Technical Trying to get 283 Running

So, I am beginning to get frustrated trying to get a ‘67 283 running that has been sitting for about 30 years. I took this deal on to help out a retired coworker and am starting to regret it. Anyway, he had messed with it some before giving up and asking me to help and I was suckered into doing so. Seemed easy enough right?

Anyway, the motor was free and would crank when I first got it. I figured I could get away with just maybe swapping points or something and at least get it to try to fire. After trying that with no luck, I decided to go ahead and change the oil, plugs, wires, rebuild the two barrel, put all new belts and hoses, and swap the distributor since he didn’t want to mess with points going forward. So, after all that, I finally tried to bust it off again tonight. At first, pretty sure I had the distributor a tooth off since I had to advance it as far as it would go for it to try to fire. I pulled #1 plug out and had my wife bump it to TDC so I could verify where the rotor was pointing on the cap. And, sure enough, I needed to pull it and move one tooth. I knew it would then bust off easy once back together. Anyway, still doesn’t want to start and acts more like it is flooded or something the way it is trying. I have poured a little gas in but also using starting fluid.

Anyway, one thing that has always seemed strange on this engine is how it cranks. It almost just seems “tight” or something which seems strange considering it is just an old worn out 283. I guess I need to pull plugs and check compression on every cylinder next to see what I may be missing. I’m starting to wonder if it is just so low on compression or something that it doesn’t want to run.

Any other ideas from the experts that I should be checking?

 

You already created the big nightmare. You don't know if it ran before but now you created several different possibilities for error by swapping out all those parts. Start with ONE thing and make sure it works correctly. Then move on to the next thing. Good Luck.

 

Yea, probably right although it has been a nightmare since I decided to try to help at all. It needed all the things I did and I figured I might as well just do those things before trying too hard. If it was mine, I would just swap in a fresh motor. It did run several years back although was reported to have been worn out burning oil, etc. This has been in one family it’s whole life so I do know the history although they aren’t real mechanical thus why he asked me to get it running.

 

I get spark and pour some fresh fuel down the carb and if it won't run right away, I do a compression test. Saves a lot of hassle.

 

I have owned......raced.....worked on.....overhauled......tuned up......265 283 327 Chev engines for almost 60yrs. Mechanic in Chevrolet dealership from 1959 to 1974......dirt track stock car builder 1964 to 1972 etc. etc. etc. I am totally dismayed and discouraged by the threads that are showing up on here about inability to make them run at all or run well. They are a really SIMPLE engine. Basics......basics......basics. And above all.....stop throwing strange parts at them just because you can.......especially strange versions of "dizzys"......or is that "dizzies" ??. OK.....end of RANT

 

Stuck valve or two?

 

Thanks for the ideas guys. I suspect I can figure it out checking compression as mentioned. I’ll do that tomorrow.

And, sorry to bother anyone. I should just keep to myself and not post worthless threads that will likely never help anyone out.

 

How about this for something positive.......if it seems tight.....it might just be tight. Give it some penetrating oil and/or atf in the cylinders for a couple days......you said it sat for 30 yrs. Even before a compression test.....have you pulled both valve covers......are all the rocker arms moving ? Is a valve stuck and rocker stud or studs pulled up ......easy check with some sort of straight edge across all studs on each side. These engines will start and run with....at least one even sometimes two pistons with holes in them......several cam lobes totally worn down which was a huge problem that started in 1967.....with whatever your dizzy of choice is......do you have spark ?? Hold the wire end.....while cranking.....it will liven things up. As someone else said.....spark and a little gas down the carb will do wonders. You are trying to START the engine......not blueprint or dyno tune it.
See....you sucked me in......but maybe the world will be a better place with one more sweet running 283.

 

You've already had the distributor out at least twice, and at least once installed with it a tooth off. I'd be checking to ensure it's not 180 out as that's the easiest mistake to make.

And x2 on is there a spark? Existence of spark foremost, then the timing of it.

I'm no expert though!

Chris

 

Dang, we have to pull your “SBC Card”.
You’ll get it, I am wondering about compression though after a worn engine that’s been sitting so long.

 

Don't forget that the No 1 slug will be at TDC twice - Once when it is on the top of the power stroke (both valves closed) and once when the exhaust valve is about to close and the inlet opens. The distributor rotor only points to that cylinder when both valves are closed, (the "bang" part of suck, squeeze, bang, blow).

 

A fine Sunday morning, GS.
Mark beat me to it.
Remove the distributor cap.
Turn the engine by hand.
Just a little back and forth.
Watch the rotor in the distributor.
Watch to see if you've got some lost motion due to an extremely loose timing chain.

 

And maybe pull the valve covers, turn the engine over and make sure all of the valve train is working.
I've seen a camshaft break in half so that only the front half was turning and it wasn't driving the distributor.

 

2x on oiling the cylinders on a dormant engine. The cylinder walls are too dry to build sufficient compression. Give that a shot, then do a compression test if it doesn't light off.

 

Jeff, pull the plugs and check the compression like you mentioned. If the timing chain has slipped, compression will be uniformly low across the board. If your friend has his heart set on this 283, maybe a call to Northern Auto Parts for a master kit is in order. Don’t worry about the naysayers, I’m ASE certified in 17 areas with 2 Master Certifications and still occasionally get tripped up over seemingly simple mistakes.

 

Thanks guys. I also thought of the timing chain possibility but didn’t know of that method to test it. I like that. Today I’ll be oiling cylinders down good, checking compression, pulling valve covers to make sure all the valves are opening and will report back. I do know it has spark and it definitely isn’t 180 out. I have only done that screw up once when I was about 15 and know better since. When I say I pulled the #1 plug it was to have my wife bump the key until it blew my finger out of the hole and verifying where it was in the timing mark. I’m now betting on just dry cylinders or something in the valve train amiss. Should be easy enough to figure out. I really need to try to keep my SBC card.

And, for the record, I tried to talk him out of the HEI @Moriarity. Most of you guys know me better than to have suggested that. All my old cars have points.

If nothing else, this is timely before I need to try to get my 305 GMC running in my own 61 pickup. It has also been sitting about the same time but only has 40k miles on it. Hoping to save it and avoid a rebuild or swap at least for a while.

 

Dry cylinders? Hmmm....I don't know about that. But I've encountered stuck rings, from sitting. Not nearly enough compression to run. Simple fix, pull the pistons out, hone the bores a bit, put some new rings on, and you have a decent running engine, assuming the valvetrain still works, etc.

 

First thought was bad coil, second thought was stuck rings.

seems you’ve confirmed spark and your looking for rings.

other than “tight” what’s it actually sound like when your cranking it?

im curious if it’s different with out spark or different with the plugs out? Could help narrow it down. Though I feel like rings is what your going to find

 

Like Moriarity said, "timing gears."

 

Thanks again for all the constructive ideas guys. I have been building SBC’s since I was 14 and have also chased about any problem one might have but admittedly have never tried to get a motor running that has sat this long. I’m still learning since I have yet to know everything. Well, except when I was a teenager which I am familiar with again having three in the house currently...

 

"I have yet to know everything. "

I am reminded I am in that boat every day at least once, and often several times.

 

Not knowing everything is normal...the frustrating thing is forgetting stuff, and spending hours chasing your tail over something you should know better.

 

While you are pulling plugs and soaking cylinders, try grabbing the balancer and spinning it over by hand, then check for thrust. You can often feel a worn timing chain, too, but check it as outlined. A worn "ran when parked" engine is a possible core. A revived worn out engine can fail catastrophically. Guess who will be blamed?
As said, a 67 engine should be easy to pop the valve covers off, look things over and check compression on before the quick 'n easy that has already failed. I completely understand the 'just helping' quick shot, but now it's time to do the gentle, careful wake up. Best of luck, I've got a plugged up sink drain that a 25 foot snake isn't clearing!

 

It should be back firing thru the carb if it is a 180 off. If the timing chain was that far off I think it would kicking back against the starter a touch or at least trying to backfire?

 

It'll backfire through the carb if timing is too advanced, through the exhaust if its too retarded. Timing will need to be 20 extra degrees advanced if the gear is installed 180-out on your new distributor (out of phase).

Plugs gapped at least .040" with HEI, .025 with points or you'll have an inferior spark. Verify spark at the plugs when cranking. Very fuel with the accelerator pump.

Set the crank pulley at 15 BTDC. Line up the 8 points on the stator and pickup coil inside the HEI for the base timing with the rotor pointing to #1 and it should run.

 

I too get sucked in on the 'easy fix' for a friend...it seems the less the job pays, the harder it is.
I would start by pulling all the plugs and see how it turns over then....
that sets you up for a compression test and also lets you see if the plugs were 'wet' from flooding on start up...

Good luck brother

 

and if you do get decent compression (over 100 on most of the holes), and you're damn sure the spark is strong and at the right time, put some brand new spark plugs in it. They get fouled when things are not set right, and you can't see that they're fouled.

 

A long time ago I ran into a no start that the owner had been fooling with for a long time. I don't remember what the original cause was, but the engine had been flooded so badly the oil was completely washed off the cylinder walls. A small squirt of oil in each cylinder and new plugs made her fire right up.