Technical Trouble with Ford Y-Block (Seized after turning over)

Hi guys, I recently picked up for '56 Ford Customline with a 272 Y-Block (http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/brought-home-a-56-ford-4-door-barn-find.947208/). After getting it home, I turned it over using the fan and verified that it was free. Instead of doing the smart thing, and still going ahead and pulling the plugs, I hooked a jumper pack up and bumped the starter. Turned over fine, so I did it a couple of more times. Dumped a little gas down the carb and nothing happened, so I pulled a plug to verify spark. After cleaning the points, I went to turn it over and the solenoid just clicked.

Thought it was the bendix stuck on the starter, so I pulled that out, and the motor is still stuck. I've been trying to turn it using the crank bolt, but now the bolt itself it turning. I've pulled the plugs (except for one that won't come out- it turns hard, but it just seems to spin?) and put some Marvel Mystery oil in the cylinders.

So, did I seize the bearings? I know I medssed up by not pouring oil in the cylinders, but it turned over several full revolutions just fine. None of the spark plugs had rust on them, and the dipstick said it was full on oil. I tried to put a pry bar on the ring gear, but can't really find a good spot (unless I pull the clutch cover). It's a manual, so I can try to rock it, but I need to get tires first. Should I pull the valve covers?

Any advice is greatly appreciated!

 

Pulled the valve covers tonight, and everything looks real clean. According to the reciepts and the odometer, it was a rebuilt motor by Ford and has about 15k miles on it.

Driver's side:


Passenger's side:

 

Brought home a 223 Ford once and did the same thing, turned over a little then was jammed up tight. Turns out the throwout got jammed up in the clutch and wouldn't let it turn over. No trans attached, so it was just floating around. Had a bit of a moment until I figured it out. Maybe the trans is stuck in two gears, or something like that?

 

The crank bolt shouldnt keep turning if you are turning it right tightening.
You could jack it up in the back with a floor jack under hog head and see if the rear wheels will turn by hand while its out of gear.

 

I guess the trans could be an issue? It seems to shift just fine in and out of gear though...

I'll try to jack it up to test everything though. When we pulled it out of the barn, three of the wheels turned (driver's front didn't want to) so it wasn't locked up at that point.

 

That hard to turn plug just may be the one in the cylinder full of water...(rust)
Drain some oil, does water come out ahead of the oil?

 

The bolt keeps turning if its stripped

 

Yeah thats partly what I meant, I guess I wasnt too clear but I think that bolt would break before it would strip unless someone previously took it out and crossthreaded it putting it back in
.....it does sound like stripped thread on that last plug or worse (in the head) unless its just coming out hard, Ive heard of guys using a healy?(spelling) coil to thread a plug in a stripped out (maybe aluminum?)head but I have never done it myself.

 

I wonder if a guy could manually compress the valves on that cylinder while someone else turns the motor to release the pressure if it is full of water or gas with both valves stuck closed.

....or could a piston be hitting a stuck open valve?....looks like you could back the crank back up tho???

 

Pull the heads.

 

This is probably the thing to do but it would be my last resort depending on what my plans were for the car.............................could the timing chain have broke and wadded up against the crank someway?

 

You have a possible buggered plug hole. Maybe hydro locked cylinder. Maybe... Maybe something else.

Pulling heads will take an hour or two and is not really a big deal. Buy your gaskets after pulling the heads. If you need to fix the spark hole it'll be easier then too.

And that will tell you nothing about the lower end.

 

Pulling the timing cover is almost as bad if not a bigger job. But you should be able to check the timing chain by pulling the fuel pump and little mirror and flashlight work.

Certainly timing cover, if its in a vehicle it, would take longer then removing heads.

Guess it depends on what the end need is.

 

I've never pulled the head on an OHV engine, but I'm guessing that's what I'll end up doing. Definately going to take more then an hour or two then... Have to undo the carb linkages, remove intake, distributor, and exhaust manifold, then get into the head.

Obviously start with the head with the bad spark plug. Do I just remove the rocker assembly and then undo the head bolts? I guess I better pull one before seeing if the whole motor needs to be pulled.

 

By the way, Am I the only one getting red Xs instead of pics?

 

I suggest you purchase a "Motors" Manual and READ, READ before doing anything,,I say this after reading that you have never pulled a head before..

 

I had a 55 ford truck it turned over fine with my hand,when i put a battery in it and turned it over it locked up. It was a 270 i had a known good 292 swaped them out.when i got it on the floor i noticed rust cam out of the manifold. took heads off was full of rust from manifold when i turned it over it had got on top of the piston. With heads removed it turned fine i cleaned it out put new gaskets on it fired right up . sold it to a buddy of mine for his 48 f1 still running today

 

Don't need to remove the distributor, but will have to remove the wires. Rockers will have to come off, there are head bolts under the rocker shafts.

 

Buy a manual will ya?

 

You were right, guess I'm just used to SBC's, thanks for the advice... Anyways, I have the head pretty much ready to pull. Exhaust manifold definately had some rust in it, but not a ton. Head bolts all came out good, just have one bolt stuck on the driver's side of the intake manifold, and I didn't have time to pull the bolt for the generator mount. Hopefully tomorrow I can get it off and take a look.

 

For future reference there are 2 different lengths of the long head bolts on this engine. They go in the front and rear holes in the cyl. head. If you mix them up with the shorter ones & install them in the center 3 holes they will bottom out in the block and the head gasket won't seal. Ck out John Mummerts site ford-y-block.com for some good yblock info. He even has a page that lists the errors people make assembling them.

 

http://ford-y-block.com/assemblyerrors.htm

I'm going to assume from your profile pict that you have some knowledge of disassemble and retaining parts in order. Digital pictures are nice and a piece of cardboard with holes punched in it for bolts is a cheap way to keep things in order.

Not sure why you have to mess with the gen. But hey

 

Thanks for the tip! I kept everything seperated, but didn't look real close at the length. I'll be sure to double check everything.

Ha, ya had a little practice there. I put rings and bearings in an 8BA... Didn't solve the smoking problem (really needed to be bore out, but it was worth a try I guess), but it did hold up when I was doing about 75 in my coupe, with a '39 3 speed I rebuilt, and 4.86 gears.

In my customline, the top mounting bolt for the generator bracket is bolted to the head. Was that common for Y-Blocks?

 

I've got a previously rebuilt 272 shortblock if you end up needing it....its in the classifieds for scrap price...

 

I'll be sure to keep that in mind- whereabouts in Mass are you?

 

[QUOTE="Shaun1162, post: 10668095, member: 106549"

In my customline, the top mounting bolt for the generator bracket is bolted to the head. Was that common for Y-Blocks?[/QUOTE]

Late night brainfart there , Yes there is one bolt from the gen on the head.

been over a year since I tore down my 292 to a short block and plasta-guaged the bearings. Everything was in spec so, cleaned it up (special attention to the oil galleys), and through new gaskets on everything and have been driving it.

 

Near Springfield - right off 91

 

Did the thing hydrolock when you poured stuff into it?


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Problem is that it's locked up. Pulled starter to eliminate. Trans neutralized. Stripped plug hole. Next order of business is heads. If problem isn't located then more measures are needed.

 

Was the air cleaner off, or did you have it off? If a foreign object fell down the carb it could have worked its way into the cylinder and jammed it up. This will be obvious when you take the head off. Can you turn it backwards even a little bit?