at the center of the front wheel hub. This kind of mock-up exercise really helps one determine whether the changes to the proportions and lines of the body are correct. This image is a combination of two photos; consequently it looks a bit weird (note the “two” window frames in the shop wall). Although the perspective is a bit out of whack, the image does show that after sectioning, the body contour is a gentle sine wave — from the windshield base to the back of the nose. Had Jack not sectioned the cowling, the drop to the nose would have been much steeper and far less visually pleasing. In effect Jack “dropped” the front of the roadster, by lowering the upper surface, not by dropping the spindles. As you will see later, the ground clearance is pretty good. One of my cardinal design criteria was that the roadster be drivable in the real world, and not “in-the-weeds”.

In this mock-up (Photo A) the hood and the nose appear white because the two objects were carved out of architectural foam. Jack ordered a couple of big blocks of foam and did rough carving with a hot-wire knife, he then shaped and smoothed the form(s) with a disk sander; the sander made shaping easy but created a huge mess of foam dust. If possible, it is wise to do the shaping outdoors or in a space that is easy to clean. I’m pretty sure that breathing a bunch of foam dust is unwise, so at least a breathing mask that removes fine particles should be used.

Photo B shows an overhead view from the front. You can see the gap between the nose buck and the hood buck. This view also shows that that windshield header is “missing”; note that the instrument panel cowling is visible (arrowhead). It isn’t necessary that the foam bucks be perfect, the shapes mainly serve as a means of comparing profiles; the bucks are especially useful for ensuring that the final shape is symmetrical right to left (bilaterally symmetrical).

Photos C and D are pretty much self-explanatory. The sheet aluminum was formed by carefully working the metal over a pipe then comparing the contour to the foam buck until the desired shape was achieved…easy for me to say…right? When Photo D was taken, you can see that Jack was re-establishing a new windshield header and starting to tackle the windshield post area. Building a base for the windshield post was a major PITA. I thought about trying to show all the steps, and trouble, Jack had to wrestle with to get the windshield posts right, but I came to the conclusion that process was too difficult to depict with 2D photography. The roll bar is evident, and was mounted in such a way as to lean-back at the same angle as the windshield posts (as you will see later).

The side view in Photo E shows the profile of the hood, the new windshield header, and windshield post. A cut and weld is apparent where Jack pinched the 32 frame rails to fit the contour of the ‘29 sheet metal (arrow). The oil pan, pitman arm, drag link, upper and lower parallel bars are visible. The relatively small Dodge Hemi mostly fits within the frame rails, with the heads only hanging over the frame a bit; unlike a Chrysler Hemi, where there is considerable overhang (and weight). I like the fact that the original Model A character line, below the windshield post, is intact and looks “right” after Jack’s cool body mods. Note that the ground clearance is reasonable.

The hood (Photo F) is shown in primer after the final sanding. I don’t have a photo of the painted hood; but Jack says that he will take a photo next week (first week in June).

 

i hope you are running some pin drive wheels?

 

Nose and Grill Part I.

As stated earlier the inspiration for the nose and grill is the Shaw Car that won Indy in ’39 and ’40, namely the Maserati 8CTF, Boyle Special (Figure A). In particular this meant horizontal grill bars and a “heart” shaped grill opening. The design is in contrast to many track roadsters with nose/grill assemblies that emulate a Kurtis sprint car/midget, typified by vertical grill elements and an oval profile.

Jack and I decided that cheek-like bulges would be needed along the flanks of the nose to hide the Hemi valve covers from the front view. The bulges provide room for an adequately sized radiator while keeping the nose from appearing too massive.

Jack Presse carved a nose/grill shape in two foam blocks, one with a smaller “grill” profile compared to the other. He then bent some welding rod to make the outline of the grill. Only one of the two foam bucks is shown (Figure B). The side view of the foam nose shows welding rod used to define the eventual shape of the hood (Figure C). The cheeks are present in the foam carving, but are hard to see in this relatively poor quality image [this is a scan of a photograph]. While all this planning took considerable time, as you will see, the results justified the early design exercises.

I don’t have any “intermediate” photos of the various steps Jack took in order to reach the final shape…sorry…but I had no idea that I would eventually write this HAMB article. In any case, the next image (Figure D) shows the “earliest” image I have showing the nose and grill. Here you may be able to discern the side bulges and the horizontal elements of the grill. Needless to say, the starting material was flat sheet steel and straight steel rod material. Some of the cuts and welds required to form the complex curves can be seen. Figure E show a direct shot from the front, most conspicuous is the “dimple” at the top of the grill, which is a key styling element of 30’s Maserati grand prix racing cars. Note that the hood tapers from the narrow part of the nose to the cowling, further diminishing the mass of the front end.

The next image (Figure F) is well focused close up, which allows a better view of all the cutting and welding required to shape the nose. Much of the metal forming was accomplished on Jack’s English wheel. The lip or molding at the bottom of the nose was needed to allow the “cheeks” to transition into the grill surround in a pleasing manner. Another close-up (Figure G) shows the lower lip to better advantage; one can also see that the vertical grill element is steel rod welded outboard of the horizontal rod elements — this is different from the Maserati grill’s vertical element, which uses flat strap steel with holes through which the horizontal elements pass (Figure H).

Figure I shows the wood buck Jack rigged-up as a pattern for the radiator. By now he had begun to grind down some of the welds. This view also gives a great view of the side cheeks, which are deceptive in appearance. From the front the side bulges are surprisingly unobtrusive; but upon close inspection they provide considerable room for the radiator. Note the notches where the front axle passes through the nose assembly.

 

Killer work man!

Keep it up.

Joahsu Shaw

 

Nose Part II

The first image (Figure A) is a “knee-high” view showing how the front suspension relates to the nose. The side bulges are pretty easy to see; note that the symmetry of the right and left halves of the nose is essentially equal. Just below the bottom of the grill you can see the attachment points for the lower locating bars. The attachments points are too noticeable…more about this below.

A view from “eye height” (Figure B) shows the nose in relation to the other body segments. The next photo (Figure C) strikingly demonstrates that the gap between the bottom of the nose and the ground is too large; further, the aforementioned suspension brackets below the nose are plain ugly. These last two photos (B, C) were taken the first time Jack ever did a whole body mock-up on a rolling chassis. I was pretty surprised by the awkward space below the nose, but not to worry, help is on the way. I guess that’s why builders, like Jack Presse, repeatedly put the car together, learn something is amiss, and then go back to the drawing board.

Figure D is a good view of the roadster. The roll bar is/will be angled at the same rake as the (missing) windshield posts. Here you can see the rear-hinged doors, which make ingress and egress easier, especially on the driver’s side. The relation of the passenger’s side exhaust header to the frame rail is visible.

The 16 inch ‘36 Dodge steel artillery-style wheels were modified with 4 inch wide rims for the front and 6 inch rims at the rear. This allowed the use of vintage tires with the correct width/height aspect ratio (approx. 1:1) for a ‘50s track-style roadster, no rubber band tires here. While the front of the car is pretty low to the ground, it still has very acceptable ground clearance, which will enhance its drivability in the real world of bumpy roads and steep driveways. This higher front stance is also more faithful to real track roadsters that actually competed on the poorly maintained dirt bullrings of the 1950s; the dirt typically had lots of deep ruts toward the end of a race. Also, vintage photos show that most track roadsters used steel disk-type wheels, not wire wheels.

This Figure (E) shows the bottom of the nose from the worm’s eye view. The nose is sitting on Jack's bench, pointing upward toward the ceiling. Jack has fabricated a shelf inside the nose. The underside of the shelf panel will provide a structure to which a chin or "underpan" can be attached. The shelf will also help "seal" and manage air flow around the radiator. This photo shows all the work required on the inside of the bodywork. There are reinforcing plates and straps as well as brackets for attaching the radiator frame. The welding has to be accomplished without distorting the laboriously hand-formed sheet metal.

In Figure F we see a view from above, the side opposite the view shown in Figure E. The grill is removed and the radiator is in place (protected by cardboard). Note how nicely the shelf seals up to lower radiator housing; thereby helping to insure that air coming into the grill will pass through the heat exchanging fins.

In Figures G and H we see two views of the sheet metal chin pan sitting on Jack’s workbench...sorry, I placed Figure H out of sequence.

Figures I and J show front and quarter views, respectively, of the chin pan attached to the underside of the nose.

 

Little more Sheet metal chin - But I am sure paint will pull it all together for me.
Scrub line and chin line on the same plane

 

just so you know,this build is being watched with great interest from down under also.
its guys like you and the thoroughness of describing your build that encourages people like me to contemplate building a hot rod,sometimes it would be good to live in america just to have direct acess to people who have the knowledge and resources to aid in the build of such an amazing machine.
i wait for the next installment.

 

Bobcatrowe,

Greetings to the Rodder's on the far side of the world. Your kind message is greatly appreciated. If I may be so bold, I urge you to pursue your dream car. Australia has an incredibly rich heritage of motor sport for you to draw upon. Admittedly there is a strong English flavor to your native motor history, but why not a baby Bentley rod with an Aussie flavor; also wasn't there a 30s vintage Vauxall that had "notches" on the upper radiator housing, which had a cool look. I ask because the late 20s and early 30s Alvis and Vauxall specials are not huge cars (Bentley) and have a very cool vintage race look.

When when I started thinking about my track roadster project 15 years ago, I strongly considered importing an Chrysler Australia 6 cylinder Hemi engine. My main hesitation was not knowing anyone to contact about making sure I bought a solid well-built engine. I think a combo of a Hemi 6 with some Webers in a vintage looking 30s "special" body would be an outstanding basis for a hot rod; presumably one could use a Model A Ford frame and go from there...

In any case, thanks for the message from the Antipodes and keep on keepin' on.

Trakrodstr

 

Nose Part III

The shape of the nose, as shown above, has been finalized; the attached photos will show priming and painting efforts.

The first photo shows clear views of the side bulges, and the heart-shaped opening.

Next is an image of the nose pan sitting “upside down” on Jack’s workbench; a skin of body filler is evident and sanding has begun.

Here is a front view of the nose with the grill in place (not yet plated), followed by a side view showing the driver’s side shock tower/headlight stanchion. I really like the slope of the nose as it transitions to the grill…Good Work Jack!

The next iimage shows an ankle level view of the lower nose and nose pan after painting; note the tight gap between the nose and the pan. The fastener is one of the fancy surplus NASA bolts I won on EBay.

The last image in this group shows the nickel-plated grill mounted to the painted nose. It is difficult to express what a kick it is to finally see the nose and grill finished; suffice it to say that I am very, very pleased. Yes, that is indeed a bit of orange peel you see in the paint — more about this later. I will write a section on the paint products used and the final appearance I was aiming for…stay tuned.

 

That is looking really nice. The color is great. How soon till we see it running around town?

 

Hello,

Sorry for the long communication gap, but life happens whether we want it to or not. I just spoke with Jack Presse, the builder, about completion dates and he tells me that August is likely but probably not early August. I had very much hoped to debut the car at the HAMB Drags in Joplin on Aug 22; but that is becoming less likely. It’s not out of the question, but will depend upon how fast things fall into place…details like last minute metal plating of small parts, for example.

I still don’t have a photo of the whole car at this point, but it shouldn’t be too long now as the inside of the doors have been upholstered and will be retuning to Jack’s shop early next week (July 6).

The seat upholstery is complete and came out great from my vantage point. However, my prediction is that lots of you folks won’t be too thrilled. It’s pretty Spartan and (I hope) utilitarian.

Today I’ll post a few shots showing wider views of the roadster. Then in a week or so I’ll post photos of the interior and then perhaps images of the whole enchilada. I would much rather debut the car at the HAMB Drags…but if not I’ll post “debut” photos on this thread.

The images below are pretty much self-explanatory. In the first two images the valve covers are junk parts. In the last photo you can see the correct valve covers just before Jack sent them to the plating shop. The finished grill is present in the last photo; the wheel is a spare PS Engineering Halibrand replica that belongs to Jack. It is used here just for this photo. I have a set of original Culver City Halibrand kidney bean magnesium wheels that will appear later mounted with a set of Coker tall skinny 16 in radial tires. The tires you have seen in earlier photos in this thread are bias ply vintage racing tires, also from Coker.

I haven't hear much from you folks, someone must have an opinion or criticism or ??

trakrodstr

 

awesome car man

 

thanks Dude, some days it seems like an elusive dream that will never end...I'm getting kind of burned out.

Charlie
aks trakrodstr

 

Man your making me feel guilty for letting my pile of track T parts get covered in dust. Man your tin work kicks butt

 

I love that creamy pea soup green!

Its nice and neutral but says im cool.

Stick with it..

 

Speedwagen,

Thanks for the positive comments. Just to be absolutely clear about giving proper credit..I did not do the metalwork, that was done by the builder/fabricator, Jack Presse. You can be assured that I will pass along your praise to Jack (he isn't hook into the web or have a PC).

 

Just curious, but have you thought out the headlight situation? Nice work dude, love the hemi...

 

Incredible build! Breathtaking! May I be so bold as to suggest some engine turning on the dash?

Rick

 

Charlie....what steering gear will you use ?

Edit: Never mind....I went back a couple of pages and found it. The reduction gear is a good idea.

 

Dawg,

Yeah, the headlight buckets are one of my "14 year old" parts. I was at the Turkey Run at Daytona years ago and spied a pair of Perlux fog lights. These units were manufactured with an irregularly-sized sealed beam lamp, a set of horizontal louvers and a clear glass lens at the front the the buckets, they were very common on 18 wheelers years ago. Anyway, the buckets look like a greatly enlarged top of an acorn nut and are made of stainless steel.

The louvers were removed and the perimeter of two modern sealed beams were ground down with sand paper so as to fit. The correct seal beams are no longer made and were produced in a weird small size so that (presumably) the truckers could not replace the fog lamp with a regular headlight sealed beam lamp.

I will make sure an upcoming photo will include a view of the Perlux buckets. For the time being the following photos show a bit of the headlights:

Page 7

Nose and Grill Part I
Figure D

Nose Part II
Figures B and C

Thanks for the question.

*******************************************

Rick, you may of course suggest engine turning for the dash, this technique being one of the most ancient means of decorating metal.
[ http://www.cs.ucr.edu/~eamonn/et/et.htm ]

As you may have seen on an earlier page I put alot of effort into the instrument gauge faces, which are pretty elaborate. Jack and I discussed engine turning and came to the conclusion that doing so might be a bit much. I was/am pretty afraid of overdoing the car and getting too cute. Consequently, there won't be any engine turning for the time being. Maybe you and I will be able to meet sometime and you can make a judgement when you see the dash area for real. I have to admit machine turning is a fantastic look.

Thanks for your question and interest.

Trakrodstr

 

JohnnyFast

The roadster has a Schroeder sprint car box with reduction gear. This facet of the build was discussed on page 5, with photos.

Thanks for the question....

I'm going to hit the sack, and get up at 5:00am tomorrow to drive up to Des Moines for the Goodguys... (from Kansas City).

Any HAMBers at Des Moines, look for an old fart in a wide brimmed straw hat and a long sleeve yellow shirt (sun protection); please say hi if you spy me.

Charlie
aka trackrodstr

 

Upholstery and Interior

First a bit of background:

The roadster’s interior continues my theme of taking cues from interesting racecars. The Williams Brothers Bonneville car is a Model A Ford roadster that was recently found completely unmolested in a barn (see the link below to an article in Hot Rod Magazine). I had known about the car for years and finally got to see it at the 2007 Grand Nat Roadster Show at Pomona.

The Williams car is/was powered by a little Dodge 241 Hemi bored out to 250 cu, so it would fall into the B Roadster class at the salt flats. In 1954 running alcohol through a set of Hilborns the Williams Bros car shattered the previous record at 159 MPH. This car was my main inspiration for wanting to run Hilborns on my roadster. After searching for years I kind of gave up and, and 12 years ago I had Hot Rod Carburetion assemble an induction system based on 3x2bbl Rochesters mounted on a vintage Offy manifold; but I really wanted to run Hilborns. As luck would have it, not too long after the 3x2 set-up was completed, I finally scored a set of vintage Hilborns for my Dodge Hemi. I had to buy a whole engine to get the Hilborns…but I got ‘em. [ I discussed the conversion from mechanical to electronic fuel delivery early in this thread. ]

So the Hilborn injection system is a salute to the William’s roadster; the other cue I took from this historic racecar is the seating and upholstery. As you can see in the photo, which I copied from the HRM link (see below), the Williams Brothers constructed the seat in their Bonneville car using a 50s lawn chair design. The seat is composed of an outer exposed tubing framework within which a cushion is suspended. I liked this no-nonsense look and decide that would be my theme for the seating. Not long after attending the GNRS, I was visited a leather and hide sales warehouse in San Dimas, CA which is near Pomona. Nosing around in the back of the establishment I found two batches of hides I liked and purchased. One is a very thick dark brown leather with lots of character; the other is a light “vanilla” tan leather, which looks like it had been salvaged from the booths of a 50s diner. In my ignorance of auto upholstery leather I ended up buying hides that were WAY too thick for conventional stitching techniques. While that presented difficulties for the upholsterer the heavy leather force me (him) to keep it simple.

I expect that some of the HAMBers are not going to be too impressed with the final result. Although, I’m not going to claim that the seating is beautiful I do think most will agree that the style looks correct and is in keeping with the general theme. Jack wasn’t too thrilled about my seating brainstorm, but he is a genial man and took my peculiar tastes in stride. Now that the upholstery is complete he admits that he kind of likes the plain vanilla approach.

The starting point was the purchase of a standard aftermarket “bench” seat frame that normally would be completely covered with padding and upholstery material. Jack removed the factory mount plates and fabricated some rectangular loops to attach the leather webbing to the frame. The assembly is pretty much self-explanatory. The hides were cut into strips that were feed through the loops and doubled back, then holes were punched and the strips secured with hardware designed for leatherwork. Yes, Jack is a man of many talents…once the basic structure was finalized, the frame was sent to the plating company for the “bronzing” treatment.

Although there is virtually no room behind the seats, the backs are hinged to allow them to flop forward. There is also a fixture between the inboard hinges for a removable center armrest, which I wanted for long drives. In one of the photos you can see that some of the electronics and switches will be hidden under the seat riser.

I should have mentioned earlier that the seating position and dimensions are tailored for me; I am pretty tall so every inch of legroom was used. My back will be very close to the rear of the passenger compartment. Jack fabbed-up an adjustable rubber bump stop for the seat backs that strikes a plate welded to the structural uprights behind the seat.

The upholsterer constructed very thin seat cushions out of high-density foam. According to Jack, the cushions are comfortable. The upholsterer also makes saddles so he has heavy-duty sewing equipment; but the thickness of the leather meant that little decorative stitching could be done. A light colored thread was use and a simple stitch employed. In one photo you can see a single stitch line was made across the seat bottom to delineate the bolsters at the front of the bench. Depending on the display you are viewing, it may be possible to see the cracking and patina in the tan leather.

One of my “regular” HAMB buddies, LB+1, suggested that a rich, warm, brown leather would look nice…I agree, and if I find that the tan color doesn’t cut it, later I can dye the seats to a brown tone.

The last photo shows the kick panel area Jack just finished. The result is a sheet metal trim panel at the leading edge of the doorsill, with the inside of the body covered in the upholstery leather. In my estimation all the recent interior work came out handsomely: however, I haven’t yet seen the new interior “in the flesh”, only photos.

The inside surface of the rear quarter panels (outboard driver and passenger shoulder area) will be leather covered similar to the kick panel area. Parenthetically, the floorboard is missing in the last photo, and you can see the “shorty” spin-on oil filter that is necessary due to the lack of room between the engine and the frame rail (it’s the white cylindrical object).

One of the “exterior” photos shows, here, for the first time, the “bronzed” Ford door hinges (which are cast brass) against the green paint. This detail came out nicely; the hinges add a bit of sparkle and have a vintage look.

Let me know what you think…even if you aren’t fond of the end result. It’s interesting to hear different opinions.

Check out the Williams Bros racecar at:

http://www.hotrod.com/featuredvehic...t_rod_cars_barn_finds/1928_ford_roadster.html

 

Great craftsmanship... It's hard for me to stay on track for 14 hours, let alone 14 years! Awesome job.

Kevin
Ooltewah Speed Shop

 

The car is really looking great. If you haven't seen it, the Rodders Journal had a nice spread on the William's roadster a while back (last year maybe).

 

Wow.

 

Where is the shop located that the car is in? Sorry to be nosy but the view outside the shop widow is fantastic! If I had a view like that I'm not sure anything would get done.
And your project, I cannot wait to see it completed and hopefully you will post a sound track when you light er off.

 

Wow - some great work and great ideas. The entire car is going to have a hard time living upto the pieces.

 

What is there to say? Jeem nailed it...........WOW!

 

A note on your upholstery. I drove my car around for a year using 2 Uhaul blankets and 3 towels. I used a Coupe seat pan that I moved forward and backward at least 10 times. Upholstery is a major part in making a car drivable. It does you no good to have it look cool but after a 100 mile drive they have to lift you out of the car.
From what I see the setup you have will be very comfortable for a long time as you will sit on your legs and Butt not your tail bone. It is your unit make it how YOU want. Not what other folks think it should be.
Excellent pic and story
Thank you