When did we all become restorers?

There was a jazz player that said "you can't break the rules till you know what they are."

 

Jim, I think I know what you are talking about. Not "restoring" as back to original factory, but more like, restoring to a specific era. I get tired of "can't have a hot rod with radials, it's just not right", or "that knob on the dash just isn't right", or "what you really need to do is........". In the past, we either used what we could afford, or the best that was available at the time. Build what you like. Screw the rest. Besides in a few years, trends will probably change, then you won't have to "restore" it again to the latest whims.

 

To be true to the forum. Isn't this the basis of the forum? There are a lot of sites on old cars. What makes this one different.... I wonder.

 

This is a free country and no one should dictate to you what you can can't or want to build ever. You shouldnt listen to them unless you value their opinion. What can happen though is if and when you want or need to share a schizophrenic old car on a traditional board,,, well you'll get those replies. Some come from a genuine good heart to help you get it into the traditional line. They think you brought it here to be traditional right? Some come from the critic, some from the troll.

This is the Hamb, dedicated to traditional hot rods and customs. There's only one like it.

I believe Ryan welcomes anything youve built that he can somehow squeeze into the general guidelines.

If you want to build a factory Five with a viper engine and 22" wheels with rubber band tires - man go for it with all you have. But you can't bring it here, editorial. Want to buy a new hellcat or ctsv and deck it out for bonneville? Man go for that too.
Want to build an air cleaner carb scoop out of a mailbox because you have it and can , do that too. But it will get burned off of here. Not because it is not cool or cutting edge but because its not in the guide lines.

 

Bingo, I think this is what JimSibley is questioning. And I strongly agree with you last statement!

 

Sounds like one man's twin overhead cam four banger is a Frontenac ( accepted) and another man's is a Quad four ( excepted) , both hooked to a t5 and a banjo rearend. One is loved, as it should be, the other called a , for shame, street rod.......


p.s. Fronty's are really expensive on a poor man budget......No build thread for me.

 

That is so perfectly said. Having worked the gate at a show with criteria for several years, this is the one point that I wish everyone who came, understood.

 

I feel I'm one of the restorer types being talked about in this thread, so I thought I would give you guys some insight into at least why I am doing my build like this.

I work on new complicated cars all day long. It tires me. Having grown up in the computer era(my dad had a 286,MFer cost 5g's back in the eighties) technology kinda bores me. It's everywhere and it ****s....Yes I realize the irony of me posting this on a website.

My interest in life lie much further beyond just "hot rod", I enjoy history and quality American made products. Brands built to last. I try to live a much simplier life than a lot of my peers. I don't need tons of new electronics and gadgets to make me happy. I keep my commute short to keep myself sane. I dress in vintage quality American clothes because they are built to last. The other part is to capture the aesthetics of a time period I truely love. a lot of that love is centered around the cars. because of that I want to truely capture the experience of driving a vehicle exactly "how it was". Building something half way, wouldn't satisfy this urge. I want to experience using my old model A everyday. I put 3-4 thousand miles on it in 9 months when it was together and will rack up plenty more when it is done. I want it how it was, so as to better understand and latter justify the street rod I will build myself when I get old and my back hurts.

I know a Hopped up Model A isn't very Hot Rod these days, and most consider it rather tame, But what you gotta realize and respect. Is that these things were King back when this all started. You gotta realize just how much a 80hp model A scared the general public..... Those damn hoodlums racing around in there hopped up jalopies terrorizing the good citizens of this fair nation.... These things were practically the fastest things on the road in their day. You have to respect that.

I think as long as you are building something and having fun, I can enjoy it. Take Jim Sibley's orange car for example. Not built to my taste, but F-me, it's built nice. And it's certainly got "the look" and I bet Jim loves it. It would be boring if we all built the same cars. I'd rather see his car parked next to mine, than a car that looks exactly the same.

So I guess what I am saying is traditional inspired, Period perfect, or wild crazy blur the lines build, just build it to the best of your abilities and the results will speak for itself. I personally love those cars that are completely different than my personally taste, but are built with such skill and p***ion that you can't help but enjoy.

So I guess to sum it up, get out there and build something with some p***ion and the rest will follow.

 

I totally get what Jim is talking about. The real hard core guys here definitely have a restorer's at***ude. They search far and wide for obscure speed parts, WW2 era switches, run obsolete engines, bias ply tires, and many criticize anyone who deviates from using 70+ year old parts in a build. Nothing wrong with what they so, and that is the aim of the HAMB, but they offer no leeway in choices, just like serious restorers at Pebble Beach.
I've run both sides of the argument. I've restored muscle cars, and a couple older vehicles. And this mentality is the same as when I built the Kopper Kart. VERY strict adherence to the "rules", i.e., using the right parts, the right way, according to formula, thought this time it wasn't a stock vehicle, but a radical custom one. We did take advantage of using modern paint on it, but other than that, it's pretty much just like it was in 1958.
As a builder of customs for myself and others, though I pretty much adhere to sticking to doing the exterior of the car era correct, but I like to drive my cars, long and hard, and I also like mine and my customers to be safe driving them. So modern drivelines and disc brakes are pretty much standard in these builds. I also enjoy AC and a good radio, so I add them. But if you take a picture of the car, it should contain all the cues, and styling of a car from the 40's or 50's, using all the correct parts that would have been use. I do trty to do things a bit differently, try to be creative and use parts they could have used, but perhaps weren't popularly done.
I also build modern type customs, and enjoy the creativity that allows, even when I build an older custom to modern looks. I plan on doing my 50 Chevy sedan delivery like this, with some very different body mods, and a high tech driveline. There's room for all this in our hobby! We just need to remember where we are (on the HAMB) and the focus here, and it's definitely for traditional cars only!
(I do have one pet peeve, though, and that is when guys get all crazy about deciphering body tags, original paint, and worrying about what color the original wheel wells were on his 56 Dodge 4 door.....damn...this is for hot rods and cusotms, who cares what it was like stock!!!!)

 

Cormcobcoupe, now that's kool and looks like no heat like my wagon.lol.Bruce.

 

Smoked1 OH YEA lol.Bruce.

 

Now that captures it about right! Just about the same way as working on these cars - some days you have it, other times you come back out in the morning and look at your work and say 'WTF was I thinking!' - and redo it.

 

Tell that to the judge at night court.

This thread has gone off on a tangent like so many threads like this do (I helped ). Part of the reason is that the OP didn't clarify what he meant by 'restorer" and we (each and every one) have added our own meaning to it. Maybe the non-clarification of restorer was by design, it has given everyone a chance to say what they feel.

Good reading anyway.

 

Jim, I completely see your point.

When the board "refocused" its focus I saw more comments toward that direction. Recently a poster had voiced something similar in saying he was tired of the How To Build A Bishop/Tardel copies, to which Ryan responded with the Another Black One blog post...

I think this thread is what the guy was thinking.

If a guy comes in with a Littleman-type build but doesn't have the reputation of Littleman, he may get shunned from the board nowadays. If a guy with your skill-set (who am I kidding?) were to come here and resurrect a piece of rust into a Hot-Wheels-esque hot rod like your orange flip top car there may actually be some resistance to that until the "old guard" stepped up with support.

However and on the other hand, since the refocusing, I do still see glimpses of originality. Look at what guys like Andy Kohler or Mark Skipper have been coming up with. These guys aren't trying to be anything but thesmselves - from how I see it. And, they've both come up with some pretty amazing cars, of late.

 

I agree with Jim to a point. I would not for instance if I was building a '30s style car throw a Boss 302 in it and expect everyone not to notice.

We have an edge on the board the way that it is set up now, it is divided into categories, traditional rods, traditional customs Hokey ***ed Message Board etc. It is not likely that I will ever own or build anything that would fit into any of the traditional categories as I am not a purest when it comes to my builds, but I am still obsessed with obsolete enough that if someone says they have a '57 GMC what is the best suspension under it that I will still suggest the suspension that it came with.

I am interested in other things aside from traditional by the way, like for instance Coyote engines, and old motor cycles, but my old bikes don't have a place here and if I ever had a chance to build something with a Coyote engine in it I would not post it here. Some stuff is just too cool for school but that doesn't mean that it is within the scope of this particular board.

 

Just one question, you guys that say "I built mine to drive" as an excuse for why you built a street rod.

Do you think we are building our periid perfect cars to not drive them?

Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Good point.
There are a few high rollers on here that I know don't build a car that is getting driven for more then on and off the trailer but for the most part we drive what we build and if we build it to a specific period it is a period car that gets driven. A lot of the fellas don't even own a second car so what they build is what they drive.

 

There's more to it than just that... Twenty years ago I was one of those guys that drove what he built, usually as my daily driver. Now, with various physical limitations that have come from age, a side-of-the-road thrash isn't something I can do anymore so reliability is foremost on my mind. And where you live makes a difference too; if you live someplace where help isn't far away, that's one thing. But live in the sticks with spotty or no cel service and few houses, that's a bit different. Don't get me wrong; anyone who can build a period-perfect rod is to be admired, but in terms of practicality you're almost always at a disadvantage to more modern vehicles in 'normal' traffic.

 

Two words: Brian B***.

He builds stuff using old parts, era specific parts, describe it as you will....BUT he still manages to be creative and put his spin on it. There are others too.

Not everyone has the same vision, tools, skills or access to parts, BUT that doesn't mean the bar of expectation should be lowered just so everyone can flop over it.

On the other hand, if you like cars built in a style that was the way things were done 70 years ago, I don't see a problem with that. I thought that was the point of this board? If you like the Ray Brown roadster and want to build one just like it, except maroon, why not? It was a real hot rod. It raced. It was driven on the street. It looks good. Why try to make it different if that's what you really like? Not every nut exact necessarily, but in spirit. Who said it was everyone's duty to build a 'different' car?

The people who build clones of movie props certainly don't suffer from that dilemma.

 

Built to drive is a very broad relative term. I'm thinking a new thread could be started on what anyones idea or definition of built to drive is based on.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Unless you are starting a thread here is my opinion on what built to drive means:

Get in it any day any time and go any place. Anything I own gets driven or ridden daily and if I get a call from any place in the US and need to be there as long as there is gas money I am on my way.

 

Don't want to hi-jack this thread,just saying for some it's dependability ,comfort,distance. Others may have their own ideas of what makes it a driver .


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Every OEM built car was built to be a daily driver in its day no?

 

Yes oem cars where built for everyday use but didn't work everyday either. Warranty? 90 days. Not uncommon to find a old car with 60,000 miles on it. That's as far as they went and where parked for guys like us later.

 

Daily driver, yes, drive cross country? Depends what your needs are, that's all I'm saying.
In my travels I see plenty of what appears to be drivers on trailers for one reason or another.
Evidently they prefer to haul it. To each their own.


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

I caught a (very) little flak on my '59 T'bird build here for planning keeping the bumpers, which are heavily cut up, modified and fitted to the body, the body color rather than chrome from the traditional police. I care not. The car is an old custom, but it is MY old custom, built in the 80's in sort of a "Pro-Touring" style, and I'm keeping a little of that, and blending it with a LITTLE bit of more traditional custom . The bumpers to me are more rolled pans than bumpers, the fit now is the same as the door/hood gaps,as opposed to the original fit of within about an inch or more, so they look right to me body color, and I'm the only one who's opinion counts. ;-)

 

Well I think I figured this out. My coupe was built as a hot rod in the early eightys by some heavy hitters on the west coast. I am trying to keep it as it was built so when something wears out I am replacing it with an identical new part.. So am I a hotrod restorer?............................

 

Of course not, most who build their cars want to and expect to drive them. I'm putting the stock heater in mine, because I had 2 cars without defrost and I'm using electric wipers because I had a30,40,50,41 and 57 that had vacuum. Some of those were just used cars. I know a lot of you remember when it was very difficult to get cars with different make engines insured. It seems about that time the term S****x rod became widely used and that seemed to help with the insurance thing somewhat. I always thought I had a Hot Rod, even though there was a time that I didn't shout it out.
I get the traditional rod forum philosophy and I like it; "I built it to drive" is as good an excuse as any.

 

You don't need to justify it to me, I'm not questioning what's right for someone else. And I don't mean anything derogatory by saying "street rod", I was more just getting at, that when guys build a street rod and then say"oh, well I built it to drive" as a reason it's not period correct or whatever. To me that says that you don't think I drive mine, or that my car isn't built to drive. I'm not saying my car is more reliable than something with modern parts. That would be foolish. I'm just saying that it's "built to drive" just as much as yours is. Unreliable old parts and all.

 

Hitchhiker, I'm with you.

I'm starting my first true era correct build because I wanted a car with that floating down the road feel, the bench seat you slide across on attempted hard cornering, the bias ply tires with a mind of their own... I get it, and I plan on driving the wheels off mine when I finish it...