Using an epoxy glue for structure

I would suggest you remove the paint from the surfaces you want to bond together with 80 grit to give the adhesive a better tooth to grip to. You should apply the adhesive to both sides the panel and the substructure and then spread it over the exposed (sanded) surface with a brush or filler spreader to ensure all surfaces are covered for corrosion resistence. Other than that it sounds like a good plan.

 

I would imagine you could 54.

 

Yes

 

Epoxy for panel bonding is good..not only does it bond.. it seals.. but a strutural area should be ALWAYS tack welded.. always.. flex in the body will make the epoxy give....as mentioned in earlier posts.. grind the areas , to epoxy..bead it on, brush it somewhat thin.. make sure you get the epoxy that has a drying window.. like 2 hours or more.. so you can work together your panels.. to fast.. maybe your down side.. Roof skins or box sides on new vehicles are no different.. they have the same prcedure..

 

I am having a rocker and rear trunk panel in a 55 changed and he glued them in and no warpage.

 

im not sure on the model #'s, but when i was doing the trucks for the show we used a product from 3m that we called "green glue". it was in two tubes the nozzle mixed it and was replaceable as you needed. you could use as little or as much at a time.it is dispensed by a air gun. that **** would hold anything together, dries really fast also.

 

Here's a question for you pros from a total amateur. A few years ago I was considering trying to attach the rear floorboard section in a Model A Tudor using a product called 3M UltraPro Auto Body Sealant 08301. Somebody recommended it...I was planning to set the panel in place using clecos (as above) then put the sealer along the edges of the panel where they overlap the subrails. Then (as above) use pop rivets. The rear floorboard (this is the panel under the rear seat) was held in originally by hot rivets, and that is beyond my skill level. I'm not going for Fine Point Judging at the MARC Nationals; I just want a sound rear floor that won't leak, and if newer technology can ***ist then I'm all for it.
Fearless

 

Sounds good, just use cherrymax or some other kind of structural "pop rivet" and it should be fine and you can just go around after it's clecoed in place and put the rivets in while the epoxy is still wet.

 

I'm afraid if I pull the cherrys if it is still wet, they may squeeze down and leave dimples. I dunno. Maybe not......

I won't use Pop rivets, I just figured if I said Cherrymax, everyone would have a glazed over look.

 

I have been using the 3M 8115 since the day it came on the market. Saleman said it was a hard sell to many body shops because "thats not the way to do it" thinking. 3M includes a gaurantee in every packet stating that applied properly it matches or exceeds the factory welds strenght. It is made to be used over clean roughed up metal, not painted surfaces. You can get around this by doing your painting and then take a sharpie and mark out the lines where the bond will be on all pieces. Then take think cut off wheel and run down your marked out lines to remove paint. You can go carefully and sparingly resulting in a good seal and bond and no bare metal or bonding material showing when you are finished.

I have never done floor panels but I think the results would be good considering the floor pans are not your structural integrity but rather a cover to keep the noise, stink, and elements out of car. Tubes are around $40 each. One tube will do about two quarter panels.

It may take a bit longer than welding but when the bonder dries your done! Over the years doing rust repair I called using this product a total chemical repair.........no trapped burned metal, no bare metal, no grinding, no finish sealing. Not a technique for all purposes but in some cases it really is awesome. Steve

 

Thank, I would appriciate that. Pm them to me if you want or email or just post them up.
Thanks again

 

dude.. at 80.00 it may be cheaper to fuse it with this glue.. it will certainly be faster..

 

heres the fuzor number 112b ,, the gun to use is a newborn model 510.. you will require more than the two tips they provide in each package.. the welds just provide safety..

 

Fusor is not an epoxy but an acrylic. It works on metal but will not give you the same work times as an epoxy which are slower.

 

You shouldn't be squeezing down enough to dimple the metal or you will be squeezing all of the adhesive out from between the two panels. Automotive adhesives have gl*** micro spheres (bubbles) in them to maintain the required adhesive thickness between the two panels. If you start hearing them pop (a crackling sound) you are clamping too tight and will not have the full bond strength of the product. They spheres will break long before you start dimpling metal with a rivet.

 

What glue?

 

If you don't need any structural quality bonder I would use PL brand heavy duty construction adhesive with polyurethane. Comes in a red/yellow/black tube and this stuff is super. It stays somewhat flexible after it cures, ( about 24 hrs ) It's about $5.00 a tube and is much stronger than what its bonded to. I've used it over and over again and never had a joint come loose. The polyurethane stuff is the key, dont get the regular without it. Menards/ Home Depot has it.

 

The Structural Adhesives work great. I did an experiment bonded two 1/4 panels and a tailpanel and then put the body on a frame rack. I had four 10 ton pullers on it and pulled the roof down 8" and the 1/4's 4" without pulling the body apart. Just make sure you weld in the stress areas.(Corners, lap areas and areas that twist.) If I remember correctly the Olds Aurora only had 8 or 12 spot welds in the front frame rails. The rest of the rail was bonded. Use a tradename product and you should have no problem.

J. Poole The Old Tinbasher.

 

We use the 3M 8115 and Fusor as mentioned above. If we do a quarter we use the 3M because it cures a little slower.....especially in the Arizona Summer heat.

A Dodge viper body is glued/epoxied to the frame rails.


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Several of the large commercial vehicle manufacturers use pruducts made by ITW Plexus. ITW Plexus many different formulas for different applications. The suff is tough as nails.

 

Here is the substructure we talked about.

 

Look at Devcon Metal Welder II. It is described as a structural bonding agent for load bearing bonds.
www.devcon.com
800-933-8266

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Is the floor going to be all one piece or are you doing it in sections?

Thats going to be alot of bonding

 

1 piece.

 

WOW you are going to have to work fast to use an automotive adhesive. Most of the slow epoxies are going to have a work time of about 90 minutes at 70 degrees. Not alot of time to cover all of those surfaces and the floor panel.

 

If the floor is one piece I see no problem. If it were multiple pieces I would weld the stress areas just for insurance in an accident. You don't want to be inside where a collision breaks the adhesive and sharp panel edges start acting like a food processor with you being the target.

Terry

 

hmm i've only welded floor pans in before but i have used adhesives for roofs/doors. i think the hardest part would be clamping it to the frame until it drys. Meh if you can get it flat enough and clamped down i say go for it.

 

I have bonded in small sections but never the entire floor but I don't see why it wouldn't work on the substructure you have built... I would prefit the floor and drill some holes and screw it down , then take it out and when you glue it use the screws to pull it down and hold it in postion.....

 

weld it...........

 

I've only recently been exposed to this technology. Mostly due to new guys at the shop who swear by it.

I've used the 3M panel adheisive in a coupl different applications and been extremely surprised and happy at well it holds.

In situations such as yours, I have put a couple self tapping screws in first just tp make sure everthing was aligned properly. Take the screws out, apply adheisive to panels, install self tapping screws for alignment, wait 4-5 hours and remove screws. after a day, weld up the few screw holes.

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