V8 swap in 54 pontiac

cochran242 · Mar 22, 2011

[FONT=&quot]I have been a member of the HAMB for a couple years; mostly lurking (I have posted an intro HERE). When I do go forward with my progress I will be sure to start a project thread. I am just in the discovery phase right now.[/FONT]
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[FONT=&quot]I have decided to swap my straight 8 with a Pontiac 389 or 400 in my 1954 Pontiac. I have never done a swap like this so any help from someone that has done this swap would be awesome. Some of the questions I have right now are:[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Can I buy engine mounts or do I have to fabricate them? [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]If I need to fab them, does anyone have pics or even better a few drawings?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]What about clearances for this swap, any issues or gotchas?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]What headers will fit without modification?
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Whats a good transmission to pair with a 389\400?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Looks like BuzzBomb's kept the defroster (LINK), How does the heater hoses get routed?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Do I need to replace the original gas pedal linkage and go with a different style?[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I am open with any advice or comments about this swap as I am learning and any help is greatly appreciated. [/FONT]

applekrate · Mar 23, 2011

Your engine choice for the swap is the right one. As for a trans, do you want an auto or a stick?
Depending on how much driving you do, I would use an overdrive trans. I am sure there are people here on the Hamb who can help you but, if not, I can refer you to a more comprehensive Pontiac related site that may be more helpful. You can PM me if you like.
good luck with it and keep us posted on your progress.

www.pontiacheaven.org

345 DeSoto · Mar 23, 2011

If you could put up with only about 250 HP, you might consider using a mid 60's Pontiac OHC six. The longer, rather than wider engine will fit the engine compartment much better, and it will bolt up to a 200-4R or 700-R4 OD transmission. I used one in a 40 Pontiac and swapped out the 40 steering column for a 49 column...with the shift quadrant on it....

cochran242 · Mar 23, 2011

applekrate - I am wanting to stay with an automatic transmission. Because this will be my daily driver I think an overdrive would be good. I'll take that Pontiac website if you have it handy.

345 DeSoto - Have not thought about any sixes. I am a little afraid that it may not pull this car very well as this car is beefy! I am looking for some definite pep, but it is a good though and I will look into it.

73RR · Mar 23, 2011

Be sure to chat with (Scott) Scootermcrad as he is also gathering info on a similar Poncho project.
BTW, you get mega points for the 389.

.

porknbeaner · Mar 23, 2011

applekrate said: ↑

Your engine choice for the swap is the right one. As for a trans, do you want an auto or a stick?
Depending on how much driving you do, I would use an overdrive trans. I am sure there are people here on the Hamb who can help you but, if not, I can refer you to a more comprehensive Pontiac related site that may be more helpful. You can PM me if you like.
good luck with it and keep us posted on your progress.

www.pontiacheaven.org
Click to expand...

Oh its not the right swap either. I think it needs a small block ford.

I doubt that anyone makes engine swap headers specific to your application. I haven't done one but you are more than likely going to get yourself a gotcha with your steering shaft/box. No hill for a stepper but that is something that you will have to watch for.

If anyone in the world makes engine swap mounts for it it is going to be Trans Dapt. But that isn't likely.

You may contact FlamedAbone and pic his brain he has put big pontiac engines in one of everything. he can at least give you some pointers on motor mounts or what mounts are the easiest to use or fab.

55chieftain · Mar 23, 2011

An early engine (55-58) may be easier as it has the similar 3 point mounting system with the front mount under the timing cover and bolt up to the holes in the front crossmember on the frame. Or like I did put a 60 cover on my 66 389 and use the front mount that way. Otherwise side mounts will need to be made. Exhaust manifolds and the steering gearbox is a tight fit also.

I would change the gas pedal especially if your using the th-400 and find an 80's full size car that came with one and the kickdown switch is on the gas pedal assembly.

Ford-Man · Mar 23, 2011

My friend just put a 302 in an early 50's Poncho...and the steering box was fun to work around. He used the SBF motor mounts from speedway I believe...and modified the drivers side mount to clear the box. He is using the Mustang style stock headers that are more rear swept. It fits nicely.

Make sure what 389 you get if you are interested in the automatic.

cochran242 · Mar 23, 2011

Thanks guys, this is all great info.

55chieftain - The front mount sounds like a great way to do this swap! Do you have any pics of this I can see? I assume you still had to fab a rear mount\crossmember correct? Rear mount\crossmember seems a bit easier to fab anyway.

porknbeaner · Mar 23, 2011

cochran242 said: ↑

Thanks guys, this is all great info.

55chieftain - The front mount sounds like a great way to do this swap! Do you have any pics of this I can see? I assume you still had to fab a rear mount\crossmember correct? Rear mount\crossmember seems a bit easier to fab anyway.
Click to expand...

If you go the front mount route you are going to want to fab side mounts for the transmission at the bell housing. Someone is going to call that a center mount.

Another option is to build a Hurst style mount if you have a later engine that isn't using the front mount setup. It can bolt on with the timing cover bolts. That moves your supports out to the side and eliminates the need for a center mount.

But I think you have good info for an easy setup from 55Chieftain.

Oh and the rolleyes after my Ford statement was to indicate sarcasm. Just incase anyone was not aware. Maybe I should have said flathead V-8

safariknut · Mar 23, 2011

As I understand it,the V-8 Pontiac came out with in 1955 was originally slated to go in the 54 model but it was decided to wait until 55 when the all-new model was introduced.Supposedly it is nearly a drop in swap.There is the problem of converting to 12v but that shouldn't be too difficult.I would imagine a 1955-57 rear cross member(bolts in)would fit rather easily;in fact the trans is the same as the V-8 so you might not have to change it.
The only problems I can see would be the difference in length which would require the use of a longer shroud for the cooling fan.

55chieftain · Mar 23, 2011

http://www.pontiacsafari.com/MPC/Pages/page_0054.jpg

There is a bracket under the front cover that the front mounts too and goes to the frame. 55-59 is reverse cooling and has water connection to each head. The 60 cover is the only steel cover with standard cooling. Thats what i'm using with a Hurst mount.

Only having a front mount and single rear mount won't work. There will be no side to side stability. I built these to go off the back of the trans. Plus i'm using the tailshaft mount.

Side mounts aren't hard to build, initially thats what I had. 2x2 1/4" tubing welded to the frame than cut at a 45 , welded another plate for a factory frame mount to bolt to.

Something like this:

http://starchief57.tripod.com/techtips.htm#late

scootermcrad · Mar 23, 2011

Cool! Another 53/54 project to watch! YEAH!

I've got a '53 Pontiac that I'll be dropping a 389 into. I'm going to buy the adapter arrangement from Pat at Wilcap to adapt either a 700R4 or a 200-4R. Haven't decided which, but will probably go with a 700R4 because they're reasonably priced and easy to find. I will probably just make the engine and trans mounts, but that's just because I'm whacky and really like doing that sort of thing. Should be pretty straight forward and there's TONS of room for a V8 in these cars. Also planning on running the stock I-8 radiator in it's stock position since it's in good condition. Huge radiator and should offer enough cooling for the 389.

Looking forward to seeing your swap!

ROADSTER1927 · Mar 23, 2011

I had a 55 ponti 287 v8 in my 40 ponti coupe,it would be a very easy swap in your car and I do have a front mount for the engine that I have for sale. Pm me if your interested,here are some pics. We put over 9000 mi on this engine and it runs very good.Good luck Gary

ROADSTER1927 · Mar 23, 2011

I also have a 1960 389 that would be available,it is apart for inspection and looks good,it was a runner when I took it apart.

cochran242 · Mar 23, 2011

Wow, this is all really great info!

ROADSTER1927 - Does the 1960 389 have the front mount that 55chieftain mentions?

55chieftain - the mounts you show in the pic look real nice! Is there any reason you didn't just use the whole 1960 motor and instead installed the 1966?

55chieftain · Mar 23, 2011

I already built the engine for a 68 GTO I had. Those mounts were originally for a Chevy trans, I had to do some work to use them for the BOP pattern.

60 engines didn't use the front middle bracket and mount , but they will bolt up. You wouldn't want to do that on an aluminum cover.

The only downside for the 55-60 are the trans choices, or the expense of fixing them or finding someone who can do it. Wilcap and Bentsens make adapters to bolt a newer trans up. But than some rear mounts would have to be made anyway.

Could do something like this too, the 57 frame is very similar to the 54, same basic idea anyway.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=112566

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V8 swap in 54 pontiac

cochran242
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applekrate
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from Maricopa & St Johns, Arizona

345 DeSoto
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from Summer Skaneateles,NY/Winter Port St.Lucie, FL

cochran242
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from Denver

73RR
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from Peoples Republic of Oregon

porknbeaner
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from North Central Missouri

55chieftain
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Ford-Man
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from Mishawaka, IN

cochran242
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from Denver

porknbeaner
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from North Central Missouri

safariknut
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from 902 River Acres Drive Tecumseh MI 49286

55chieftain
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scootermcrad
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from Concord, NC

ROADSTER1927
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from west bend wi

Attached Files:

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55 ponti engine 002.JPG

55 ponti engine 004.JPG

55 ponti engine 006.JPG

stub job 023.JPG

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V8 swap in 54 pontiac

cochran242 Member from Denver

applekrate Member from Maricopa & St Johns, Arizona

345 DeSoto Member from Summer Skaneateles,NY/Winter Port St.Lucie, FL

cochran242 Member from Denver

73RR Member from Peoples Republic of Oregon

porknbeaner Member from North Central Missouri

55chieftain Member from Bloomington IL

Ford-Man Member from Mishawaka, IN

cochran242 Member from Denver

porknbeaner Member from North Central Missouri

safariknut Member from 902 River Acres Drive Tecumseh MI 49286

55chieftain Member from Bloomington IL

scootermcrad Member from Concord, NC

ROADSTER1927 Member from west bend wi

Attached Files:

55 ponti engine 008.JPG

55 ponti engine 002.JPG

55 ponti engine 004.JPG

55 ponti engine 006.JPG

stub job 023.JPG

ROADSTER1927 Member from west bend wi

cochran242 Member from Denver

55chieftain Member from Bloomington IL

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