Okay, this topic has been introduced in a previous thread by Craigtone, asking for advice about his specific cars and his specific cir***stance. Not surprisingly, a number of people joined in with opinions, but not so much about Craigtone's cars as about their own preferences. So, instead of hijacking Craigtone's thread, I thought it might be interesting to see how the members of our Social Group feel about keeping their vintage drive trains versus replacing them with more modern components. Okay, guys, tell us how you really feel! (PS: Remember, the '52-'56 Ford Social Group is a flame-free zone!)
You could have hijacked ... I don't mind! My 2 cents ... if you plan to DD the car, go modern. The 5.0L drivetrain is a dime a dozen, HIGHLY modifiable and gets good gas mileage. If you want a cruiser, vintage is the way to go! Everyone knows NOTHING sounds like a finely-tuned flathead! But please ... PLEASE ... whatever you do, DO NOT put a small block Chevy in a Ford! One word ... 'karma'
Uh-oh.... Hey Eric, is that a flattie I hear warmin' up in your garage? Yeah, nothing like the sound of a flattie or a Yblock! Well this one's like many other threads on the HAMB - that being a matter of personal preference. Well my preferences (no flamethrowin' - I promise ): I like different, oddball and out of the ordinary, but also like brand loyalty and I've always been one that feels "if it's a Chevy, run a Chevy, a Ford? Run a Ford". Lots of different stuff can be done using OEM pieces & parts in non-production configurations. I have a tendency to usually walk past a Ford with anything but a Ford mill in it at shows but sometimes a Caddy, Stude or a Hemi will catch my eye and I'll take a second look. Not because I don't admire the work put into the car, but just because. IMHO, SBCs (aka belly****ons) in anything but a Chevy usually don't inspire me enough to warrant a second look. But I've always been a Ford person so go figure. I think with the technology used in new parts for old engines, along with modern oils and maintenance practices we have today, the old engines are fine but I doubt I'd put one in a DD either. I'm putting a '55 Merc 292 Yblock with a Ford toploader 4 speed trans in my '56 Ford. I never really considered anything BUT a Yblock, nor did I consider a T5 or AOD trans. It's been rebuilt using NEW internal components, no NOS pieces. It's not going to be a DD but I do plan to drive it a lot. Were I to even think of running something else in it, it would likely be a 351C/400 with a toploader trans. But, nah! The Clevelands just don't "fit" me, and a '56 Ford with anything but a Y in it doesn't sound right either. MHO, not even worth 2 cents.
Well Raceron, obviously by my name I agree with you 100%. As I stated before in the other thread I believe a properly ***embled and maintained Y-Block (or Flattie) can be as dependable as a newer engine. And IMO they look better. Now a question for Missysdad. Where is your cutoff between vintage and modern drive trains? As I stated in the other thread that I am running a '57 312" in my '55 Ranchwagon with a C-4 and 8" rear, mid '70's Granada discs, etc; So as the Granada parts are newer than the engine, I would not consider them Modern. By modern are we talking 4.6/5.4 OHC fuel injected engine with EAOD trans, four wheel power anti-loc disc brakes?? Might be nice but who knows how to work on it? And that is my less than 2 cents worth, lol.
"Now a question for Missysdad. Where is your cutoff between vintage and modern drive trains? As I stated in the other thread that I am running a '57 312" in my '55 Ranchwagon with a C-4 and 8" rear, mid '70's Granada discs, etc; So as the Granada parts are newer than the engine, I would not consider them Modern. "By modern are we talking 4.6/5.4 OHC fuel injected engine with EAOD trans, four wheel power anti-loc disc brakes?? Might be nice but who knows how to work on it?" Excellent question... I guess in my opinion a "vintage" powertrain and suspension would be one that was in the same "family" as the ones original to the car. So, a flathead in a '53 would be "vintage" while swapping a Y-block into the same car would be to "modernize" it. Same with brakes. Improved drum brakes on a '53 would still be "vintage, while upgrading to disc brakes would be to "modernize" it. Etc., etc., etc... Anybody besides me want to step up and have a go at it?
Here's my two cents.... "Modern Drivetrain" means to me; dependable, replaceable anywhere, fixable anywhere, and general maintenance that doesn't require anyone to be certified to fix it no matter what motor you put in it. I plan on driving my '53 cross country and want to be able to buy an oem part anywhere. I have modernized my '53 with off the shelf parts with a book listing all the parts and their years and models they came from. Drivetrain to suspension... I have all the numbers. I also feel the book has value when time to resale. I had a car with a stock flathead and lost a water pump.... Trailer Time! I was over 400 miles from home and nowhere to buy a pump... let alone a drivers side pump! Very costly, won't happen again to a long distance driver. So.... shoot me for using a chevy in a ford.... It's my deal and it works for me. It was what I had available and the engine/transmission combination that I always used so I am very familar with this in how to set it up, plus parts are cheap and very available. I respect those guys that want vintage drivetrains, I was one of them but I'm more into getting there and getting back home. Drive em... park em.... ps... stay away from flex fans!!!!
Here's another definition you might want to consider... Modern: Anything O'Reilly's stocks parts for. Vintage: Not.
But you just contradicted yourself... First you state "a flathead in a '53 would be "vintage" while swapping a Y-block into the same car would be to "modernize" it. "Then "Modern: Anything O'Reilly's stocks parts for." I doubt O'Reilly's stocks parts for a Y-Block, but there are places that do, not to mention my own "stash"... lol. Hey I know... How about we confuse things by saying that it is 'upgraded with newer vintage parts' and use the term modern for the 4.6/5.4 and whatever GM is calling their engines these days (sorry, lost track after the 348/409's which were a truly good looking engines). genossik, I have to ask, So you want to go to the dealer to get your "buy an oem (Original Equipment Manufactured) part anywhere". Or are you going anywhere to get a rebuilt part. Big Difference. Not trying to be a hard nose, I just want to know what is consider modern?
And of course I have to add that I am moderately just tweeking you guys on purpose to get a response and maybe interest others in the converse. ha,ha. There probably not much I could buy over the counter at Pep Boy's for my Y-Block... except maybe spark plugs. But then again, it has never broke down, it was a "Modern part" that went, rear u-joint).
Speaking of such things,I bought a rear u-joint off ebay complete with straps and retainers I won't be needing since I did the 302 swap,$25 shipping included.
"ps... stay away from flex fans!!!!" You got that one right, Geno. I've had really good luck with Hayden thermal fan clutches with OEM fan blade ***emblies in the past. This is what I plan to use on my Victoria with C'vette motor. They may not be pretty, but they sure move some air...and they won't eat your radiator.
Y block... Great looking motor! To answer your question on the oem parts. I want to be able to get fuel pump, water pump, alternator, etc anywhere if one goes out. I want to be able to go to any parts house across the country to get me back on the road. I've been to the special one off parts cars before that put you on a trailer if you break. "Modern" parts are the ones you can get and not have to build or wait for shipping from a supplier. I now keep it simple to keep on the road. I'd love to have a local cruiser with a trick motor/transmission set-up and my '53 but I can only afford one at a time. My yard art rod when finished will be a local ride. It has a ford 300 six with three carbs and a three speed. check out my pics. Keep this thread going, I like it!
Genossik, I knew what you meant, I was just pulling your lariat. Actually I do have a lot of newer parts, Starter is Ford FE, one wire GM Alternator, Electric fuel pump, Pertronix ignition (the module that fits most Ford point Distributors) electric fan, etc. Drive train is all '78+ Granada, disc brakes, drive shaft, rear end. Trans is C-4. So I guess my only vintage part is the 312" which has been rebuild with all "latest technology" components.
Your motor looks too good to put in anything!!! Have you had it dyno'd, any guess as to what it makes? Just plain sweet!
Thanks for the compliments... Too late though to not put it in anything, lol. It now resides in my Ranchwagon... No dyno but it sure runs good.
Oh yeah - a clean uncluttered engine compartment - very nice! Yblock (sorry I missed your name) - what brake/booster setup are you using? My '56 has a lot of new "hang-on" parts too, alternator, distributor, fuel & water pump etc. And I'll have a box of "stuff" in the trunk when/if I take any longer trips - starter, U-joints, hoses, thermostat etc. So I guess "vintage" is the right term to use for the car itself, but with lots of "modern" components. I doubt it will be any more likely to break down than my '05 pickup with 70K miles. Lovin' this thread - almost as much fun as guessing "Barkers"! Ron
Ron, The booster/master cylinder is from a Ford Granada ('78-79 I think). Bolts on to existing holes in firewall. I have a picture somewhere? Dennis
I don't know if you saw mine (below) - I posted it earlier on another thread. I saw the small booster setup so got it. I was concerned about manifold clearance with a larger one but yours looks good.
The Jalopy Journal
