History We ALL Love a DARE! PIX of TRULY Extinct Makes?

Four Wheel Active Steering.

Here are two pictures I found of the Tyrrell p34's front suspension. The steering wheel was connected to the front suspension spindles with a front steer R&P. There is also a second steering arm mounted at the rear of the spindle which connects through a bell crank to the back spindles front steer steering arm.

 

Wow, HJ! I'm not engineer, but I would have thought there's have to be a "compensation" device planned in. Keen

 

Dawie, Now, THAT is funny, funny man !!!



Dawie (NedLudd) wrote: "Might I suggest that these are not so much extinct as unborn?" <!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

 

Don't know but the bell crank may have a slight ratio front to rear causing the rear wheels to have a slightly shorter radius. The bell crank in the pix looks like it might be a leaf of a leaf spring which may act as a self-compensator due to friction of unequal radii.

 

Maxmobile

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David Maxwell was born August 10, 1861. Orphaned at an early age he ended up in Watford, Ontario, Canada working as a blacksmith for John Baimbridge. Eventually he bought some land across the street and started his own blacksmith shop and built the building himself, which still stands today more than 120 years later. David Maxwell invented lots of things, not the least of which was one of the first cars in Canada. He built the entire car, every part, from the engine to the wheels. He built about half a dozen models and only one remains today. The car to the left is the first one. A modified buggy with a "one lung" motor and a steering tiller and "run flat" tires. Yes, way ahead of his time.

http://themaxmobile.com
​

 

Looks like we have created another discussion regarding vehicles with 6 or more wheels. Neil Ludd has created a new thread titled Six-wheeled rods an customs?

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=420887

 

Well, I guess that's pretty cool. Anyway, from the "thread" of 6-wheel conversation here, I ALMOST get the impression that (like steam and electric vehicles), maybe 6-wheel passenger cars may again have their day!!!

Maybe we should shift on to extinct and near-extinct cars, eh? Like the MAXmobile?

 

Acme

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The '''Acme''' was a model of chain-driven touring car made by the Reber Manufacturing Co. in Reading, Pennsylvania, from 1903 to 1911.

The company was founded in 1892 by James C. Reber to make bicycles. The Acme was preceded by the Reber which was manufactured in 1902–03 and was powered by a vertical-twin engine The first Acmes also had twin-cylinder engines but were soon followed by Internal combustion engine (four-cylinder) models and in 1909 by a six-cylinder. The 1909 Vanderbilt Six featured overdrive fourth gear.

The company went into receivership in 1906, and its last cars were made in 1911. The factory was sold to Herbert M. Sternbergh, Robert E.Graham, and Fred Van Tine,which continued making some of the range until 1915. Then the line was sold to Phianna, which moved production to Newark, New Jersey.

 

Only time will tell what the future might bring in the automotive world. I'm sure the next 25 to 50 years is going to bring drastic changes.

I would think that we have already included near-extinct cars as a lot of the makes we've discussed here, many have never heard of. I've been in this hobby since the mid 50's and even I'm coming up with ones I've never heard of before like the Maxmobile.

 

I would presume that some of the Minnesota made makes pictured here are truly extinct. From Left to Right;

1. Acme or M.B. 22

Interesting that this list claims Acme as Minnesota made and Wikpedia claims it was made in Pennsylvania.

2. Owatonna Motocycle
3. Bjella
4. Renville
5. Stickney Steam Automobile
6. Dan Patch "Torpedo"
7. Luverne Runabout
8. Brasie Packet
9. Pridemore
10. Kato Car
11. Ware
12. Pan
13. Wolfe

 

SunRoffCord: Yup, RE Post 554, I am pretty surprised that SO many ALMOST-unheard-of makes are coming out here (importantly with LOCATIONS of manufacture, etc.).

Maybe like YOU, this thread has made ME see the whoel EARLY auto industry in a bit of a new light. Sure, I knew the early "geniuses," I just didn't know HOW MANY there really were. Some ended up "mass" producing cars; SOME built a FEW, yet contributed breakthroughs that contributed DIRECTLY to the sucess of the big mass producers and minor makes, as well.

 

There was a sort of steam revival in the USA during the '20s, and a bunch of small manufacturers sprung up offering mostly conventional-looking steamers, e.g. American Steam Car, American Steamer, Alena, Brooks, Coats, Davis, Endurance, Trask-Detroit, etc. Some of these might indeed be extinct.

Some of these began specifically to service later Stanleys after Stanley closed down in 1924. Some even used Stanley-design running gear under coachwork from other cars.

The last Stanleys were quite respectable cars, incidentally. Here's a 735 coupe that I think would make a cool rod, especially if it kept steam power:

 

early Helica: 1913 design.

This is a three-wheeled two-seater. Note the complete absence of any guard for the propellor; it is difficult to believe this would have been street-legal. The engine appears to be a V-twin.






This four wheeler still exists though.
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Isn't' that an earlier Detroit Electric body on a Stanley Chassis? Formerly part of the Pollard Collection. Personally, I feel it would be a crime to rod that.

 

Now that you mention it ... Detroits were centre-door, with three side windows: but look at the cowl. That could indeed be the remains of the panel below the foremost side window of a Detroit. And I agree, I wouldn't rod that specific car, but use it as a model for a new build - if it weren't for at least two levels of legislation!

I wonder how many 735s were rebodied. Originals one sees all tend to be open tourers.

 

I'm glad you all brought up STEAM-powered automobiles again, since it is, obviously, a viable automotive, et.al., technology currently on the fringes of modern-day popularity.

My own perception is that both STEAM and ELECTRIC, for a respectable time, held some advantages over troublesome early internal-combustion cars. In its better seasons, the Stanley outsold any other U.S. car make, followed by electric cars. But, as gasoline engines became easier to operate, more reliable AND more affordable, they overtook steamers and electrics in popularity. Not coincidentally, Kettering's electric starter and Henry-Ford pricing made gas-powered cars more than competitive with steam and electric. E.g., if a Stanley cost $4,000, and even a fancy Model T cost $400, you can see where many buyers would flock to.

So, all this is NOT to say that there was anything flawed in steam or electric vehicles. Not at all! It's simply that gas cars improved dramatically and surpassed steam and electric in the market place.

As regards steam, SPEED was a real consideration early on! Stanley set a speed record in 1906 which stood for 103 years. This certainly speaks well of early steam technology, Stanley's in particular! However, I feel technical development for Stanley stagnated after the Stanley twins, then 70 years old, sold the company in 1917. (As a side note, the brothers made three fortunes in their time!)

The Stanley steam car finally huffed in 1924, but sales had been in decline, due to the tech and market factors mentioned. Dawie correctly points out the resurgence of steam in the early '20s. And, also correctly, he attributes this to a market need for maintaining, and/or replacing, Stanley cars. This, as opposed to a "renaissance" in steam. In fact, of the numerous companies cited, only American Steam Car (1924-1931) stayed around more than a few years. Actually, most lasted only a year or two!

It seems ironic to me that probably THE best steam car, the Doble, is barely a footnote in car history. The eccentric Dobles developed superior steam technology but spent so much time perfecting their creations, they sold relatively few -- and at rather stiff prices. The Doble steam cars deserve a chapter all their own, but I'm going to stop with that nutshell version, at present.

RE the THEME of this thread -- EXTINCT & NEAR-EXTINCT CARS -- I surely agree with Dawie about rarity of most of the new steam makes debuting in the early '20s! Just a couple of examples: American Steamer, 1922-1924, 16-20 built; Alena, 1922, only 2 made; Davis, 1921, a single prototype, probably nonexistent today; and Coats & Endurance (the first gave rise to the second), 1921-1924, total of 2 cars built.

ABOUT AS SCARCE AS A LIVE DODO BIRD, EH?

 

As regards steam, SPEED was a real consideration early on! Stanley set a speed record in 1906 which stood for 103 years.

1905 Stanley Model E Gentlemen's Speedy Roadster​

 

In August when the British group broke the 103-year-old Stanley record, HAMBer Rich Fox started a thread that led to a spirited discussion, plus a lot of facts & data. Worthwhile read, if you search "British Sream car gets Stanley record." [sic]

Fron Wikipedia, a pic of the 1906 Stanley record-setter,
as well as the car's 1907 fate:

 

The other 2 wheeled vehicles reminded me of this.

The one and only Foo Car

OK, not extinct, not a real model either. from Smokey Stover comic for those that don't know.

 

Completely EXTINCT is a bit hard, this thread would be short and boring........like some men I know.

This company still exists, but one time, they actually made cars; especially race cars. Good luck finding any information online, I had to get these from the Case dealer I worked for and have never been able to get anything on a civilian site. Note the CASE across one grill, and the Eagle on top of the Globe on another....all CASE trademarks, and the race car's name? JAY-EYE-SEE? Jerome Increase Case, also the same name of their race horse during the civil war.

 

Brandy wrote: "Completely EXTINCT is a bit hard, this thread would be short and boring........like some men I know.

Jimi: Brandy, best laugh I've had all day, my friend! I will resist the temptation for punsterism.

As for TRULY extinct, I knew I'd have to defend that wording. I needed to say that, 'cause people would OTHERWISE be bringing up the YUGO and silly shit like that, ya know? Every now & then, I remind posters of the dictionary DIFF between the terms DEFUNCT and EXTINCT. And most people go, oh, YEAH, THAT's right!

So, e.g., the Vermont-made WASP may be DEFUNCT (no longer in business), but examples of the WASP do exist in museums, in Bennington, VT, and in Tupelo, MS, so NOT extinct. (BTW, the propeller on the radiator caps of some Wasps was an interesting touch!)

In OTHER cases, some cars brought up on this thread LITERALLY are extinct! NONE exist. Speaking from MY perspective, I'd hope to get solid info about an EXTINCT car make (there were AT LEAST 500 makes in the U.S. prior to 1930!). And if LUCKY, a PHOTO of a non-surviving car make might survive, even though the CAR did not.

And, SO, it's been a fun thread! Sure, I HAVE had to ASK people to go back and DIG to find out if some make they mentioned had a surviving orphan car remaining in existence. This is NOT a thread for lazy researchers! Guys & gals seem to like the guidelines, and we just KEEP coming up with NEAR-extinct and TRULY EXTINCT names!!! Cool.

This reminds me: I MUST go back through this huge thread and do an update SUMMARY of the EXTINCT, NEAR-EXTINCT & SUPER-RARE makes discussed so far!!! Thanks for the JOLT, gal!!!

Dear God! I LOVE the HAMB!

The CASE you brought up is a PERFECT CASE-in-point, Brandy!!! YOU brought great info AND PIX to the table! I wish everybody could be like you! THANKS! -- Jimi

 

I'm a history major,so automobile and tractor history is EASY for me considering my lifestyle and work choices. However, living in California, and going to a VERY liberal university, give me plenty of ammunition to piss off my "GO GREEN" liberal professors. (I ALMOST said hinder instead of ammunition.......but that's not true, I fire back at them constantly.)

Those CASE cars are amazing, as is the race cars. If any one in Racine knows more, I'd love to hear it. But like I said, it was a private dealer only website linked directly to CASE and you had to have a dealer number and password just to see the history tab. Ridiculous to keep such history under such strict wraps!

 

Fascinating. I never knew that there was a Davis steam car. I wonder if the prototype was by George Davis or yet another Davis person. It's interesting that no one has brought up Jay Leno who has a big interest in steam cars and has a Doble in his collection.

This is an article by Jay Leno describing his steam driven Doble auto and comparing it a bit to the Stanley Steamer. This is from May 2003.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/automotive/sub_coll_leno/1302916.html?page=1&c=y

 

<b><big></big></b>Milburn Electric

George Milburn (1820-1883) was born in Alston, England (June 3, 1820), from where he emigrated to Canada. After but a short residence in Canada, he moved to Goshen, Indiana, in 1835. Soon after marrying Miss Barbara Stauffer of Goshen on April 8, 1841, they located upon Bone Prairie in Kosciusko County and engaged in farming. In 1846, they moved to a farm in St. Joseph County, about three miles southeast of Mishawaka, Indiana. In 1847, Milburn brought his family to Mishawaka, Indiana. A daughter, Ann, became the wife of Clement Studebaker.

In 1848, Milburn started George Milburn Co., which owned a prosperous general store at the corner of Main and Vistula Streets. He invested money in the Mishawaka Hydraulic Co. and bought a one-third interest in James Oliver's first plow company. On August 23, 1869, the Milburn Wagon Company was incorporated, with a capital of $100,000. Milburn also owned a hotel and a city block, and still had the Joseph County farm land.

In 1873, George Milburn moved the the complete operation of the wagon company to Toledo, Ohio. The factory opened in the spring of 1875 and soon became the largest manufacturer of farm wagons in the world. The Milburn Wagon Works, with its completely mechanized production, required workers only to operate the machines.

In late September of 1914, the Milburn Wagon Company began the manufacture of their 1915 Milburn Light Electric automobiles, based on a design by Karl Probst, who later designed the Bantam Jeep. During their eight years of production, from 1915 to 1923, they turned out over 4,000 cars.

The 1915 Milburn Light Electric Coupe (Model 15) sold for $1,485 and the Roadster (Model 151) for $1,285; both were built on the same chassis with a 100-inch wheelbase. The Milburn was the lowest-priced electric of the time and much lighter than its competition. The 1915 Milburn had four forward speeds and two reverse speeds. It had a range of about 50 miles on a charge and could attain a speed of about 15 MPH as a Coupe and about 19 MPH as a Roadster.

In 1916, Milburn introduced a Brougham and, in 1917 added a Touring style (advertised as a Limousine or a Town Car) to the line; this style featured an open front driving position and an enclosed rear passenger compartment (also with a driving position, as noted below). Also offered was a Light Delivery truck style for $985 (with various bodies for it starting at $100), discontinued after the 1918 model year.

In 1918, Milburn offered a Sedan that looked more like its gasoline-burning competition and which boasted a top speed of 30 MPH and a range of 100 miles on a charge. Also in 1918, Milburn put the batteries in wheeled boxes to facilitate rapid exchange of spent batteries for charged ones at central power exchanges.

The Coupe or Brougham driver controlled steering and speed by levers (tillers) which hinged down onto the lap of the driver from the left side. The Roadster and the Sedan had steering wheels, and the Limousine had both kinds of steering, a wheel up front and a tiller in the rear.

In 1920, Milburn produced a taxicab. At some point Milburn also produced a line of electric trucks -- a &#65533; ton chassis selling for $1,585 (Model 43) and a 1 ton chassis for $1,985 (Model 40). The buyer could select from a full line of cab and bed styles at various prices to complete the truck according to their needs.

The Milburn plant was destroyed by fire in 1919, with losses totaling $900,000, including 30 completed electrics and even more automobile bodies. In January, 1920, production continued in a building on the grounds of Toledo University. In 1921, Milburn Wagon Company capitalization was increased to $1 million; at that time, the company's 800-man workforce was comprised of 200 men building cars and 600 building automobile bodies, largely for Oldsmobile. In February, 1923, General Motors purchased the plant for $2 million; Milburn workers remained in the plant for the two months following, finishing up cars and bodies previously under contract. Then, Buick moved in and the Milburn Electric was no longer produced.

The Milburn Electrics were among the most popular and elegant cars of the time and were used by President Woodrow Wilson's secret service men. President Wilson, himself, owned a 1918 Milburn Electric, which he drove around the White House grounds.


The pictures are of a 1916 Milburn taken at the AACA Central National Meet in Prior Lake Mn this past June

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I could very well be part of a Detroit Body, the back half maybe. I've attached a picture of a Detroit Electric under restoration taken in July 2009. I also feel it would be a crime to rod something like this. I love all cars and to me, there are some that you just don't rod.

 

SunRoofCord, if ya read the whole thread, you'll SEE I and others have referenced Jay's GREAT interest in cars, including a SPECIAL interest in the steam cars.

 

Brandy, I LIKE you, because you are LIVING your life, not just drifting along through it. I say this because I've lived a life, and I have always watched, questioned, wondered.

Hell, you better get on over there to the junkyard PIX thread. As thoughtful and "in touvh" as you are, I am sure you can get in touch with the non-secular yet "spiritual" aspect of seeing REALLY old cars, just being reclaimed by Mother Nature. Walking (in this case, vicariously through photos) through an old-time auto junkyard is pretty much like walking through a human cemetery. In a few words on a tombstone, you can READ a lot more into a person's existence. LIKEWISE, when you SEE the old war horse cars in their decline, THEY talk to you, too. Many guys, understandably, look for something to "bring back,' and THAT is respectable and part of us 'rodders' passion.

But, some cars are just TOO far gone to save. You feel sympathy, as you would for one of those old, sway-back horses "put out to pasture." Empathy might not be an inapplicable term. HAMBer "The Dude" expressed the feeling well when he said to me: "Sometimes, it's better to leave things as they are."

As far as CASE, now, they are the same company that went on just to specialize in HEAVY equipment (bull dozers, etc.), correct?

 

I have to agree with SunRoof Cord. As much as I love to see a cool 'rod, I think a great ORIGINAL car coming out of a garage or barn, well, a person needs to think twice about the "restore-or-rod" decision.

 

http://www.american-automobiles.com/Badger.html
The badger was a car built in the small city of Columbus Wisconsin. I actually was in the old factory there and it's an antiques mall now. None of these cars exist and a local oldtimer told me that he remembers them as having transmissions which would break. In my home town of Milwaukee there were over 40 firms which had at one time tried building cars. You never see any of the Milwaukee automobiles as most are gone, but one, a Schloemer, resides in the Milwaukee County Public Museum.
Some of the Milwaukee makes:
Ogren
Petrel
Schloemer
Lafayette...a Nash bodied car built in Milwaukee instead of Kenosha
Eclipse
There are more that I will post later. You've undoubtedly heard of the company called Johnson Controls? In the beginning of the 20th Century they also were a car company. They made the Auto-Carriage, Elite, Empress.

 

Case was established in 1895 with steam engine threshers, and became the first to have a gasoline powered, all steel thresher. Later they became a construction company, and then bought International to become Case IH and Case.




I have to say, their cars looked FAR better than their ag. equipment!