Hot Rods Unconverntional 39 Ford pickup chop started, suggestions or tips?

I'll do 3 posts tonight to keep the pics in order..

This cab belongs to a friend who wants some of it done a certain way, and the rest is just using suggestions from people who stop by, or me ..

He wanted to "lower" the windshield down to the cowl top, and to raise the windshield up into the roof crown more. When these trucks get chopped, the crown looks too high, and the panel below the windshield looks too tall. I think it's a good idea. Blue tape shows where some metal will come out.

Also, it looks like the top of the back window should be moved up more, into the crown? It might look better, I think.

He also wants slanted posts, which I also think will be good. Lots more work. though.

Next post will be the door window style..

 

The door window issue:

These trucks, when chopped medium to heavy, the door window starts to look like a severe "angle chop" and the window shape is like almond shaped.

We are looking for comments about trying to change that look a bit, maybe by chopping the rear more than the front?

If that might look better, it brings up a problem of where to cut the back, as there will be an angle change on the vertical backside of the cab, either below or above the back gl***.

I'd think it would need to be cut more towards the top, to get a better blend..


OR...should we forget cutting the back more??

 

Look here
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=578435&showall=1

 

Started some serous cutting tonight;

The entire dash looked like it needed to come out, so out it goes. That worked out OK, because he now wants a 40 car dash.

Then, as I thought it made sense, I cut the entire windshield area out. I did that for two reasons; one being that now the bottom of the windshield posts don't look all that difficult to angle-cut. The other reason was to be able to mock up the look of the slanted back windshield...as we mock the rough chop in.


Too late to turn back now...

We are also eliminating the factory seam that goes across the front edge of the roof. The slanted windshield should make the two angles much closer to a smooth curve.

We are also going away from the opening windshield, to a fixed one like 40 Ford car...we think..

 

Yep, I have been reading Alex's chop thread since day one, as I knew this job was coming in.



I've also been telling everyone that stops by, that there is a good reason why Alex is NOT doing what we are trying to do....maybe because it can't work..

 

I would just chop it and get the posts..etc and the roof height/profile where you want it. When taking the meat out you can lower the back side of the roof to where it almost looks level on top. Stock..the roof angles forward slightly which dicates the door frames angling hard like you talked about when cutting those.

If you are careful with the roof position your door tops should have more the shape that you are seeing in your head. Since you already cut the windshield frame out you can put the gl*** in where ever you want it after cutting and tacking the roof.

How much of a back window you want determines where the cuts happen in the back

 

i like the idea of removing the material above and below the front and back windows. as far as the side window opening, since you are laying the windshield back, maybe you could cut the front door post off, at the bottom of the window opening, and cut the back off at the top of the door and see how the removed piece looks following the slanted front post. i tried to picture it looking at the side view picture but it's hard to picture because things will change with the slanted post and chop.

 

This is where we need help. Maybe I should draw a sketch to show the problem that "might" happen if the cut is not high enough..up where it starts to curve forward?

If you looked at the side of the cab, (at the back edge of the cab) at the vertcal "line" from the beltline and up.... if I angled the chop to get the rear lower, then that vertical line would have 2 angles intersecting?

...or am I thinking too much? Maybe if the angle-chop is only 1" more at the back, maybe there won't be much of a change in the vertical "line"?

I can try to sketch it if I can't make this clear enough in words..

 

Ray, the owner, is bringing over a spare 39 cab with doors in the morning..all rusty at the bottom 6", but we will use the mint roof skin.

So, we could test cut the junk door tops to see if it looks good or not (with an angle chop to straighten out the almond shape)

 

Here are the tape lines for the final chop. It will be chopped 7/8" more at the back, than the front. The door cuts won't be in those areas, we were just trying to see what the window opening would look like.

Roughly a 4" front, and 4-7/8" at the back panel....that leaves a change of about 3/4" in the door window area.

We did cut the entire roof off today and left the front posts still on. I will slant those maybe tonight.

Cutting out the dash and the entire windshield area worked out great for getting access to where the posts need laying back.

My biggest concern at this point, is trying to change the radius at the top front of the door and the matching top front door opening. I have a idea, but don't know if it will work out.

Also, the spare 39 cab showed up but the roof skin is not as good as I hoped. Not much can be saved from that one.

 

my initial thought on the doors would be to measure your differences front and rear, and then accommodate your chop so the side window "angles" didnt change. Im late to the show if I read your post correctly. Ill be checking in for the update

 

If I read your reply right ...actually we are trying to change the angle at the tops of the door windows. They look like almond shape with any type of a decent chop. To me it looks R-- that way.

Ok, then.. I just went back out for an hour to slant-cut the p***enger side W/S post. Then I took a slice of the p*** side roof, and tacked it to the body. LAST pic shows how much of the top part of the roof curve/rain gutter that I left out. It was just a guess.. I tried to eliminate the tightest radius of that whole deal.

Then, I put the un-chopped windshield panel back in, layed it back, but also tucked the bottom edge under the cowl. You can look at a stock cab to see what a great change that is; getting rid of the "high cheekbones" under the windshields. I love the look so far.

Now we will need to decide how much to chop the windshield. I am thinking 2 or 3" ??? . What do you think?

I also would love to take some crown out of the entire roof senter section. These trucks get that "jiffy pop" look with a chop, IMO.

Ray's best friend is "dingman" on hamb. He has both the advanced equipment and skills to wheel a new center roof panel...

We will also be fixing the very top of that W/S post to make the curve blend perfect. I just need to cut off 2", then add a donor slice that has a very slight radius. Eveything I was worried about is looking better. I can see why Custom guys are so into custom work...It's like sculpture or art, I think.


Oh, I keep forgetting to say; This truck is getting 38 Ford Deluxe car complete front nose.

 

Thanks for the opinion on the angled posts; that's the whole point of asking for suggestions.

How about splitting the difference, and tilt it back forward more?

The reason for "some" angle, is because the more chop these cabs get, it seems like the windshields get "too straight up, looking". The top edge of the roof looks like a steep cliff. Or maybe that might go away with the windshield moved up into the roof? Just guessing here.

What we can do in the morning, is straighten it up a bit more, maybe mock up one door chop...chop the windshield piece about 2-1/2" then put up pics for opinions again.


Again, thanks for the reply; I was hoping for more eyes to help this job get going correctly.

 

check out the thread Alex Gambino put up on chopping one of those cabs. Lots of good info. wish i knew how to link it here

 

It's in post #3..


Unfortunately, the chop is a lot different in style. I hope not TOO different.


Well, thanks for the reply, as when I scrolled back to see where Alex's link was, I saw the pic of the stock door window shape. In my best Alex imitation: "That's a F-----G ugly window" .. It really is, and many things on a 39 cab are downright ugly...we hope to fix some of them.


we have a small antique bulldozer here, so we can crush and bury our mistakes

 

oops...my mistake not cuttin across the roof or cuttin out the entire centre is highly recommended in my book

 

Here is where it is now;

2.5" out of the windshield. The post is laid back 10 more degrees on p*** side, and driver side is still at normal angle. See how the slanted side makes it look chopped more?

We are not using the 39 swing out W/S frame; it will be like 40 car.

Mocking up the door window chop. I think the side window shape looks fine?

Plenty of headroom still.

I will try to pull a bit of crown out of the rear part of the roof.

What do you think so far?

 

That looks really good, Frank. Nice work! I'm keeping an eye on this thread, as my next project is a 40 Ford truck-rod too.

 

The last pickup I chopped I used the beltline as the bottom cut line, then simply tucked the top down into the cab the desired amount and welded it all back up. It worked really well, I'm sorry I don't have the pics on this computer to show what I'm talking about. By using the beltline as the cutline It made for alot less warpage, and filler work.

 

Did you notice my 32 is not still back in the cold storage area like it was when you were here (I hope I can get it on the road this year)


Just a heads up; we could not get the driver door to fit up with a good even back edge gap, until we cut the roof off.

The cab was welded together wrong since new. The cab is from out west and the sills are rust free. The rear vertical gap was fine at the bottom, but got real wide up beyond the beltline.

So, we had to cut the roof off, then align the door gaps perfectly, before we could put the cross bracing in, to continue the chop.

The cab is REALLY gutted right now, lots of stuff cut out, but makes it much easier to do the angled posts.

I've never seen a roof cut like this on a chop before, it's just a slice down the sides of the roof from front to back. The center of the roof was jumped on, and I thought we had a nice donor roof center.. So now, I may need to re-use the old center part.

 

Here's where we are tonight.

The p***enger door is all fitted and tacked including the rain gutter . It all fits nice. Perfect gaps.

Then we just started mocking up the driver side, by slanting that post back, slicing the other roof side off, and then test fitting the windshield part.

Ray decided to measure the windshield post angle on the 40 coupe in the back room. I was suprised to find out that the 40 coupe is slanted back a degree or two more that what we did on the truck cab. So, if a 40 coupe looks good, then this cab should look good.

I love the new look with the windshield sunk lower, and the windshield goes up higher into the roof.

Another hot rod friend showed up today to help with mock up and opinions. I asked him "if you could change anything, would you?" he said no, it looks great.

What do you think? We'd like some opinions...thanks

 

Frank, i really like the way the side windows turned out. it was a good decision to remove material from above and below the windshield.

 

Yeah, I'm hoping you decide to sell it to me soon.

 

What he said ! Nice Work !

Ray

 

That was Ray's idea,.... which he "stole" from hamber "Old Gold" 's 40? that was listed on ebay 2 years ago.

We took that idea, but went with the reverse angle chop, and did this windshield quite a bit different than that one...and we are not using the 39 swing out W/S frame. It will be a clean look with a 40 coupe style gasket and center bar.

Also, 3 of us were messing with the rear window today...looks like the bottom might stay put in stock location, but the opening will be chopped only 1.5" or so. So, that will push the window up into the almost 5" chopped rear roof, to help remove the bubble look from standing behind the truck.

Also we are tossing ideas around for donor roof center skin. The only donor metal right here now, is 56 Olds trunklid, and roof. Might be able to use some of the trunklid. Trying to flatten the back of the stock 39 roof a bit. It won't take much flattening to make a huge difference.

 

the donor roof i always searched out when filling a roof was from, late 70's early 80's camaro/firechicken but they might be too shallow for that roof.

 

Thanks Ray...we are trying hard to get this right.... The trucks owner "ray" also mentioned that a "car looking" windshield angle, should look better with the car front sheetmetal like your avatar...is that a 38 Deluxe or a 39 Standard?

Do you have any idea on what we face with that swap on the 39 cab?

 

Yep, too flat. I am going to see if the Olds trunklid might fit backwards..

The front of the 39 roof will need to drop down a bit, right above the W/S. So, if I cut the Olds lid just as it goes over and starts heading down to the bumper, maybe it could work. I think it will be much too short to reach to the rear of the cab.

I don't have any tools to make a new roof center.

 

My avatar is my late brother's '38 Deluxe Coupe. I have seen a late 30's Ford pickup with the p***enger front end but do not know exactly what mods are required. It does not appear to be difficult to do....certainly easier than chopping a top

Ray